Comments on: Where does value lie in a restaurant meal?

By: EricVincent

EricVincent — Thu, 28 Apr 2011 21:04:14 +0000

@dsquared: Chefs are expendable. Over the past two decades I’ve worked for Ritz Carlton, Westin, Four Seasons & Saint Regis. (I still work for one of those but will refrain from stating which.) One thing I’ve learned: Chefs are expendable. They all know that. They may not like to admit it, but they are. The 19 y/o line cook at my hotel could do what Ramirez is doing. Any of the banquet cooks at my hotel could do what Ramirez is doing. I could do what Ramirez is doing, and I’m not a “chef” per se (although I know how to cook).

I would fire Ramirez, and his replacement would render him forgotten within a month.

By: dsquared

dsquared — Thu, 28 Apr 2011 13:52:04 +0000

Sorry, half my comment got eaten. I was just going to advise the person who wrote that excerpt against a career in restaurant proprietorship. If the entire restaurant is built around the chef and its Michelin stars, people are unlikely to beat a path to “Chef’s Table, No Longer Featuring Manny Ramirez” just because the service is apparently excellent.

By: dsquared

dsquared — Thu, 28 Apr 2011 13:49:38 +0000

>>If I was the proprietor of Chef’s Table, Cesar Ramirez would be fired. Period, end of story. << Can I advise against a career in restaurant proprietorship?

By: Benquo

Benquo — Thu, 28 Apr 2011 12:09:10 +0000

@najdorf: I don’t take notes in restaurants either, but different people have different ways of processing their experience.

By: DanHess

DanHess — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 19:01:06 +0000

Who cares what we think! His wait list is apparently months long, meaning his prices are below what the market will bear!

Spartan decor, sometime rudeness, a not-great location and yet multiple Michelin stars, the only ones in Brooklyn. Very hard-core.

New Yorkers are trying to beat a path to his door, and they are mostly not on the list.

By: ISOK

ISOK — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 17:30:05 +0000

Wow, this guy is just crippled by insecurity. How pathetic. “[Y]ou’ll never replicate this” he screams — so, uh, who cares if someone tries? Perhaps what he really fears isn’t “replication of” but “VAST IMPROVEMENT UPON?”

And I completely agree with what was mentioned above — the proper move would have been to accept Ramirez’s “apology” and walk straight out of the restaurant. What a loser.

ISOK

By: DanHess

DanHess — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 16:23:59 +0000

What a character… a tortured artist who screams at his customers and then tries to hug them afterwards. Customers who say how much they wanted to leave but stay until every last morsel is devoured!

I’d eat there once with my wife on a very special occasion such as our anniversary, for we have no idea what a 20 course meal is like that is not a buffet.

By: EricVincent

EricVincent — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 16:23:19 +0000

If I was the proprietor of Chef’s Table, Cesar Ramirez would be fired. Period, end of story.

What he did to Sifton and his wife, was a disgrace to the entire profession.

Any attempt to claim otherwise, is to either declare total ignorance of the profession, or express a complete lack of respect for it.

It wouldn’t be called the HOSPITALITY INDUSTRY if it was okay to yell f*** in a costumer’s face in front of his wife. HELLO!

By: pot

pot — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 14:59:11 +0000

The behavior of the Chef means either he is a mean egoistical “bully” or a normal guy who worked his butt off to get to where he is and paranoid about defending his “turf” which in turn made him loose his reasoning capabilities for a few moments.

What ever be the case as someone mentioned in the comments…No one should be yelled at by strangers in public…a chef of a “classy” restaurant should show some class and decency.

For those who are puzzled by why would one want to take notes…I would personally do that if I am paying more that $400 for a meal where 20 courses are served…I do not know about others…I sure as hell will not remember each thing I ate let alone the nuances of each dish…And maybe I find these “notes” a year from now and reminisce about the whole experience with family or friends…On the other hand..being yelled at by the Chef in public will for sure be burned into my memory. A vindictive person will surly want to meet this Chef in neutral domain somewhere…

By: dWj

dWj — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 14:27:09 +0000

Najdorf’s final point — “If you don’t like it, you don’t have to eat there.” — is exactly why Stein was writing his piece, or, indeed, why any reviewer writes about anything; we all now know that we don’t want to eat there because the chef is insane and will ruin people’s dining experience.

The rule itself, if it’s insane, is in the lightly-neurotic range, and this would have been a lot different if he had walked up and said, “Excuse me, would you mind showing me what you’ve been writing?” If a diner stood up on his chair in the middle of the meal, dropped his trousers, and urinated on the table at a fine restaurant, I would expect someone to calmly walk up to him and say, “I’m sorry, sir, but we have to ask you to leave.” Yelling at him makes it even more of a disruption to other diners, and is not going to improve *their* experiences, either. (As dsquared may be noting, it’s possible that Stein’s looking like he was hiding something didn’t help here.)

By: najdorf

najdorf — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 14:24:56 +0000

Benquo: Sure I’ve kept mementos. I’m just honestly confused by the behavior of note-taking in a restaurant. I take notes in a technical class or when getting specific instructions from a boss. When I go out to eat, I’m there to eat and enjoy, not write a permanent record.

By: thispaceforsale

thispaceforsale — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 14:04:19 +0000

No one should get yelled at, not at work, not while dining, not at a store. If the restaurant has a policy against note taking, the civil way to address this would be for the chef to come out, ask if the patrons like the meal, how everything is going and then remind the patron that the restaurant has a policy forbidding note taking. Maybe the policy is misguided, but at this point the note taking should stop. The rules of the house should be respected, but they are not a hammer.
Defending one’s work is fine, but bullying is inexcusable.

By: Benquo

Benquo — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 12:50:10 +0000

@najdorf: Maybe someone who enjoys good food, wants to treasure the happy memory thereof, and will remember it better if it’s written down. Have you ever retained a memento?

By: LadyH

LadyH — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 09:46:27 +0000

Expensive restaurants are like art galleries with paintings made of smeared elephant dung and sculptures of dead animals.

Its all about the kick of who is not there rather than what is there.

Myself, I like my local gastro pub where the chef has a way with game and local seafood and his wife and staff are happy to have a chat and a laugh when serving.

By: fresnodan

fresnodan — Wed, 27 Apr 2011 08:44:15 +0000

Only shows that the whole concept of “intellectual property” is reaching its absurd conclusion.