Comments on: The best report ever on media piracy http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/ A slice of lime in the soda Sun, 26 Oct 2014 19:05:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: leavemealone http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-27257 Thu, 02 Jun 2011 11:09:22 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-27257 @EconomistDuNord

“They took lots of time to develop, learn, improve, try, fail. Great music takes investment.”

Apparently you know nothing about stolen content from these bands,they abused a lot of “black” musicians creativity by cutting and remixing their work and now they go after kids who do the same with no purpose of profit…Copyrights exists only for hollywood evryone else has no rights to it,so yes its moral to do whatever they have done to others,and yes i refuse to pay $10.000.000 to X actor or band.If we live in democracy let the people decide.I have never downloaded media and never bought media.Radio and streaming is enough i think ;)

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By: GRRR http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25633 Wed, 06 Apr 2011 19:23:28 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25633 By the way, just tested it – because I ran into it only today – but that hint about the NYT paywall, works. Thanks, Felix.

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By: Jose_X http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25546 Sun, 03 Apr 2011 20:27:54 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25546 EconomistDuNord, go publish significantly without giving credit (and taking credit) and watch what will happen to your credibility when the plagiarism is discovered.

Conversely, go “pirate” someone else’s quality work (with attribution) and watch their brand value and opportunity go up.

So, the author is likely going to benefit one way or the other (at least over averages and over the long run). Give credit so that they benefit more quickly and you suffer less in the long run or pick the other choice. It is your choice.

Creating a work is half the battle. You should position yourself to take advantage of your unique position and significant skill as the work becomes more and more popular.

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By: Danny_Black http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25532 Sat, 02 Apr 2011 20:39:35 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25532 EconomistDuNord, ps I haven’t seen Felix claim your “creative work” is worthless but based on what you have written here I would like to heartily agree with him.

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By: Danny_Black http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25531 Sat, 02 Apr 2011 20:36:51 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25531 EconomistDuNord, recognised for their “contribution” by who and how? What “cultural contribution” did the Stones make? Is your claim that the music business is in decline based on more than you not liking the racket that kids these days listen to? Because i cannot think of a single thing in the world that would substantially change if the Stones had not existed.

As for incentives, the key thing you miss is that downloading the song is EASY and PAINLESS. If it was about the money then no one wold use ITunes, yet it is a 5bn a year business.

Give me a rigourous definition and i’ll take your bet. I will happily bet that there is a band as dominant as the Stones – not very – in the next ten years. So please stop whinning and give some facts and figures to back up your claim that piracy is the cause of woe if such woe exists.

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By: EconomistDuNord http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25507 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 14:02:47 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25507 langelgjm wrote:

“Maybe the record industry is in decline because of piracy. Maybe it’s in decline because people have finally stopped replacing their LPs and tapes with CDs. Maybe it’s becaue the industry missed the boat big time by refusing to enter into what would probably have been a very profitable licensing agreement with Napster. I don’t know, but I do know that yelling “piracy” isn’t a convincing explanation of anything.”

The music industry is in decline for all those reasons. The business side shouldn’t have been so inertial, they should have adapted, yes.

Everyone knows economic behavior is about incentives: a kid with no money who can get that song or movie or expensive software in one click will do it. You can’t really blame the kid. It’s just the way people work, like it or lump it.

But this is why laws exist. To adjust incentives. To raise the cost of engaging in societally unbeneficial behavior.

No surprise, economics works on the supply side too: if you want people to produce something, you need to have incentives in place for them to do it.

This is why what Felix and so many others (like Julian Sanchez, Brad Delong among others) are doing is so culturally reprehensible. These people know better; incentives are their expertise. They like to steal stuff, and cheerlead it on their blogs. But they’re smart enough to know that without laws to incentives creative production, creative production goes away (apart from what’s generated as result of narcisstic need for self-expression, but which work product brings little value to anyone but the narcissist in question).

This is a moment when BOTH sides of the story need to be told: 1) How do we increase global marginal utility of creative work (which is happening, since anyone can get anything now instantly), BUT ALSO 2) how do we incentivise production of societally beneficial creative work?

Everybody loves #1 because they get free stuff and justify in their own little way why they shouldn’t have to pay for it. Felix sits happily in the self-justified thief camp.

But people like Felix, who are broadly-read public intellectuals on the topic, have the obligation to look at #2 seriously.

And it disgusts me that he doesn’t.

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By: EconomistDuNord http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25506 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 13:38:01 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25506 spectre855 wrote, “I don’t think anyone is talking about ip that is unattributed.”

-I- am talking about unattributed IP. Felix doesn’t think my output as a creative is worth protecting, so I don’t think he gets any rights as regards his creative. Pure and simple. So I guess I’ll just do with it whatever I please; Who cares what he thinks? He gets to make up his own rules, I get to make up mine.

Tough titties: “adapt or die”, as Engraver writes.

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By: EconomistDuNord http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25505 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 13:29:37 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25505 Engraver wrote, “the music business is doing better than ever”.

Clearly you know nothing about the music business. The fact that kids can put some kind of crap together in their basement in Garageband (a pirated version, of course), and put it on their Facebook page has NOTHING to do with the music business. If you want to say that “musical expression” is alive and well, fine. That’s certainly true.

But the Rolling Stones didn’t come out of someone’s basement. The Beatles weren’t some kid in a garage. They took lots of time to develop, learn, improve, try, fail. Great music takes investment. And without a hope of return, no one will invest. If anyone can just steal anything you do and society doesn’t care, and morons like Felix are even out cheerleading it, no one with any talent (or sense) will do it.

The only ones who will do it are those who don’t care about making money off their work.

So there will never, ever be another musical act with the recognized quality and recognized contribution to the culture of the world of the Beatles or Rolling Stones. I’ll be more than happy to take an escrowed $10,000 bet against anyone who disagrees. (We’d have to make it a period of, say 10 years, since “never” is an unuseful betting period).

Thanks to Felix and the like, new music is going to be crap for the rest of our lives.

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By: Danny_Black http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25504 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 12:15:31 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25504 mfw13, another reason is because with pirated media you tend not to have to deal with all the DRM crap. In the far east I must have been the only idiot to actually buy DVDs. This meant:

1) I had to buy AGAIN my old DVDs just to play them in the far east. If i ever leave the far east i will have to replace the new ones.
2) I have to sit through ads about why i shouldn’t buy pirate DVDs on my legit DVD. Can’t skip them either.
3) When i tried copying them to a hard drive to cut down on the amount of crap i take from place to place turns out i can’t play them because of encryption, something that would not be an issue with pirated stuff.

So legit DVDs are more expensive AND more of a pain. Is there any wonder there is piracy?

Also China does have a history of property rights, in particular land rights. What it also has is a rampantly corrupt legal system.

langelgjm, Newspapers are collapsing because frankly most of the “journalists” are not terribly bright, cut and paste from each other anyway and barely fact check. NYT isn’t going bankrupt because of piracy but because its “news” is mostly worthless. Why pay for regurgitated propaganda? and ps in South Korea, virtually no one buys dvds, so much for that argument.

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By: spectre855 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/03/29/the-best-report-ever-on-media-piracy/comment-page-1/#comment-25498 Thu, 31 Mar 2011 21:39:37 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=7767#comment-25498 @EconomistDuNord: I don’t think anyone is talking about ip that is unattributed. That’s plagiarism and is a different topic altogether. But if your true story had left the unattributed part out, I’m sure Felix would very much commend your behavior. In fact he’s argued in favor of that very topic several times. For instance the various paywall posts. It’s pretty funny that you picked that as an example actually because it drives his point home rather well.

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