Comments on: What failed in Pakistan won’t work in Egypt http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/ Fri, 31 Jul 2015 03:37:49 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: MazherMehboob http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2998 Thu, 22 Aug 2013 15:04:43 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2998 The seeds of conflict, envy and rivalry were sowed before Islam, between the two clans of Quresh, Banu Hashim and Banu Ummaya. The Conflict remains even after Islam to the present day. The envy leads to create, two biggest sects of Islam, Shia and Sunni and now the dysfunctional states and societies in Middle East and some parts of South Asia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hashemite
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umayyads
http://www.maaref-foundation.com/english  /library/pro_ahl/imam02_hasan/the_life_ of_imam_hasan/03.htm

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By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2959 Tue, 06 Aug 2013 22:07:09 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2959 @FurbianSenior,

Most would interpret yous suggestion that the U.S. spend money saved “on it’s poor” as handing out fish rather than teaching to fish. You’re likely old enough to appreciate the benefits of clarity and the dangers of lazy thinking and sloppy writing.

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By: FurbianSenior http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2958 Tue, 06 Aug 2013 13:09:14 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2958 There’s a big difference, the US’s war in Afghanistan has cost Pakistan $68 in the economic damage it has done, $11 billion in blood money (US aid) for drone attacks is just throwing scraps to a poor country. Worse still the aid obviously has only ever gone to the military in both cases not to feed the poor, building schools and hospitals etc.

Add to this the fact the US’s massive military machine’s inability (or was this deliberate?) to do something very basic, i.e. man the Afghan border, has resulted in pushing the bulk of the Afghan problem, not forgetting the 3 million refugees from the Russians invasion, into Pakistan where US drone attacks result in bomb blast by Afghans and their friends in a Pakistani city. The latter is actually fiendishly clever, because the US then just expects the Pakistanis to have manned to border and blames them instead for their own failings. The mantra ‘must do more, or we’ll cut your money’ is the ultimate slap in the face.

Egypt is a clear cut case of hypocritically bribing a military that happily gunning down unarmed protesters to keep Israel safe.

The US should keeps its money and spend it on it’s own poor, rather than fight pointless wars and fund military dictators.

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By: thenetisus http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2957 Tue, 06 Aug 2013 06:22:30 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2957 Both of these nations being, beneath all the pretense
of democracy, theocracies (currently ruled by sharia)
lack logical rational civilian structures to whom the
western democracies can relate. Theocracy negates the
power of democracy (what meaning can popular referenda
have if that decision can be vetoed by some overlord –
real or imagined?) In a theocracy what would in a true democracy be referred to the people’s representatives
must be referred to the deity’s agents – to clerics.
Or to a pragmatically ordered branch of bureaucracy.
A branch with substantial leverage. The military.A
military is, above all, both pragmatic and orderly –
as such is, therefore, the easiest, safest bureaucracy
to relate to. They’re the secular musculoskeletal frame
and the sanity of such nations. Egypt’s people realize
this and have therefore opted to trust their military
over Morsi. The Pakistani military is in a far dicier
position since their hardline Islamists have seasoned guerilla forces active throughout the country. When a
high-profile jihadi icon can be hidden minutes from a
main military base for years on end – in luxury with
his entire retinue – it obviates the precariousness of
the military’s situation. Such precariousness rules out
any normal expectations of logistical predictability.

The military are Pakistan and Egypt at their sanest.

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By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2956 Tue, 06 Aug 2013 00:55:01 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2956 @LOB,

“The US Government is despised by the people in both Pakistan and Egypt.” Likely so. Considering how many of them are only alive because of our monetary generosity and food aid, they are not people of integrity or honor.

Mark Twain said something to the effect of: “If you take in a starving dog, feed him and make his life better, he will not bite you. And that is the difference between man and dog.”

Were it up to me I would LET THEM STARVE!

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By: Urban_Guerilla http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2954 Mon, 05 Aug 2013 15:37:24 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2954 Had the US never given money to the Pakistani or Egyptian generals, then not giving them money now would not be a problem. But these countries are now dependent on aid, they need it to feed their people.

If the US cuts it off, it will be immediately disastrous for their image and for their influence.

If the keep on paying it will be long term disastrous for their image and for their influence.

Tough choice.

The real reason the US props up the Egyptian military is alluded to in this article, but not really said straight out. It is Israel. Add that to the direct aid Israel gets and you have to wonder why they aren’t living like Kings in Jerusalem and Tel Aviv.

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By: LOB http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2953 Mon, 05 Aug 2013 11:35:26 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2953 The US Government is despised by the people in both Pakistan and Egypt. The US even failed to get the puppet it wanted in the last Pakistani elections. If the people in Egypt go to the polls again and they will, they are not likely to elect the candidate that the US wants.

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By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2952 Sat, 03 Aug 2013 20:29:22 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2952 “The drone strikes fuel bitter anti-Americanism in Pakistan…”. No, self-hate and envy fuel the anti-Americanism of those without the conviction, confidence in the future and bravery of Malala.

The Pakistani “street” is ever a mindless mob forever fueled and directed by the madrassas that masquerade as education in this backward illusion of a nation-state. The single cohesive factory in the entire population is fear of their neighbor India.

Egypt has traditionally been the political center of the Arab world. The history and heritage of these peoples is domination by “strong men”.

All Egyptians should find common cause to assure that Egypt’s next “strong man” will NOT be another ignorant Islamist willing or able to lead Egypt itself into martyrdom. Beyond that, there is little of importance going on of interest to the outside world.

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By: 2Borknot2B http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2951 Sat, 03 Aug 2013 18:31:33 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2951 You know what we can do better in Egypt. Stay out of their business and country. Think of it like two different houses. It will never go well if the people in house A try to tell people in house B, how to live. That “aid” money could sure do some good in American. Like to pay off our citizens student debt for example. If we got rid of the Military Industrial Complex, there would be no need for us to start any more wars. “If the Sinai, for example, becomes a safe haven for militants, they would pose a direct threat to Israel and the United States.” If Israel is wiped off the plant, America and the world would be just fine. This is not the UNITED STATES OF ISRAEL. Even though Israel’s people do in fact control America.

“The official said he was skeptical that civilian governments could emerge that could stabilize Egypt and secure the Sinai.” This is not true as long as Israel is controlled by such hate, supported by the American Hate Greed Machine. It is just a matter of time before Israel is taken. It really is to bad that the leaders of the Jewish individuals behaved toward the world in such a arrogant and war mongering fashion. Now they are just generally hated by everyone. They themselves manifested this opinion through their actions. They will reap what they have sown. Lets not let America go down with Israel. It is time to stop the War Mongering.

Let our government stop taking US worker money and “Hurling billions” at the war machine generals. Lets hurl billions into the peace machine of education, and opportunity. Or better yet, stop taking the billions out of American pockets to begin with. Let Americans live their own lives in peace without the government turning the US Citizens into money making machines to be harvested like fruit for money.

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By: ptiffany http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/2013/08/02/what-failed-in-pakistan-wont-work-in-egypt/#comment-2950 Sat, 03 Aug 2013 18:14:21 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/david-rohde/?p=2340#comment-2950 For decades the “sophisticated” approach was to use dollars to leverage despots. Now, that we have have seen that this has not only failed, but often produced situations where Americans are now more despised and ridiculed, shouldn’t we think of some more enlightened approaches?

Then, most of this “foreign aid” went into the coffers of American arms manufacturers, so there was a “success” of sorts.

If we made a list and ranked all the factors that kill and injure Americans each year with the intent of determining where best to invest our taxpayer dollars to reduce these deaths and injuries, then terrorism wouldn’t even be in the top ten. If the intent is to save and enhance lives, not the pocketbooks of the super rich, we would be making vastly different decisions.

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