Comments on: GUESTVIEW: Fellay ordains SSPX priests, hints timid opening http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/ Religion, faith and ethics Sat, 23 Apr 2016 23:25:07 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: JM http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13277 Thu, 02 Jul 2009 07:00:03 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13277 Thanks Tom for pointing out the ways in which Pope Benedict has taken serious falls for the SSPX (like the remission of excommunications) only to be spurned yet again as with these new ordinations. I think part of the reason why the SSPX strikes such a raw nerve with Pope Benedict is that the Church itself is already divided into two sharply opposing camps. On the one hand there are those who have returned to the old Latin liturgy and push for a conservative/restrictive interpretation of Vatican II, and those who want to stretch the modern liturgy and the Council much farther. We’re almost 50 years on from the last Council, and the rifts that have appeared in the Church make me wonder if we will see another Council quite soon to rethink the decisions of a half-century. Pope Benedict needs to mend his internal divisions before even contemplating the repair of a bitter schism.

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By: Tom Heneghan http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13258 Wed, 01 Jul 2009 16:45:50 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13258 Paul Mc – you write that the January document from the Congregation of Bishops says the 1988 document declaring the SSPX bishops excommunicated was “void of juridical effects.” So, you conclude, “the former document was in error, and the excomunication never happened.”The fuller quote from the statement does not support your argument. Cardinal Re wrote: “According to faculties expressly conceded to me by the Holy Father Benedict XVI, by virtue of the present Decree, I remit the censure of excommunication latae sententiae, pronounced from Bishops Bernard Fellay, Bernard Tissier de Mallerais, Richard Williamson and Alfonso de Galarreta from and, as of this day, I likewise declare void of juridical effects the Decree published at the time.” Here’s the original text.That verb “remit” is better known to English-speaking Catholics in its noun form, remission, as in the phrase “remission of sins.” Re would not have to remit or forgive something that never happened.

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By: Kenjiro M. Shoda http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13249 Wed, 01 Jul 2009 11:32:13 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13249 “What’s your opinion? Is 80% of what goes on in the Catholic Church wrong”As a young Catholic, I can answer 100% yes…80% of what goes on in the Catholic Church is wrong.The misinterpretation and deviations from the text of Vatican II documents happened from the very beginning in 1965, after the close of Vatican II. Radical priests, bishops, Cardinals, friars and nuns who warped Vatican II into their own liberal agenda wrecked the Church. And the Popes (especially Paul VI, but also John Paul II), either did nothing to stop it, or timidly supported it. Many of Paul VI’s dicrectives early on (save for the monumental encyclical “Humanae Vitae”) discarded a thousand years of Catholic tradition and replaced it with modern fabricated garbage. The so called “New Mass” is an example of that. Mass attendance, and the number of those choosing religious life collapsed right upon the implementation of the “New Mass”, and has been declining ever since.The SSPX and Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, and now the 4 bishops consecrated by him especially Bishop Fellay represent the hope of the Catholic Church to restore itself with Catholic tradition and the Latin Mass. Proof is that the SSPX and it’s 400+ churches and 1.5 million faithful are flourishing.Benedict XVI sees the dramatic picture. He sees the rot and collapse of the “Vatican II” Church and what the misinterpretation of the Council has done to the Church, and he sees the solid, flourishing Catholic vibrant traditionalism and holiness growing under the SSPX.Don’t be surprised if this summer, Pope Benedict XVI makes major re-structuring of the Catholic Church along the lines back to Catholic tradition. He knows what succeedes, (The tradition of the Church as expresed with the SSPX), and that which fails (the reforms of Vatican II).

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By: christopher http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13241 Wed, 01 Jul 2009 06:22:58 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13241 It can not be argued that the modern church is destroyed due to the modern world environment. Because SSPX is also doing its work in the same environment only. The difference is SSPX does not follow wrong reforms of Vatican II. But modern church does it.

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By: Christopher http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13239 Wed, 01 Jul 2009 05:47:33 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13239 SSPX should never accept false teachings of Vatican II. But Vatican II can be accepted as catholic council. But its confusing statements which destroyed catholic faith and teachings for years must be condemned and corrected by POPE. Let us pray for this grace tobe given to our holy Father by our blessed Lord And also pray for the holy father to come out from the erroneous belief ecuminism Which is a concept something against first commandment and also the teachings of catholic church.ByChristopher

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By: Paul Mc http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13231 Wed, 01 Jul 2009 01:41:29 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13231 TomI don’t think the SSPX has ever maintained that Faith comes form obedience, but rather the other way around. One must first believe the Pope is Christ’s earthly representative before giving him obedience, to do otherwise would be idolotry.That said, the reality is that the SSPX priests and bishops conceed, and always have conceeded, that obedience is owed to the Pope (they are probably more obedient than most other bishops around the world on most things). But they argue that obedience to authority is only required when that authority is itself in obedience to the teaching of the Church. When those in authority display an adhearance to theological principles opposed to the Church’s teaching, then it becomes a duty of the subordinate to (respectfully) disobey. Such apparent ‘disobedience’ is in reality obedience to a higher authority and a virtue. This is the SSPX’s argument. One could debate whether they are right in their evaluation of the theological innovations of VCII, and hence the wish of the Pope for discussions.By the way, it was never the Pope who stated that the SSPX must accept the documents of VCII. This was a statement issued by the Vatican press secretary.One final point, it is constantly reported that the ‘excommunications’ of the 4 SSPX bishops was ‘lifted’ in January. Carefully reading the January document, particularly the last sentence or two, I can not help but think otherwise. I declares the former document which stated the SSPX bishops were excomunicated to be ‘void of juridical effects’. In other words, the former document was in error, and the excomunication never happened.

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By: Omoyo http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13210 Tue, 30 Jun 2009 18:38:51 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13210 ¡¡VIVA THE CATHOLIC CHURCH¡¡ Viva the holy father Benedict¡¡ We are united as ONE HOLY UNIVERSAL CHURCH with the Christ’s vicary, the pope together with all the bishops.

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By: Tom Heneghan http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13203 Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:29:21 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13203 Irene,First of all, if you had read the post carefully, especially the first five lines written in bold letters, you would have seen that this is not Tom Heneghan’s article, but Nicolas Senèze’s. We made a special effort to explain that because Nicolas is not a Reuters correspondent, but deputy editor of the religion section of the French Catholic daily La Croix. That’s not a problem, but you should at least know whose work you’re criticising.That this post does not explicitly state the fact these ordinations are valid does not mean either Nicolas or I do not know that. But that is not the issue here. The Vatican recognises them as valid as well, so if the validity were an issue, the Church would not have a problem with these ordinations. But the problem lies elsewhere.The question is whether the SSPX bishops really want to come back into the fold of the Catholic Church or not. They lobbied the Vatican long and hard enough to get their 1988 excommunications lifted. Then as soon as they were confronted with the issue of complying with canon law, like Catholic bishops around the world, they claimed an exception for themselves and disregarded a Vatican warning that the ordinations would be illicit. This does not look like a sign of good faith towards a pope who risked — and got — a lot of criticism from within the Church for lifting the excommunications without any concessions from the SSPX.If the faith comes before obedience, why does the SSPX continue to try to reenter a Roman Catholic Church it cannot obey? Pope Benedict has made clear the SSPX will have to accept Vatican II reforms that the society rejects. If they accept these reforms in some deal with the Vatican, does that mean that they are also betraying the “age-old faith of Our Fathers”?Another point you may not have noticed in this post is the quote from Bishop Fellay indicating he might be ready to make some concessions on Vatican II. This is the start of the SSPX’s negotiation for actual reintegration into the Church, a process that will most probably involve concessions that many SSPX followers may find hard to swallow. The point of this article is not “another attempt to scare off those seeking to save their souls” but to inform readers about a crossroads the SSPX and the Catholic Church are approaching.

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By: irene http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13200 Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:48:01 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13200 Tom Heneghan’s article is another attempt to scare off those seeking to save their souls. Tom writes that the ordinations by the SSPX Bishops, are illegitimate but conveniently forgets to add that they are still VALID. We are all getting rather tired of articles such as this. The only benefit of the negative articles is that it brings into the light those who are terrified of the age-old faith of Our Fathers. The Faith comes before obedience. If obedience decides who is a Catholic and who is not, then half of the clergy are actually out of the Church!!!

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By: kpbrown http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/06/29/guestview-felley-ordains-sspx-priests-hints-timid-opening/comment-page-1/#comment-13190 Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:08:01 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/?p=6789#comment-13190 Don, it is obvious you are in oblivian to what is going on in the Church. If there is any “revelling, and to debauchery and banquetings”, it exists when a “new order” priest presents to the sanctuary in a clown costume or dressed as “Santa Clause” or when there is a modern band in a Roman Church to entertain the faithful. I was once a “new order” Catholic, actually born after Vatican II. May Our Lord be glorified and honored in the Latin Mass for ever and ever, and may I bow to Him in humility for leading me back to Himself.Don, pray for humility and wisdom.Indeed, God bless our Holy Father, Pope Benedict XVI !!kp

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