Comments on: Another ill-advised rush towards Euro-pessimism http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/ A clear-eyed view from Zachary Karabell Thu, 06 Feb 2014 10:10:54 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: EcoTank http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-507 Fri, 19 Apr 2013 05:31:24 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-507 More FRAUD & CRIMINAL FARCE from the IMF & EU COMMISSION — What a joke Mario Draghi (wo worked for corrupt Goldman Sachs) and Olii Rehn, Merkel, Herr Schnauble (“Dr. Strangelove”), and Legarde are ! — Did you know IMF head Legarde had he house raided by French Police for financial fraud?

Incredible the major Criminals we have running the Euro zone now!!!

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By: harrycayce http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-414 Tue, 26 Mar 2013 15:51:14 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-414 Euro transformed Europe to a united in Currency traveling paradise. As in the US, Europeans may travel and use the same currency in vast geographical Space. But Europe psyche is not happy. Profit and Euroseceptics are trying to destoy the Europe ideal that begun alsmost after the end of World War II. Money Laundering, Lawlessness, a Euope of small nations is the wish of many Eurosceptics. The citizens of Europe are quiet.Listening to the Greeks is like one hope they had never entered the union. The Europe Idea must continue. All European Citizens must endure and assist in the developemnt of their Continent to an American Dollar Model. Destroying the Euro now will be a 200 year mistake

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By: Willvp http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-268 Sun, 10 Feb 2013 19:24:34 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-268 @dareconomics:

so true !

but you should send also to the EU-non elected dictators whose only achievement per todate is the impoverishment of millions of Europeans.

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By: dareconomics http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-267 Sun, 10 Feb 2013 18:52:50 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-267 What is the opposite of an edgy optimist? It’s not a conforming pessimist but merely the humble realist. Optimism and pessimism are two sides of the same coin with realism being the edge betwixt the two.

The problem with the Edgy Optimist’s post is that he is paying too much attention to market moves. The euro wasn’t dead over the summer, and it wasn’t fixed in the fall and winter. Hence, the current market does not indicate pessimism among market participants. PIIGS bonds yields and stock markets have declined in response to-who knows-what but profit-taking and the shrinking of the ECB balance sheet are as good explanations as the political machinations in Italy and Spain.

The euro is causing the slow decay of the Eurozone economy. Its very existence causes imbalances among its members. As long as the euro exists, so will these imbalances. As long as the system remains weak, its survival is in doubt no matter what you think the market is telling you.

The cult of the euro loves to paint the euro as this great love-fest that has prevented war on the continent for almost 70 years. This characterization is wrong.

What prevented war in Europe was NATO, millions of American and British troops standing in harms way in Germany and trillions of dollars spent by the U.S. and a broke U.K. during the Cold War to counteract Soviet aggression. The Nobel Prize should have been awarded to the troops who manned bases in West Germany until the dissolution of the USSR, not the eurocrats.*

It is optimistic to believe that the EU prevented WWIII, but it is realistic to know that trained, armed soldiers and the best weapons in the world are really what did the job.

At least author admits his bias, and this is what leads him to misunderstand the costs of a euro dissolution. He fails to see that the costs will not be borne equally by the members.

Creditor countries like Germany with large Target2 credits will be hit the worst. The Germans will also revert to a fairly valued mark that will crimp exports. Debtor countries like the PIIGS will immediately be relieved of crushing debt through a devalued currency that will create an export boom at the price of high inflation in the short-term. See Iceland and Argentina from 2001 for examples.

As long as some countries may benefit from an exit, the eurozone is in danger of dissolution, and that is a realistic assessment, not a pessimistic one.

*My father and the fathers of my friends selflessly went to Europe to preserve the peace during the Cold War, so please forgive me if I become a bit jingoistic when discussing this topic.

Post with charts and links here dareconomics.com

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By: Venerability http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-266 Sat, 09 Feb 2013 23:34:49 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-266 A. At least 80 percent of currency traders are amateurs – something most currency professionals admit.

B. These amateurs are the most Momo-chasing, easily persuaded participants in world markets.

C. They are manipulated like crazy as foot soldiers for the relatively few professionals.

D. And the vast majority of the professionals are utterly crazy.

E. Meanwhile, we participants in non-currency markets have to suffer for their excesses, again and again.

The only way out of this is the same as it has been for a long, long time now: Impose a large enough worldwide coordinated Tobin Tax on currency trading and greatly limit acceptable leverage, for amateurs and professionals alike.

Currency trading must cease and desist being the mammoth tail that controls the animal of world markets.

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By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-265 Sat, 09 Feb 2013 20:44:09 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-265 “And yet, the union prevails.” Wrong word. An economically Socialist union that is fiscally unsustainable by the productivity of European society “endures”, but more like an elephant mortally wounded than a Mammoth standing strong in a blizzard.

“The European Union was born of hope for security and prosperity sealed by common bonds of currency and government. It has achieved that.” I respectfully disagree on both counts.

Only an osterich with head in sand might describe the current European economic situation as “prosperity”.
The latest Iranian missile capability and rhetoric show Europe in the cross hairs of an irrational and unpredictable radical muslim theocracy and American “protection” both questionable and fragmented by misguided and futile attempts to appease a stupid but still vicious Russian bear. The seeds of their own destruction are the very differences between the economic successes of northern Europe and the economic failures of southern Europe. The destruction of national societies is as absolute whether by war or economics.

Until Europeans figure out that they have to PRODUCE AND SELL enough to pay the economic cost of all those “free” holidays and health benefits they have NO “future” or any “way forward” but collapse.

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By: ptiffany http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-264 Sat, 09 Feb 2013 20:18:27 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-264 How was Euro Zone pessimism “wrong”? It seems nearly everything described indicates that it was right-on as the recessions/depressions spread and are still spreading, so most of the down prognostications were correct and appropriate. Just because some were wrong about the extremes, the worst-case scenarios doesn’t mean they were wrong about more important core issues and more likely scenarios.

Those who were predicting a cataclismic collapse that would occur in a matter of days or weeks were wrong, but then was that ever realistic? The reality is that the situation is bad and growing worse. What could be worse than that for the largest collective economy in the world?

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By: St.Juste http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-262 Sat, 09 Feb 2013 16:30:56 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-262 The article is interesting, we’ll see. The main problem with the EU is that they have perpetually papered over problems and popular discontent in order to move forward with both enlargement and institutional deepening. Clearly enlargement has happened too quickly and will be difficult to digest. The EU even in the aftermath of the good will wrought paradoxically by the war is a several hundred year project which has tried to be done in decades. With no exterior threats there is no rush. While there is no going bacl, without increased risks to the project, timelines should be set for future progress and institutional strengthening so everyone will know where and how fast things go forward. Slow in this case is preferable.

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By: pbgd http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-261 Sat, 09 Feb 2013 11:52:55 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-261 FIGS instead of PIGS? The latest news from the EU summit indicates the beginnings of an understanding between Britain, Germany, and the Scandinavians — leaving France, Italy, Greece, and Spain (the FIGS) on the opposite side, exactly as George Soros had predicted last year. If this development should harden we may see a real split along those lines.

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By: The_Spud http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/2013/02/08/another-ill-advised-rush-towards-euro-pessimism/#comment-260 Sat, 09 Feb 2013 08:28:06 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/edgy-optimist/?p=112#comment-260 All empires fall. The undemocratic EU will be no different.

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