Comments on: Does government have a role in the 21st century? http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/ Sun, 28 Jul 2013 14:34:09 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: DunaDad http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3733 Wed, 06 Jun 2012 20:57:01 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3733 If the argument of the super rich were true wages would not have decreased 7% since 1992. If this were true the “capital sector” would be creating hundreds of thousands of job a month given that their taxes have been so low historically for the last 12 years. Services to the general public that are provided by a general cost sharing through taxation are being cut while corporations and “unearned” income is treated unfairly preferentially. Voodoo Economics has not worked and we have 30 years of history to support this.

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By: ProfitProphet http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3732 Wed, 06 Jun 2012 17:56:58 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3732 There is an inherent flaw in both suggested models. Ultimately, if we are to work towards a system whereby we integrate the IT systems available into the decision making mechanisms once occupied by government then we are governed by those in control of the large IT firms. One cannot escape the prose of Orwell in this regard. Politicians are elected, albeit, by and large from priviledged background, wherby education is non-discretely adhered to by the letter and delivers financial reward to those who successfully get to the top of their political careers. For the rest of us however, we are left frustrated, at the whim of successful capitalists. This is not a humanistic approach that most human beings would wish to belong to. There is an inherent battle for survival, built into our genetics, that primes us for competition, though, surely, in the paradigm of existentialism, we should be looking to co-exist with one another and work interdependently to forward each and every individuals goals. I cannot see how this would not include further advancements in the voting system, to include statutory weekly voting rights for all above the age of 16. We could do this in a similar fashion to teletext, online even, where all questions are pre-checked for full independence from loaded language. Needless to say that those who have exhausted much of their own lives chasing a high level political career, would scoff at this assertion, however, it is indeed quite a presumption to make, to suggest that an ‘inner circle’ of minds is anymore proficient at making the ‘right’ decision on a weekly basis, then ALL citizens over the age of 16. If we are indeed to make the transition to a more equitable position, then we should look to implement the technology sooner, rather than later. My only fear is that this will require watchdogs of watchdogs, in order to ensure the process is not open to abuse by those sat with the biggest bank balances or those individuals so set in their ways to ever allow for this to happen.

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By: postfattism http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3731 Wed, 06 Jun 2012 16:36:12 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3731 What has always thrown me about these arguements that taxes “remove money from the economy” is that they are patently false. This has been one of the few articles that I’ve read that posits a more nuanced position…the question of whether or not it can be invested better is a much easier way to sell traditionally conservative notions of personal investment vis a vis government spending. It also isn’t as if the money doled out via entitlements or other programs is burnt when it is spent, it makes its way out into the economy.

However, it seems that it isn’t a true apple to apple comparison to see if growth occurs more for public spending vs. private investment…no one person has the same responsibilities or clout as a government.

Government is able to fulfill those roles that no one entity is neither large nor risk-averse enough to contemplate. From the examples in the article (the internt from a DARPA project and the spillover of GPS into the civilian market) to the benefits of space exploration, you have to take the good with the percieved bad.

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By: possibilianP http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3719 Tue, 05 Jun 2012 18:28:46 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3719 T.J. Rodgers and his kind have absolutely no idea how economies work. A dollar spent (let’s just say “given”) to the poor will be spent in its entirety. That means 100 cents on the dollar immediately goes back into the economy as someone else’s INCOME. That’s right, spending = income. A dollar given to a rich folk, however, might be saved or invested, and the investment part might take years to materialize. In any event just a 10% saving rate means his group only returns 90 cents on the dollar back into the economy. One reason the bank bailouts didn’t work so well is that much of the money was put aside, and this is the very reason why trickle-down economics isn’t nearly as effective as Keynesian economics in stimulating an economy. As Krugman has pointed out, a government program to get citizens to arm themselves against space aliens would have been more effective than the top-down stimulation we had. An economy is an eco-system, and as such all participants play a role. Rich investors are like bears, and poor folk are like salmon. Both parties are part of an eco-system, but the bears are in worse shape without salmon than salmon are without bears.

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By: saechiu http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3703 Tue, 05 Jun 2012 03:29:51 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3703 Agree with Nilekani’s view that we need to help reinvent the governments to make the livelihood of the people better by, for example, his idea of creating global public goods that will benefit the citizens.
On taxes, I think I see it like tips. How much tip am I prepared to give? I personally would think somewhere around 10-15% is what I am prepared to pay. And this should apply to the rich or the not so rich as long as they are above the poverty line.

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By: Adam_S http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3694 Mon, 04 Jun 2012 20:33:28 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3694 Nilekani nails it at the end of the article. Brilliant insight. So many ueber capitalists like to forget the fact that govt is what creates a stable economic system with strong property rights, and legal recourse when things go awry. Although I assume its implied, Conrad sure doesn’t sound like he’s giving govt it’s due in creating an environment where he and others can get really, really rich.

Moreover, while *some* of it trickles down, capital moves by large scale investors such as those described above don’t always hit the target, either. If these investors are investing in high tech companies that pay good wages, but only pay good wages to 150 people, or if the investor opens a new, large, low priced retail outlet, but all the jobs pay $10/hr and offer no benefits, that’s not necessarily the boon they’d like us to think it is.

It is inevitable that we’re going to climb out of this dep/rec/whatever-ession a more unequal society than when we fell into it, but blanket statements by people like Rodgers and Conrad need some context and tempering.

There is a point where the govt literally taking your money and giving it to your neighbor b/c he ‘needs’ it more than you is actually beneficial to you, as well.

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By: pkg18 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3693 Mon, 04 Jun 2012 17:34:00 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3693 Freeland really shows her anti-democratic bias in this piece.

She, like for most of her sociopathic, Republicon brethren, believes that rule by the wealthy few is the best possible of all models. It’s a vision of the government as a business – free of choice, free of voice and free of freedom.

Everything and everybody in lock step working toward the common goal of profit for the shareholder.

This is the proto-fascist vision of the Republicon. It is an evil vision. It is anti-democratic and needs to be pushed to the margins of our social discourse where it belongs.

I’ll leave Ms. Freeland with this question: Why not leave our democracy and move to country that better suits her proto-fascist ideology – say China or Singapore? Why stay here and destroy our delicate democracy?

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By: Bitwise http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3692 Mon, 04 Jun 2012 15:38:32 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3692 The title of this article left out the one true and correct choice…”Get out of the way.”

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By: snikmij10 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3691 Mon, 04 Jun 2012 12:45:00 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3691 Agree with Edward Conard somewhat. At least he’s making his money work.

I wonder about other rich people who haven’t a clue what to do with there wealth (they may have inherited), who either sit on it or buy lavish properties or holiday around the world. Perhaps those who invest there money in there country should pay less tax while those who do not pay more.

Especially agree with the point that governments do not know how to allocate money, they seem more interested in spending other peoples money.

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By: mbrmark http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/2012/05/31/does-government-have-a-role-in-the-21st-century/#comment-3681 Sun, 03 Jun 2012 16:53:21 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/chrystia-freeland/?p=1652#comment-3681 The arrogant always assume they can run the world and their country better, especially if they disagree with the political philosophy adopted. However, I would be very loathe to see the depths of poverty created by people such as Conard. The welfare state would cease to exist yet Conrad would welcome that, the poverty and inequality of the USA would be the worst the world has seen since the feudal times. He obviously sees no worth in the world of the nation state that he does not control, yet a little reading of history would show the gains made by the modern world. Gains that would be lost if arrogant people such as he had their way.
Nileani seems to be a far more intelligent person, and his views would benefit humanity far more than the retrograde views of people like Conard.

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