Comments on: Treasury’s plan to fix the mortgage mess http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/ A slice of lime in the soda Sun, 26 Oct 2014 19:05:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: ARJTurgot2 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21302 Fri, 26 Nov 2010 15:37:18 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21302 This whole mess reminds me of the old game of pick-up-sticks, but among those sticks are some related to just poor technical (as in ‘detailed’, not computer techy) practices. Risky loans, with no increase in reserves, paperwork practices that simply didn’t exist.

There are healthy banks out there, especially outside of New York. They are doing pretty well given the magnitude of the mess. They are financing new tractors, covering the inventory ’til the end of the month, depositing my receipts and giving me cash when I ask for it. My local banker is still the best analyst I know on conditions in the local market, and what I need to do next in my business.

Contrast that to Wells Fargo and BofA where they admit that they had people do mass signatures of critical legal documents because the management couldn’t be bothered to spend the time doing it right. Forcing these guys to go back and jump through every hoop, pay every fine, and absorb the losses will be instructive to them and beneficial to the country.

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By: Danny_Black http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21300 Fri, 26 Nov 2010 05:32:40 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21300 TFF, to be fair it really depends on what you mean by “bailout”. One could argue that QE is a “bailout” for banks, but in terms of just TARP money the true losses are due to homeowner “help” and Frannie.

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By: TFF http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21296 Fri, 26 Nov 2010 00:54:48 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21296 Phil, why don’t you tell me? How much do GM and AIG still owe? What portion of the $700B TARP program is still pending?

It has mostly been repaid. Fannie and Freddie will be very costly, but then they weren’t exactly bailed out — they were practically nationalized.

So when you add up the net cost of all those bailouts, how does that compare to the ongoing cost of the Bush middle class tax cuts? The whole mess has been very expensive, but it is silly to pretend that the government has ignored the middle class while lavishing trillions of dollars on the banks. If anything, the reverse is true.

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By: Danny_Black http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21295 Fri, 26 Nov 2010 00:42:46 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21295 AwakenedGoy, you can’t end it. Otherwise in the next World dominance meeting they will get their puppet China to take you out…. Now you have dared to say the truth you better hope they are too busy bleeding Christian babies to made Matzeh and spreading the Black Death to focus on one brave truth-sayer!

/sarcasm off

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By: AwakenedGoy http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21286 Thu, 25 Nov 2010 17:49:57 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21286 End the Kosher Nostra in Government and the FED

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By: Danny_Black http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21283 Thu, 25 Nov 2010 15:47:23 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21283 What a missed opportunity! You could have asked him based on their research how many of the foreclosures are failing title questions vs procedural issues.

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By: PhilPerspective http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21277 Thu, 25 Nov 2010 04:24:55 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21277 TFF:
The bailout money has mostly been repaid? Really? GM still owes how much? AIG still owes how much? How much crap did the Fed take off the TBTF’s balance sheets?

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By: TFF http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21267 Wed, 24 Nov 2010 21:24:05 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21267 hsvkitty, I fully realize we are not out of this mess yet. However the behaviors that CREATED the mess are not continuing. MBS securitization has essentially halted, except through Fannie and Freddie, and underwriting standards once again have some semblance of sanity.

I don’t know what you mean by “all that money from the Treasury/Fed”. The government has been running a trillion-plus deficit, putting the majority of that money into the hands of the middle class through the Bush tax cuts, unemployment benefits, Social Security/Medicare/Medicaid, and similar programs. The “bank bailout” money has mostly been repaid.

Moreover, the biggest reason we are not out of the woods yet is that the stimulus actions have prevented us from hitting bottom. That is trading a sharp crash (admittedly one that could have been truly devastating) for a prolonged malaise. Look at the unemployment rate, housing prices, and the oversupply of housing, and you see an imbalance that will take several years to play out. There is no hope of a quick recovery from this, there has never been such a hope.

I realize that blaming it all on the banks is popular, but the general public played its part. Nobody forced people to overextend themselves on credit. Nobody forced them to overpay for houses, borrowing 5x their annual income and more. Nobody forced them to play the fool. Do I sound unsympathetic? Maybe, but so what? Does it really matter whether I’m sympathetic or not? THERE IS NOTHING ANYBODY CAN DO AT THIS POINT BUT SURVIVE WHILE THE SITUATION SLOWLY REBOUNDS.

I fully agree that Wall Street will find new ways to exploit the ignorant, new ways to ruin our economy. However it will play out DIFFERENTLY from the last cycle, as it always does. It isn’t the danger that we see coming that ruins us, it is the danger that everybody has forgotten about. And that is why THIS danger isn’t going to be a problem for another 30 years (or longer). People will remember for at least that long.

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By: hsvkitty http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21266 Wed, 24 Nov 2010 19:22:54 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21266 I am so confused TFF.

We (I can say we, you had/have an effect the world and this crisis affected me, my mortgage and my pension/RSP funds very much) are not in any danger of a repeat of this mortgage mess for at least another generation? You and the rest of the world will not even be OUT of the mortgage mess in the next generation. And there is still a very good chance of a real crash, because believe it or not the stooges who said it was all over were wrong. And who will resolve it? the banks???

Had all that money from the Treasury/Fed been put into the hands of those who really needed it to get the economy working, the crisis would have been over long ago! yet it was put into the hands of those who helped fuel the problems in the first place… people know that TFF and they will be claculating once the shock is over. And they won’t be happy…

Treasury is going to have to sweat because at some point, the people will understand that at the root was bad Government policy, fiscal mismanagement, lack of regulation and disregard for the taxpayer and mostly, disregard for the law. (and that was begun by Bush but Obama’s watch is also ineffectual)

The Governemnt has intervened already in favour of the banks. They want it all to go away. But in doing so it is at the expense of pensioners and homeowners and those who were actually hurt by the crisis. Governments and banks are sitting pretty saying there is no crisis just a little misunderstanding with some paperwork. That was intervening to placate via the press.

It may take some time, but at some point, a group with a great lawyer is going to successfully enforce the buyback clauses of the AAA securities. Pensioners who lost 1/3 or more of their pensions will be looking for help. The houses that are being robo forclosed upon are sitting and more are homeless. There are no new jobs and the the Fed/treasury will keep churning out money to add to the debt. People are running out of hope and the Government will have no choice but to intervene.

The Government was part and parcel of the mess… and they should be concerned about trusts, securitization and the law.

Michael Barr was a Govenment spokeperson in this matter. Why is it OK to make promises to placate the complainers, when you have no plans on even staying to see it through?

And lastly TFF, unchecked greed and the Capitalist need for speedy money will ensure there are TEN more ways to rip off the the ‘willfully ignorant.’ It’s happening right now as the SEC simply can’t keep up and will those who helped make the new regs be hired as consultants so they can be skirted and loopholes found? Of course. Why would anyone stick around to actually see it through when it won’t do what it was set out to do…

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By: TFF http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2010/11/23/treasurys-plan-to-fix-the-mortgage-mess/comment-page-1/#comment-21261 Wed, 24 Nov 2010 16:24:48 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=6288#comment-21261 Felix, it is very tempting to demand that the government resolve all problems. But please, let’s avoid that temptation.

The government has the obligation to assure that all laws are followed. The Treasury review is targeted towards that. It is NOT designed to repair the relationship between investor and trustee, or between trustee and servicer. Those relationships should be negotiated between the affected individuals, not dictated by regulators.

A common response to that is, “Look at the mess they created when left to their own means!” But I would suggest you are closing the gate after the horse has already scampered. The caution of MBS investors over the coming decade will exceed the degree of willful ignorance that they displayed over the LAST decade. There will be further banking crises, but the next will assuredly take a different form than this one. We are not in any danger of a repeat of this mortgage mess for at least another generation.

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