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	<title>Comments on: Esther Dyson&#8217;s hopes for Russia</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/</link>
	<description>A slice of lime in the soda</description>
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		<title>By: verdigreen</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35388</link>
		<dc:creator>verdigreen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jan 2012 17:04:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35388</guid>
		<description>Russian Total Fertility Rate has been steadily growing (from 1.16 in 1999 to 1.54 in 2009, even higher now) and mortality falling (life expectancy at birth went up from a rock bottom of ca. 65 years in early 2000es to estimated 70.3 years in 2011). Correspondingly, natural decline went from about 6.5 ppm in early 2000es to likely 1 ppm in 2011. Even with grossly under-counted migration, the population was essentially stable in the last three years. Latest Census (2010) found about 1 million more people in the country than expected (0.7% of expected population), in contrast to Latvia where Census discovered 158 thousand missing (7% of expected number). It is much more likely than not that in the next decade to population will be either stagnant or increase marginally.

While upwards of 1.54 TFR is much lower than replacement rates, in Europe this number is beaten only by Scandinavian countries, Netherlands, Belgium, UK, France, Ireland, couple of Baltic countries, and Serbia. The rest of Europe has it worse.

So, the demographic trends are unambiguously positive, unlike in many other places. On immigration - whatever the way local population looks at it, this is fact of life. Immigration-related tensions are causing the rise of right wing parties across the whole of Europe, which makes Russia not exceptional at all. A normal (and improving) country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Russian Total Fertility Rate has been steadily growing (from 1.16 in 1999 to 1.54 in 2009, even higher now) and mortality falling (life expectancy at birth went up from a rock bottom of ca. 65 years in early 2000es to estimated 70.3 years in 2011). Correspondingly, natural decline went from about 6.5 ppm in early 2000es to likely 1 ppm in 2011. Even with grossly under-counted migration, the population was essentially stable in the last three years. Latest Census (2010) found about 1 million more people in the country than expected (0.7% of expected population), in contrast to Latvia where Census discovered 158 thousand missing (7% of expected number). It is much more likely than not that in the next decade to population will be either stagnant or increase marginally.</p>
<p>While upwards of 1.54 TFR is much lower than replacement rates, in Europe this number is beaten only by Scandinavian countries, Netherlands, Belgium, UK, France, Ireland, couple of Baltic countries, and Serbia. The rest of Europe has it worse.</p>
<p>So, the demographic trends are unambiguously positive, unlike in many other places. On immigration &#8211; whatever the way local population looks at it, this is fact of life. Immigration-related tensions are causing the rise of right wing parties across the whole of Europe, which makes Russia not exceptional at all. A normal (and improving) country.</p>
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		<title>By: SelenesMom</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35350</link>
		<dc:creator>SelenesMom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 17:03:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35350</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d like to see some drilldown into the Russian mortality rate as well.  I thought that lifespans were mostly held down by heavy smoking, heavy drinking, crap in the environment (pollution, poor standards of food safety, Chernobyl etc. etc.) and lack of disposables in most people&#039;s medical care.  This could be out of date -- has progress been made on any of these fronts, or is it likely?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d like to see some drilldown into the Russian mortality rate as well.  I thought that lifespans were mostly held down by heavy smoking, heavy drinking, crap in the environment (pollution, poor standards of food safety, Chernobyl etc. etc.) and lack of disposables in most people&#8217;s medical care.  This could be out of date &#8212; has progress been made on any of these fronts, or is it likely?</p>
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		<title>By: johnhhaskell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35340</link>
		<dc:creator>johnhhaskell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 11:39:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35340</guid>
		<description>There is definitely undercounting of &quot;recent immigrants,&quot; you will see them at just about any building site or meat packing plant in European Russia.  

They are not here legally, which is why they aren&#039;t counted.  We can use Uzbek and Tajik immigration to argue that Russia is not facing a demographic problem, but we would be looking at the problem in a manner which is, let&#039;s say, very different from the way the Russians look at it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is definitely undercounting of &#8220;recent immigrants,&#8221; you will see them at just about any building site or meat packing plant in European Russia.  </p>
<p>They are not here legally, which is why they aren&#8217;t counted.  We can use Uzbek and Tajik immigration to argue that Russia is not facing a demographic problem, but we would be looking at the problem in a manner which is, let&#8217;s say, very different from the way the Russians look at it.</p>
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		<title>By: malcolmgladwell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35339</link>
		<dc:creator>malcolmgladwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:53:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35339</guid>
		<description>In answer to your questions, yes and yes--although I would describe my book as a thoughtful book on not thinking. :-)  On the second, 1.54 is also not unusually low if you consider that as recently as 1999 it was 1.16. And if you also consider that there is probably undercounting of recent immigrants with substantially higher birth rates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In answer to your questions, yes and yes&#8211;although I would describe my book as a thoughtful book on not thinking. :-)  On the second, 1.54 is also not unusually low if you consider that as recently as 1999 it was 1.16. And if you also consider that there is probably undercounting of recent immigrants with substantially higher birth rates.</p>
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		<title>By: johnhhaskell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35337</link>
		<dc:creator>johnhhaskell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 06:13:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35337</guid>
		<description>@ Felix - I assure you with 100% certainty that Mikhail Prokhorov&#039;s bid for the Presidency will fail.  He was selected for a reason, the reason being his demonstrated inability to manage even the tiny &quot;Union of Right Forces&quot; which collapsed in acrimony last summer.

@ Matthew Saroff- the RTS trades at a p/e of 5.  Is that usually the price earnings multiple that you find in a theme that is &quot;played out&quot;?

@MalcolmGladwell- is that the real Malcolm Gladwell who wrote a book about not thinking?  The World Bank puts Russia&#039;s fertility per woman at 1.54.  I guess that&#039;s not &quot;unusually low&quot; because a lot of European countries have fertility rates below replacement?

@DCWright both the Bolotnaya and Sakharova protests were organized on Facebook.  No firearms were present at either event BTW

@Realist50 Does Russia censor the Internet?  Okay then.  Why are you here</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Felix &#8211; I assure you with 100% certainty that Mikhail Prokhorov&#8217;s bid for the Presidency will fail.  He was selected for a reason, the reason being his demonstrated inability to manage even the tiny &#8220;Union of Right Forces&#8221; which collapsed in acrimony last summer.</p>
<p>@ Matthew Saroff- the RTS trades at a p/e of 5.  Is that usually the price earnings multiple that you find in a theme that is &#8220;played out&#8221;?</p>
<p>@MalcolmGladwell- is that the real Malcolm Gladwell who wrote a book about not thinking?  The World Bank puts Russia&#8217;s fertility per woman at 1.54.  I guess that&#8217;s not &#8220;unusually low&#8221; because a lot of European countries have fertility rates below replacement?</p>
<p>@DCWright both the Bolotnaya and Sakharova protests were organized on Facebook.  No firearms were present at either event BTW</p>
<p>@Realist50 Does Russia censor the Internet?  Okay then.  Why are you here</p>
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		<title>By: realist50</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35336</link>
		<dc:creator>realist50</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 02:50:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35336</guid>
		<description>I remember similar theories about China 10 or 15 year ago, that the Internet would doom Chinese censorship and then authoritarianism would inevitably be swept aside. Certainly not happening as quickly or inevitably as the techno-optimists thought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember similar theories about China 10 or 15 year ago, that the Internet would doom Chinese censorship and then authoritarianism would inevitably be swept aside. Certainly not happening as quickly or inevitably as the techno-optimists thought.</p>
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		<title>By: DCWright</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35335</link>
		<dc:creator>DCWright</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 02:31:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35335</guid>
		<description>Word to Dollared.

Russia has produced fantastic, wire-and-duct-tape engineers since early soviet times, and it never did much to produce a civil society. If anything, engineers tend to be susceptible to technocratic, top-down, command-and-control ideas of societal optimization.

I have no doubt that, when the next Russian revolution comes, the revolutionaries will use social media. They will also use telephones, printing presses, and probably guns. But that doesn&#039;t mean that social media are culturally transformative in the way the techno-utopians like Dyson seem to imagine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Word to Dollared.</p>
<p>Russia has produced fantastic, wire-and-duct-tape engineers since early soviet times, and it never did much to produce a civil society. If anything, engineers tend to be susceptible to technocratic, top-down, command-and-control ideas of societal optimization.</p>
<p>I have no doubt that, when the next Russian revolution comes, the revolutionaries will use social media. They will also use telephones, printing presses, and probably guns. But that doesn&#8217;t mean that social media are culturally transformative in the way the techno-utopians like Dyson seem to imagine.</p>
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		<title>By: Dollared</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35333</link>
		<dc:creator>Dollared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 00:04:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35333</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m a bit tired of the technology folks describing their economy and culture as the one-size-fits-all-solution to all problems. 

It hasn&#039;t exactly made California heaven for everyone but the golden few who either 1) held equity or 2) held real estate.  

And no, high tech does not lead to greater &quot;freedom.&quot; It just makes young white guys overconfident about the future before they are riffed at age 42 and replaced by low cost Asian workers.  

But there is never a shortage of Esther Dysons suggesting that Russia, or Singapore, or Seattle, or Sheffield, adopt the &quot;Silicon Valley Model.&quot; And then they get back on their planes and head back to their weekend places in Half Moon Bay....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a bit tired of the technology folks describing their economy and culture as the one-size-fits-all-solution to all problems. </p>
<p>It hasn&#8217;t exactly made California heaven for everyone but the golden few who either 1) held equity or 2) held real estate.  </p>
<p>And no, high tech does not lead to greater &#8220;freedom.&#8221; It just makes young white guys overconfident about the future before they are riffed at age 42 and replaced by low cost Asian workers.  </p>
<p>But there is never a shortage of Esther Dysons suggesting that Russia, or Singapore, or Seattle, or Sheffield, adopt the &#8220;Silicon Valley Model.&#8221; And then they get back on their planes and head back to their weekend places in Half Moon Bay&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: malcolmgladwell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35332</link>
		<dc:creator>malcolmgladwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jan 2012 23:53:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35332</guid>
		<description>You should look again at the Russian population numbers, Felix, since the country&#039;s demographic situation seems to have improved in recent years. Russia had a real population increase in 2009--independent of immigration. And there are some experts who think that the actual immigration numbers are far higher--maybe three or four or five times higher--than the official numbers. One more thing. A population crisis caused by an unusually high mortality rate (Russia&#039;s problem) is a lot easier to fix than a population crisis caused by an unusually low fertility rate (not Russia&#039;s problem). Russia isn&#039;t Japan--which has the opposite issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You should look again at the Russian population numbers, Felix, since the country&#8217;s demographic situation seems to have improved in recent years. Russia had a real population increase in 2009&#8211;independent of immigration. And there are some experts who think that the actual immigration numbers are far higher&#8211;maybe three or four or five times higher&#8211;than the official numbers. One more thing. A population crisis caused by an unusually high mortality rate (Russia&#8217;s problem) is a lot easier to fix than a population crisis caused by an unusually low fertility rate (not Russia&#8217;s problem). Russia isn&#8217;t Japan&#8211;which has the opposite issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew_Saroff</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/01/25/esther-dysons-hopes-for-russia/comment-page-1/#comment-35328</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew_Saroff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jan 2012 21:30:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=12020#comment-35328</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t mean to sound too nasty, but if Esther Dyson is bullish on Russia, I’m going short.

She ain&#039;t Goldman, by which I mean that she doesn&#039;t short what she recommends to her clients, but when she goes bullish on something, I figure that it&#039;s pretty much played out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t mean to sound too nasty, but if Esther Dyson is bullish on Russia, I’m going short.</p>
<p>She ain&#8217;t Goldman, by which I mean that she doesn&#8217;t short what she recommends to her clients, but when she goes bullish on something, I figure that it&#8217;s pretty much played out.</p>
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