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	<title>Comments on: Facebook: The List of Incompetents</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/</link>
	<description>A slice of lime in the soda</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 23:33:55 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: slocklin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39669</link>
		<dc:creator>slocklin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2012 06:41:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39669</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t always trust them as a source (for example, I think these plots are generated from UQDF rather than TotalView), but Nanex has an interesting presentation on the topic showing stuff breaking:

http://www.nanex.net/aqck/3099.html

FWIIW, the facebook link thingee I tried to use to log in here wanted to give Reuters access to all my data. Irony.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t always trust them as a source (for example, I think these plots are generated from UQDF rather than TotalView), but Nanex has an interesting presentation on the topic showing stuff breaking:</p>
<p><a href='http://www.nanex.net/aqck/3099.html'>http://www.nanex.net/aqck/3099.html</a></p>
<p>FWIIW, the facebook link thingee I tried to use to log in here wanted to give Reuters access to all my data. Irony.</p>
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		<title>By: Montanareddog</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39477</link>
		<dc:creator>Montanareddog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 07:46:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39477</guid>
		<description>&quot;All of which means that the winners in this whole game were you and I: the quiet skeptical masses who simply sat back and watched the farce unfold.&quot; 

Really? Were there no pension funds and the like suckered into this either?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;All of which means that the winners in this whole game were you and I: the quiet skeptical masses who simply sat back and watched the farce unfold.&#8221; </p>
<p>Really? Were there no pension funds and the like suckered into this either?</p>
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		<title>By: scythe</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39456</link>
		<dc:creator>scythe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 17:34:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39456</guid>
		<description>(quote) &quot;was it a good move for Zuckerberg to fleece the investing public&quot;? 

like a pseudo-friend feeding on the insecure and the narcissistic 

if you need facebook to announce yourself to friends and the rest, then this IPO will keep your life online

however soon expect to receive a bill for the service - zuckerburger will offer your online &quot;need to keep your life&quot; to placate the angry (stupid) investors (all 901,000,000 of you)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(quote) &#8220;was it a good move for Zuckerberg to fleece the investing public&#8221;? </p>
<p>like a pseudo-friend feeding on the insecure and the narcissistic </p>
<p>if you need facebook to announce yourself to friends and the rest, then this IPO will keep your life online</p>
<p>however soon expect to receive a bill for the service &#8211; zuckerburger will offer your online &#8220;need to keep your life&#8221; to placate the angry (stupid) investors (all 901,000,000 of you)</p>
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		<title>By: BajaArizona</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39455</link>
		<dc:creator>BajaArizona</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 17:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39455</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the link, danyzn.  Grammar Girl to the rescue yet again!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the link, danyzn.  Grammar Girl to the rescue yet again!</p>
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		<title>By: ckbryant</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39450</link>
		<dc:creator>ckbryant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 14:23:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39450</guid>
		<description>&quot;...completely inconsistent with a desire to sell $16 billion of shares at a $104 billion valuation...&quot;

Perhaps you missed the part where he did exactly that?  Now, in the long term, was it a good move for Zuckerberg to fleece the investing public like that?  An interesting question.  But nothing I&#039;ve ever read or heard about the man suggests it&#039;s out of character.  Have fun, shareholders!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8230;completely inconsistent with a desire to sell $16 billion of shares at a $104 billion valuation&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Perhaps you missed the part where he did exactly that?  Now, in the long term, was it a good move for Zuckerberg to fleece the investing public like that?  An interesting question.  But nothing I&#8217;ve ever read or heard about the man suggests it&#8217;s out of character.  Have fun, shareholders!</p>
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		<title>By: MichaelOlivero</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39439</link>
		<dc:creator>MichaelOlivero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 05:16:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39439</guid>
		<description>Well summarize Felix.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well summarize Felix.</p>
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		<title>By: Meistro</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39435</link>
		<dc:creator>Meistro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 03:08:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39435</guid>
		<description>Facebook&#039;s IPO was extremely successful, especially for the company. The CFO did an amazing job getting the highest dollar price and selling the most shares possible. That is his job and he hire Morgan Stanley and other banks to conduct a sales and marketing pitch.  They did their job very well too.  The fact that investors who purchased the shares screwed up has nothing to do w/the success of Morgan Stanley and the success of Facebook... this IPO was a HUGE SUCCESS. 

http://stegermeister.blogspot.com/2012/05/facebooks-ipo-was-extremely-succesful.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Facebook&#8217;s IPO was extremely successful, especially for the company. The CFO did an amazing job getting the highest dollar price and selling the most shares possible. That is his job and he hire Morgan Stanley and other banks to conduct a sales and marketing pitch.  They did their job very well too.  The fact that investors who purchased the shares screwed up has nothing to do w/the success of Morgan Stanley and the success of Facebook&#8230; this IPO was a HUGE SUCCESS. </p>
<p><a href='http://stegermeister.blogspot.com/2012/05/facebooks-ipo-was-extremely-succesful.html'>http://stegermeister.blogspot.com/2012/0 5/facebooks-ipo-was-extremely-succesful. html</a></p>
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		<title>By: GenLee</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39432</link>
		<dc:creator>GenLee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 01:54:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39432</guid>
		<description>http://imgur.com/sNgiX</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href='http://imgur.com/sNgiX'>http://imgur.com/sNgiX</a></p>
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		<title>By: raghavrk</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39431</link>
		<dc:creator>raghavrk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 23:18:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39431</guid>
		<description>&quot;It&#039;s me&quot; is plenty traditional, according to MWDEU:

&quot;... thinking verily it had been her.&quot; —Samuel Pepys, diary, 1 Oct. 1666
&quot;It is not me you are in love with.&quot; —Sir Richard Steele, The Spectator, No. 290, 1 Feb. 1712
&quot;Ah, it is her you love.&quot; —Charles Reade, Hard Cash, 1863
&quot;For it was not her one hated but the idea of her.&quot; —Virginia Woolf, Mrs. Dalloway, 1925

That said, Felix&#039;s sentence is totally fine as well. Respectable people use both &quot;me&quot; and &quot;I&quot; after the verb &quot;to be.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s me&#8221; is plenty traditional, according to MWDEU:</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230; thinking verily it had been her.&#8221; —Samuel Pepys, diary, 1 Oct. 1666<br />
&#8220;It is not me you are in love with.&#8221; —Sir Richard Steele, The Spectator, No. 290, 1 Feb. 1712<br />
&#8220;Ah, it is her you love.&#8221; —Charles Reade, Hard Cash, 1863<br />
&#8220;For it was not her one hated but the idea of her.&#8221; —Virginia Woolf, Mrs. Dalloway, 1925</p>
<p>That said, Felix&#8217;s sentence is totally fine as well. Respectable people use both &#8220;me&#8221; and &#8220;I&#8221; after the verb &#8220;to be.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: BrPH</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39430</link>
		<dc:creator>BrPH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 23:15:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39430</guid>
		<description>Oh, come on Felix. What is the purpose of a stock offering? It is NOT to provide quick, speculative profits to buyers. 

The purpose of an IPO is to raise money for a company - period. If you are the fiduciary of the company, you sell stock at the maximum price you can manage so your company recieves the maximum amount of cash for the smallest number of shares. 

Facebook did that perfectly. Facebook generated a huge amount of money that it can now use. So the stock price has drifted down? As far as Facebook is concerned, all shares already sold are money in the bank. Facebook can always sell more. 

You honestly forgot that the secondary market for shares is exactly that - secondary? Buy and hold Facebook for 7 years and you will make lots of money. Stock prices always fluctuate. 

Would I buy Facebook at $38 a share now? Naah. I&#039;ll buy, but later on. But looking at it with my entrepreneur hat on, Facebook played its hand very well. 

Now let&#039;s see what Zuckerberg does with all that money he raised. I think he&#039;ll do fine. 

Your plaffle on the hoodie thing? Oh-for-god&#039;s-sake-you-can&#039;t-be-serious. What more proof is there that Zuckerberg is playing his position flawlessly could there be than getting top dollar for Facebook? That&#039;s his job! His job is NOT to lowball the price in order to put money that could go into building his company in everyone else&#039;s greedy pockets. What-on-earth-are-you-thinking? 

A company has zero fiduciary duty to a buyer of shares until after those shares are bought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, come on Felix. What is the purpose of a stock offering? It is NOT to provide quick, speculative profits to buyers. </p>
<p>The purpose of an IPO is to raise money for a company &#8211; period. If you are the fiduciary of the company, you sell stock at the maximum price you can manage so your company recieves the maximum amount of cash for the smallest number of shares. </p>
<p>Facebook did that perfectly. Facebook generated a huge amount of money that it can now use. So the stock price has drifted down? As far as Facebook is concerned, all shares already sold are money in the bank. Facebook can always sell more. </p>
<p>You honestly forgot that the secondary market for shares is exactly that &#8211; secondary? Buy and hold Facebook for 7 years and you will make lots of money. Stock prices always fluctuate. </p>
<p>Would I buy Facebook at $38 a share now? Naah. I&#8217;ll buy, but later on. But looking at it with my entrepreneur hat on, Facebook played its hand very well. </p>
<p>Now let&#8217;s see what Zuckerberg does with all that money he raised. I think he&#8217;ll do fine. </p>
<p>Your plaffle on the hoodie thing? Oh-for-god&#8217;s-sake-you-can&#8217;t-be-serious. What more proof is there that Zuckerberg is playing his position flawlessly could there be than getting top dollar for Facebook? That&#8217;s his job! His job is NOT to lowball the price in order to put money that could go into building his company in everyone else&#8217;s greedy pockets. What-on-earth-are-you-thinking? </p>
<p>A company has zero fiduciary duty to a buyer of shares until after those shares are bought.</p>
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		<title>By: handleym99</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39427</link>
		<dc:creator>handleym99</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 22:08:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39427</guid>
		<description>Felix, might I suggest that you unpack your thinking a bit more as to what you think was some kind of error.

The screwups regarding execution are clearly bungling for which there is no justification. 

The screwup regarding projected 2nd quarter earnings I have no strong feelings about. I assume there are general expectations of behavior here, but I can&#039;t say I&#039;m wild about a system that decides to supplement the official release of material company info with unofficial releases of that info to favored parties; so I can&#039;t say I&#039;m especially outraged when this system broke down.

However you seem to be especially upset about the fact that the IPO opened at 38, didn&#039;t rise much, and fell to 32. I can&#039;t see what this outrage is based on. I&#039;m not a social darwinist, thrilled by every example of the strong preying on the week; but I also don&#039;t think we can completely protect people from their stupidity. You (to take a prominent example) were very vocal in saying that this was not an IPO for which participation made sense for most people. Zuckerberg had made his lack of interest in the whole affair, and the fact that he will run FB as he wishes, quite clear for a long time. 
Even after all this, you now seem outraged that things played out pretty much precisely as you predicted. Why exactly should I be outraged? 

There seems to be a very strange mental model here of the purpose of an IPO. The purpose of the IPO, surely, is to raise MAXIMUM REVENUE FOR THE COMPANY. it&#039;s not to make Wall Street rich; it&#039;s not to reward cronies. This IPO succeeded spectacularly in that goal. There&#039;s justified outrage, yes, if there are lies and misrepresentations about how much money FB will make, but we all know FB is a gamble. And if you want to gamble on FB, your attitude should be buy and hold for a few years, not buy and be upset that you can&#039;t flip tomorrow.,

Looks like a whole lot of Stockholm syndrome to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Felix, might I suggest that you unpack your thinking a bit more as to what you think was some kind of error.</p>
<p>The screwups regarding execution are clearly bungling for which there is no justification. </p>
<p>The screwup regarding projected 2nd quarter earnings I have no strong feelings about. I assume there are general expectations of behavior here, but I can&#8217;t say I&#8217;m wild about a system that decides to supplement the official release of material company info with unofficial releases of that info to favored parties; so I can&#8217;t say I&#8217;m especially outraged when this system broke down.</p>
<p>However you seem to be especially upset about the fact that the IPO opened at 38, didn&#8217;t rise much, and fell to 32. I can&#8217;t see what this outrage is based on. I&#8217;m not a social darwinist, thrilled by every example of the strong preying on the week; but I also don&#8217;t think we can completely protect people from their stupidity. You (to take a prominent example) were very vocal in saying that this was not an IPO for which participation made sense for most people. Zuckerberg had made his lack of interest in the whole affair, and the fact that he will run FB as he wishes, quite clear for a long time.<br />
Even after all this, you now seem outraged that things played out pretty much precisely as you predicted. Why exactly should I be outraged? </p>
<p>There seems to be a very strange mental model here of the purpose of an IPO. The purpose of the IPO, surely, is to raise MAXIMUM REVENUE FOR THE COMPANY. it&#8217;s not to make Wall Street rich; it&#8217;s not to reward cronies. This IPO succeeded spectacularly in that goal. There&#8217;s justified outrage, yes, if there are lies and misrepresentations about how much money FB will make, but we all know FB is a gamble. And if you want to gamble on FB, your attitude should be buy and hold for a few years, not buy and be upset that you can&#8217;t flip tomorrow.,</p>
<p>Looks like a whole lot of Stockholm syndrome to me.</p>
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		<title>By: danyzn</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39418</link>
		<dc:creator>danyzn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 19:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39418</guid>
		<description>Actually Felix is correct according to traditional grammar: &quot;it is I&quot; not &quot;it is me&quot;.

http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/grammar-linking-verbs.aspx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually Felix is correct according to traditional grammar: &#8220;it is I&#8221; not &#8220;it is me&#8221;.</p>
<p><a href='http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/grammar-linking-verbs.aspx'>http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/gra mmar-linking-verbs.aspx</a></p>
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		<title>By: ottorock</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39416</link>
		<dc:creator>ottorock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 18:52:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39416</guid>
		<description>Oh dear, Henry &quot;Zuck-Da-Man!&quot; Blodget is going to fall out with Salmon again.

Hey Henry, we adored how you were talking the &quot;$74 bids in Europe!!&quot; (your exclamatives, not mine) last Friday. By the way, the adjective i&#039;d prefer to use for you isn&#039;t allowed on the Reuters comments section.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh dear, Henry &#8220;Zuck-Da-Man!&#8221; Blodget is going to fall out with Salmon again.</p>
<p>Hey Henry, we adored how you were talking the &#8220;$74 bids in Europe!!&#8221; (your exclamatives, not mine) last Friday. By the way, the adjective i&#8217;d prefer to use for you isn&#8217;t allowed on the Reuters comments section.</p>
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		<title>By: KyleDexter</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39413</link>
		<dc:creator>KyleDexter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 18:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39413</guid>
		<description>@Felix Salmon, this is your best piece ever!!!
I couldn&#039;t have said it better myself. The only people who came out winners were people like us who know that Facebook is way overvalued.........</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Felix Salmon, this is your best piece ever!!!<br />
I couldn&#8217;t have said it better myself. The only people who came out winners were people like us who know that Facebook is way overvalued&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: GMAFB</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/05/23/facebook-the-list-of-incompetents/comment-page-1/#comment-39412</link>
		<dc:creator>GMAFB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 18:26:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=14291#comment-39412</guid>
		<description>Devil&#039;s advocate would say that Ebersman and Grimes did their jobs, which for Ebersman was to maximize the dollars raised in the IPO, and for Grimes was to maximize the lead book-runner&#039;s fee for Morgan Stanley.  They were able to sell the most shares they possibly could at the highest possible price.  What happens on the secondary market is not as much a concern for them.  True, they lined the pockets of the insiders and screwed anyone who bought at the IPO price, but isn&#039;t that what the people who pay them expect them to do?  I&#039;m not saying it&#039;s pretty, fair, or ethical, but that&#039;s the way the game is played.  I would argue that NASDAQ is most at fault.  Botching the opening probably spooked the market, generated rumors, and created enough of a hesitation for investors waiting to buy that the demand slacked off within the first hour of trading.  Had the opening been executed flawlessly, there may have been enough momentum for the price to pop on the first day like people were hoping.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Devil&#8217;s advocate would say that Ebersman and Grimes did their jobs, which for Ebersman was to maximize the dollars raised in the IPO, and for Grimes was to maximize the lead book-runner&#8217;s fee for Morgan Stanley.  They were able to sell the most shares they possibly could at the highest possible price.  What happens on the secondary market is not as much a concern for them.  True, they lined the pockets of the insiders and screwed anyone who bought at the IPO price, but isn&#8217;t that what the people who pay them expect them to do?  I&#8217;m not saying it&#8217;s pretty, fair, or ethical, but that&#8217;s the way the game is played.  I would argue that NASDAQ is most at fault.  Botching the opening probably spooked the market, generated rumors, and created enough of a hesitation for investors waiting to buy that the demand slacked off within the first hour of trading.  Had the opening been executed flawlessly, there may have been enough momentum for the price to pop on the first day like people were hoping.</p>
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