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	<title>Comments on: How to attack the mortgage-interest tax deduction</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/</link>
	<description>A slice of lime in the soda</description>
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		<title>By: spectre855</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14998</link>
		<dc:creator>spectre855</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 21:37:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14998</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s another question though it may be a stupid one as I know very little about tax law: If the mortgage interest deduction were to be removed, would this affect the standard deduction?  If so, the 20% number would be moot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s another question though it may be a stupid one as I know very little about tax law: If the mortgage interest deduction were to be removed, would this affect the standard deduction?  If so, the 20% number would be moot.</p>
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		<title>By: amichael</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14993</link>
		<dc:creator>amichael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 19:27:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14993</guid>
		<description>Only 20% of households itemizing seems surprisingly low given the high homeownership rate.  As several commenters above have noted, it doesn&#039;t take a huge mortgage to hit the itemizing threshold.  The actual threshold would be even lower for most after adding in property taxes and state income taxes.

I don&#039;t know what year Felix&#039;s statistics are from, but there are several factors that make it plausible, especially if the numbers are recent:

1.  Mortgage interest payments decline over the life of the loan.  My neighbors who have owned their houses for 15 years have lower loan balances than me becuase they took out smaller mortgages to begin with and they have paid down a hefty portion of the original balance.  

2.  Nearly 50% of households paid no federal income tax in 2009.  A portion of these are homeowners (given the 65% homeownership rate), and many of them probably don&#039;t need the mortgage deduction to reduce their tax bill to 0.

3.  As far as I know, you only get the interest deduction if you pay your mortgage.  With high delinquency rates in 2009, there could be a large number of homeowners not taking the deduction who would qualify if they were current on their mortgages.

To those commenters complaining that they bought their houses expecting the deduction and removing it would cause undue burden on them:  no doubt that is why Felix suggests phasing the deduction out over time.  This doesn&#039;t eliminate the pain, but there is always pain on the part of those adapted to current policy when tax policies are changed.  The article Felix linked does a reasonable job of explaining why the deduction isn&#039;t good policy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Only 20% of households itemizing seems surprisingly low given the high homeownership rate.  As several commenters above have noted, it doesn&#8217;t take a huge mortgage to hit the itemizing threshold.  The actual threshold would be even lower for most after adding in property taxes and state income taxes.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know what year Felix&#8217;s statistics are from, but there are several factors that make it plausible, especially if the numbers are recent:</p>
<p>1.  Mortgage interest payments decline over the life of the loan.  My neighbors who have owned their houses for 15 years have lower loan balances than me becuase they took out smaller mortgages to begin with and they have paid down a hefty portion of the original balance.  </p>
<p>2.  Nearly 50% of households paid no federal income tax in 2009.  A portion of these are homeowners (given the 65% homeownership rate), and many of them probably don&#8217;t need the mortgage deduction to reduce their tax bill to 0.</p>
<p>3.  As far as I know, you only get the interest deduction if you pay your mortgage.  With high delinquency rates in 2009, there could be a large number of homeowners not taking the deduction who would qualify if they were current on their mortgages.</p>
<p>To those commenters complaining that they bought their houses expecting the deduction and removing it would cause undue burden on them:  no doubt that is why Felix suggests phasing the deduction out over time.  This doesn&#8217;t eliminate the pain, but there is always pain on the part of those adapted to current policy when tax policies are changed.  The article Felix linked does a reasonable job of explaining why the deduction isn&#8217;t good policy.</p>
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		<title>By: dsucher</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14984</link>
		<dc:creator>dsucher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 16:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14984</guid>
		<description>Just curious why Vancouver BC seems to me to be significantly more expensive than Seattle and yet the Canadians don&#039;t have the mortgage-interest deduction.

The areas are roughly similar with substantial constraints in entitlements and topography.

So what gives?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just curious why Vancouver BC seems to me to be significantly more expensive than Seattle and yet the Canadians don&#8217;t have the mortgage-interest deduction.</p>
<p>The areas are roughly similar with substantial constraints in entitlements and topography.</p>
<p>So what gives?</p>
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		<title>By: AEinCH</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14976</link>
		<dc:creator>AEinCH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 08:48:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14976</guid>
		<description>&quot;I think a change like this would cause the value of a large number of homes around the NYC region to absolutely crater.&quot;

Which is value-neutral to society, since for every home seller there&#039;s a buyer.  Maybe this will benefit the huge universe of renters  currently unable or unwilling to buy into the perpetual-tax-avoidance machine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I think a change like this would cause the value of a large number of homes around the NYC region to absolutely crater.&#8221;</p>
<p>Which is value-neutral to society, since for every home seller there&#8217;s a buyer.  Maybe this will benefit the huge universe of renters  currently unable or unwilling to buy into the perpetual-tax-avoidance machine.</p>
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		<title>By: AEinCH</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14974</link>
		<dc:creator>AEinCH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 08:28:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14974</guid>
		<description>&quot; People can afford those houses with the tax deduction and most certainly can’t w/o it.&quot;

You seem to be saying that house prices are high because the tax subsidy, and without the subsidy no one would be able to afford these very high prices.  Am I alone in finding this a bit peculiar?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8221; People can afford those houses with the tax deduction and most certainly can’t w/o it.&#8221;</p>
<p>You seem to be saying that house prices are high because the tax subsidy, and without the subsidy no one would be able to afford these very high prices.  Am I alone in finding this a bit peculiar?</p>
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		<title>By: dedalus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14970</link>
		<dc:creator>dedalus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 00:47:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14970</guid>
		<description>Nobody with a million-dollar mortgage deserves a subsidy from the U.S. Treasury.

Edward Glaeser has argued against the mortgage-interest expense deduction: 

http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/24/killing-or-maiming-a-sacred-cow-home-mortgage-deductions/ 

And so has Roger Lowenstein: 

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/05/magazine/305deduction.1.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nobody with a million-dollar mortgage deserves a subsidy from the U.S. Treasury.</p>
<p>Edward Glaeser has argued against the mortgage-interest expense deduction: </p>
<p><a href='http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/24/killing-or-maiming-a-sacred-cow-home-mortgage-deductions/'>http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/0 2/24/killing-or-maiming-a-sacred-cow-hom e-mortgage-deductions/</a> </p>
<p>And so has Roger Lowenstein: </p>
<p><a href='http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/05/magazine/305deduction.1.html'>http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/05/magazi ne/305deduction.1.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: TFF</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14968</link>
		<dc:creator>TFF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 00:44:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14968</guid>
		<description>You could reduce the mortgage interest deduction without hammering the middle class in one of two ways:

(1) Convert it to a 15% tax credit (thus those in the 25% tax bracket would still pay 10% tax on their mortgage interest).

(2) Remove the deduction from the Alternative Minimum Tax.

The former &quot;solution&quot; would reduce the complexity of tax filing, the latter would increase it.  Bets on which Congress would prefer?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You could reduce the mortgage interest deduction without hammering the middle class in one of two ways:</p>
<p>(1) Convert it to a 15% tax credit (thus those in the 25% tax bracket would still pay 10% tax on their mortgage interest).</p>
<p>(2) Remove the deduction from the Alternative Minimum Tax.</p>
<p>The former &#8220;solution&#8221; would reduce the complexity of tax filing, the latter would increase it.  Bets on which Congress would prefer?</p>
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		<title>By: MitchW</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14960</link>
		<dc:creator>MitchW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 19:48:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14960</guid>
		<description>A $250,000 loan at 5.5% interest results in $13,500 in interest in year one.  That&#039;s above the standard deduction for married filing jointly and we haven&#039;t even gotten to things like kids, education, property taxes, and charitable donations.  It&#039;s a bit more than expensive homes in New York and California that care.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A $250,000 loan at 5.5% interest results in $13,500 in interest in year one.  That&#8217;s above the standard deduction for married filing jointly and we haven&#8217;t even gotten to things like kids, education, property taxes, and charitable donations.  It&#8217;s a bit more than expensive homes in New York and California that care.</p>
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		<title>By: wmaustin5</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14953</link>
		<dc:creator>wmaustin5</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 18:30:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14953</guid>
		<description>And as a follow up, I bring up the value point as a way to look at property taxes not the sale benefit to the homeowner. A neighborhood starts decreasing in (assesed)value and the property taxes collected head down as well. Do these decreases in property taxes colleced balance out the deductions homeowners took on their income taxes? Maybe, but as a homeowner I would think you&#039;d be mouch more concerned about the services your municipality provides to you on a day to day basis than the federal gov&#039;t.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And as a follow up, I bring up the value point as a way to look at property taxes not the sale benefit to the homeowner. A neighborhood starts decreasing in (assesed)value and the property taxes collected head down as well. Do these decreases in property taxes colleced balance out the deductions homeowners took on their income taxes? Maybe, but as a homeowner I would think you&#8217;d be mouch more concerned about the services your municipality provides to you on a day to day basis than the federal gov&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: wmaustin5</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14951</link>
		<dc:creator>wmaustin5</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 18:23:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14951</guid>
		<description>@AEinCH 
&quot;Not unless a meaningful amount of house “value” (appropriate scare quotes) is derived from tax avoidance.&quot;

That&#039;s just it, as of now a meaningful amount of value for a large number of homeowners is derived from income tax avoidance. People can afford those houses with the tax deduction and most certainly can&#039;t w/o it. As some other commenters pointed out it doesn&#039;t take much in the way of interest expense to have a benefit here to the homeowner. I think a change like this would cause the value of a large number of homes around the NYC region to absolutely crater.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@AEinCH<br />
&#8220;Not unless a meaningful amount of house “value” (appropriate scare quotes) is derived from tax avoidance.&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s just it, as of now a meaningful amount of value for a large number of homeowners is derived from income tax avoidance. People can afford those houses with the tax deduction and most certainly can&#8217;t w/o it. As some other commenters pointed out it doesn&#8217;t take much in the way of interest expense to have a benefit here to the homeowner. I think a change like this would cause the value of a large number of homes around the NYC region to absolutely crater.</p>
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		<title>By: GreatMidwest</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14949</link>
		<dc:creator>GreatMidwest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 17:43:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14949</guid>
		<description>@Curmudgeon: For the record, my wife and I live in the Midwest in a house that cost $197k in 2006, with a 7% interest rate.  Our area does not have a high cost of living, either.  Like glenngulia, the mortgage interest deduction turned us into itemizers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Curmudgeon: For the record, my wife and I live in the Midwest in a house that cost $197k in 2006, with a 7% interest rate.  Our area does not have a high cost of living, either.  Like glenngulia, the mortgage interest deduction turned us into itemizers.</p>
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		<title>By: IanAndEgg</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14946</link>
		<dc:creator>IanAndEgg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 17:12:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14946</guid>
		<description>Go ahead, phase out the mortgage and business interest deductions.  Even though I own (or at least pay the mortgages on) properties in the SF Bay area, this tax break just makes no sense.  Yes, the mortgage deduction is built in to the value of a property, so it doesn&#039;t make it any more affordable, it just artificially inflates the price.  If it were phased out then increasing income and inflation over time would lessen the blow, and besides, one person&#039;s price decline is another&#039;s better affordability.  If home ownership is deemed a public good then offer a once in a lifetime grant to get first-timers in the door.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Go ahead, phase out the mortgage and business interest deductions.  Even though I own (or at least pay the mortgages on) properties in the SF Bay area, this tax break just makes no sense.  Yes, the mortgage deduction is built in to the value of a property, so it doesn&#8217;t make it any more affordable, it just artificially inflates the price.  If it were phased out then increasing income and inflation over time would lessen the blow, and besides, one person&#8217;s price decline is another&#8217;s better affordability.  If home ownership is deemed a public good then offer a once in a lifetime grant to get first-timers in the door.</p>
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		<title>By: spectre855</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14945</link>
		<dc:creator>spectre855</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 17:11:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14945</guid>
		<description>@xyz70: Do you think removing the subsidy is worth causing people to lose their homes?  Would renters and nonitemizers see that big of a gain?  I don&#039;t think so and this change wouldn&#039;t affect me.  I&#039;m not even close to the standard deduction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@xyz70: Do you think removing the subsidy is worth causing people to lose their homes?  Would renters and nonitemizers see that big of a gain?  I don&#8217;t think so and this change wouldn&#8217;t affect me.  I&#8217;m not even close to the standard deduction.</p>
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		<title>By: spectre855</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14944</link>
		<dc:creator>spectre855</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 17:05:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14944</guid>
		<description>@Curmudgeon:  I wouldn&#039;t say that $11,400 is very difficult to exceed.  In the first year of a 5.5% loan you exceed that amount at a little less than $210,000.  At 20% LTV you&#039;re looking at about a $260,000 house.  According to census.gov, the median home price in the U.S. was $214,000 in March 2010.  And obviously none of this is even taking into account any other deductions.  Am I missing something?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Curmudgeon:  I wouldn&#8217;t say that $11,400 is very difficult to exceed.  In the first year of a 5.5% loan you exceed that amount at a little less than $210,000.  At 20% LTV you&#8217;re looking at about a $260,000 house.  According to census.gov, the median home price in the U.S. was $214,000 in March 2010.  And obviously none of this is even taking into account any other deductions.  Am I missing something?</p>
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		<title>By: xyz70</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/05/18/how-to-attack-the-mortgage-interest-tax-deduction/comment-page-1/#comment-14943</link>
		<dc:creator>xyz70</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 17:01:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=3885#comment-14943</guid>
		<description>@Bigmook: does this mean that renters and nonitemizers should subsize your house and the whatever gains you might realize?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Bigmook: does this mean that renters and nonitemizers should subsize your house and the whatever gains you might realize?</p>
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