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	<title>Comments on: When Zuckerberg fired Morgan Stanley, mortgage edition</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/</link>
	<description>A slice of lime in the soda</description>
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		<title>By: TFF</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41874</link>
		<dc:creator>TFF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:52:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41874</guid>
		<description>@MrRFox, if blogs are &quot;not at all to serve the commenters&quot;, then why do they permit commenting? As a public service?

As with any ecology, the blog system must serve all participants to remain healthy. Traditional press serves the readers and authors, if that is your preference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@MrRFox, if blogs are &#8220;not at all to serve the commenters&#8221;, then why do they permit commenting? As a public service?</p>
<p>As with any ecology, the blog system must serve all participants to remain healthy. Traditional press serves the readers and authors, if that is your preference.</p>
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		<title>By: MrRFox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41870</link>
		<dc:creator>MrRFox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jul 2012 03:14:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41870</guid>
		<description>I believe it is correct to say that commercial blogs exist first and foremost to serve the interests of their readers, and secondarily to serve the interests of the authors - and not at all to serve the commenters. One should post comments with that in mind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe it is correct to say that commercial blogs exist first and foremost to serve the interests of their readers, and secondarily to serve the interests of the authors &#8211; and not at all to serve the commenters. One should post comments with that in mind.</p>
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		<title>By: KenG_CA</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41859</link>
		<dc:creator>KenG_CA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 13:11:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41859</guid>
		<description>MrFox, are you suggesting this blog wasn&#039;t created so two guys, who don&#039;t know each other and have never met, can exchange ideas and opinions?  

The Valley elite will start shunning Zuckerberg when the rest of the world recognizes Facebook for the narcissistic time sink that it is, and moves on to the next cool thing.  The valley only likes people and companies on the way up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MrFox, are you suggesting this blog wasn&#8217;t created so two guys, who don&#8217;t know each other and have never met, can exchange ideas and opinions?  </p>
<p>The Valley elite will start shunning Zuckerberg when the rest of the world recognizes Facebook for the narcissistic time sink that it is, and moves on to the next cool thing.  The valley only likes people and companies on the way up.</p>
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		<title>By: Sechel</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41857</link>
		<dc:creator>Sechel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 09:49:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41857</guid>
		<description>At the rate mortgage rate Zuckerberg got, Morgan Stanley did not so much as loose a return on capital but got capital freed up. Sounds like they won on the mortgage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At the rate mortgage rate Zuckerberg got, Morgan Stanley did not so much as loose a return on capital but got capital freed up. Sounds like they won on the mortgage.</p>
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		<title>By: youniquelikeme</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41854</link>
		<dc:creator>youniquelikeme</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 06:25:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41854</guid>
		<description>I have the Beverly Hillbillies song running through my head now and visions of Milburn rubbing his hands together gleefully for having scored such a fine, upstanding citizen and nouveau riche client.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have the Beverly Hillbillies song running through my head now and visions of Milburn rubbing his hands together gleefully for having scored such a fine, upstanding citizen and nouveau riche client.</p>
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		<title>By: MrRFox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41853</link>
		<dc:creator>MrRFox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 06:03:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41853</guid>
		<description>** wonders if the Ken &amp; Taffy Show is concluded yet **

When one examines Z’berg’s record, starting back in school, at the time FB was merely the germ of an idea, and continuing to today, one constant stands out – with grim predictability he fu…-over any and every muppet who gives him the opportunity to do so; while being careful not to inflict damage on certain major-league shylocks, who are tougher and more unprincipled than he is. His presence pollutes The Valley – he’s NY/NJ all the way, FB having nothing whatsoever to do with &#039;tech&#039;. Really should do something about that. The Valley elite can start by shunning him, his wife and his company – and WTH, his dog too.

And MS - turns out he made muppets of them as well. IMO they are fortunate to be free of the malign soul; he can’t hurt them any more now. (Not like they didn’t have it coming, being what they are - so at least there’s that ‘silver lining’.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>** wonders if the Ken &#038; Taffy Show is concluded yet **</p>
<p>When one examines Z’berg’s record, starting back in school, at the time FB was merely the germ of an idea, and continuing to today, one constant stands out – with grim predictability he fu…-over any and every muppet who gives him the opportunity to do so; while being careful not to inflict damage on certain major-league shylocks, who are tougher and more unprincipled than he is. His presence pollutes The Valley – he’s NY/NJ all the way, FB having nothing whatsoever to do with &#8216;tech&#8217;. Really should do something about that. The Valley elite can start by shunning him, his wife and his company – and WTH, his dog too.</p>
<p>And MS &#8211; turns out he made muppets of them as well. IMO they are fortunate to be free of the malign soul; he can’t hurt them any more now. (Not like they didn’t have it coming, being what they are &#8211; so at least there’s that ‘silver lining’.)</p>
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		<title>By: TFF</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41851</link>
		<dc:creator>TFF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 02:52:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41851</guid>
		<description>Excellent point, y2kurtus.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent point, y2kurtus.</p>
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		<title>By: y2kurtus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41850</link>
		<dc:creator>y2kurtus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 02:02:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41850</guid>
		<description>The bottom line is Zuck is getting crappy advice. As others have already pointed out the value of that sweet loan deal are meaningless to someone worth +10billion. 

The us vs them 99% vs .0001% is something that he will deal with the rest of his life. Details about his personal finances being needlessly made public are nothing short of foolish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The bottom line is Zuck is getting crappy advice. As others have already pointed out the value of that sweet loan deal are meaningless to someone worth +10billion. </p>
<p>The us vs them 99% vs .0001% is something that he will deal with the rest of his life. Details about his personal finances being needlessly made public are nothing short of foolish.</p>
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		<title>By: FifthDecade</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41849</link>
		<dc:creator>FifthDecade</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2012 00:48:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41849</guid>
		<description>Is that 0.8% above &#039;Barclays LIBOR&#039; or above &#039;Real&#039; LIBOR?

Ken has the same memory I do, Sugarmountain sold about £50m worth of shares through a private deal with Goldman Sachs a while back. How much of that was his personally, how much stayed in the biz, and how much went to VCs I don&#039;t recall, but there was definitely enough to make me surprised he has a mortgage at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is that 0.8% above &#8216;Barclays LIBOR&#8217; or above &#8216;Real&#8217; LIBOR?</p>
<p>Ken has the same memory I do, Sugarmountain sold about £50m worth of shares through a private deal with Goldman Sachs a while back. How much of that was his personally, how much stayed in the biz, and how much went to VCs I don&#8217;t recall, but there was definitely enough to make me surprised he has a mortgage at all.</p>
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		<title>By: KenG_CA</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41840</link>
		<dc:creator>KenG_CA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2012 20:26:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41840</guid>
		<description>i don&#039;t know, realist &amp; TFF, when I sold my company for the stock of a publicly traded company, I was able to sell shares in a private sale, even though the shares I received were locked up for a year.  the buyer couldn&#039;t sell the shares, but bought them and put a collar on them.  I&#039;m sure Zuckerberg has even more options at his disposal, and doesn&#039;t need to mess around with a mortgage.  He could also just as easily borrow against his shares, for about the same rate, and have all of the interest deductible, since he would most likely be &quot;investing&quot; the money that he borrows, as opposed to just deducting interest on the first $1M of his mortgage. 

One of the best things about a great liquidity event like that is that you get to pay off your mortgage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i don&#8217;t know, realist &#038; TFF, when I sold my company for the stock of a publicly traded company, I was able to sell shares in a private sale, even though the shares I received were locked up for a year.  the buyer couldn&#8217;t sell the shares, but bought them and put a collar on them.  I&#8217;m sure Zuckerberg has even more options at his disposal, and doesn&#8217;t need to mess around with a mortgage.  He could also just as easily borrow against his shares, for about the same rate, and have all of the interest deductible, since he would most likely be &#8220;investing&#8221; the money that he borrows, as opposed to just deducting interest on the first $1M of his mortgage. </p>
<p>One of the best things about a great liquidity event like that is that you get to pay off your mortgage.</p>
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		<title>By: realist50</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41839</link>
		<dc:creator>realist50</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2012 20:00:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41839</guid>
		<description>@KenG, your point on Zuckerberg selling shares previously may well be correct.  I don&#039;t personally recall reading if he did so or not, but I think that we&#039;re in agreement that his liquid assets are presently a quite small portion of his net worth.  Sort of fitting with TFF&#039;s point, my sense - which I&#039;ll admit is only an educated guess - is that Zuckerberg&#039;s liquid assets until his Facebook stock becomes freely tradeable are &quot;only&quot; in the range of $10&#039;s of millions up to perhaps a couple hundred million dollars.  It&#039;s a small enough liquid amount that I could see Zuckerberg, or his financial advisors, thinking that borrowing $5.95 million at a negative real rate makes sense.

If, on the other hand, I saw someone like Bill Gates or Warren Buffett, who own far more liquid assets, taking a mortgage in this amount I&#039;d agree that it doesn&#039;t make much sense because the dollars involved are such a small fraction of net worth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@KenG, your point on Zuckerberg selling shares previously may well be correct.  I don&#8217;t personally recall reading if he did so or not, but I think that we&#8217;re in agreement that his liquid assets are presently a quite small portion of his net worth.  Sort of fitting with TFF&#8217;s point, my sense &#8211; which I&#8217;ll admit is only an educated guess &#8211; is that Zuckerberg&#8217;s liquid assets until his Facebook stock becomes freely tradeable are &#8220;only&#8221; in the range of $10&#8242;s of millions up to perhaps a couple hundred million dollars.  It&#8217;s a small enough liquid amount that I could see Zuckerberg, or his financial advisors, thinking that borrowing $5.95 million at a negative real rate makes sense.</p>
<p>If, on the other hand, I saw someone like Bill Gates or Warren Buffett, who own far more liquid assets, taking a mortgage in this amount I&#8217;d agree that it doesn&#8217;t make much sense because the dollars involved are such a small fraction of net worth.</p>
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		<title>By: KenG_CA</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41838</link>
		<dc:creator>KenG_CA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2012 19:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41838</guid>
		<description>Maybe, TFF, but if that&#039;s the case, he will eventually realize the banker is yet one more person he has to personally manage.  And it&#039;s just not worth it, because he has to learn about all the stuff the banker is going to try to get him to invest in.  If he doesn&#039;t learn about that, he&#039;s going to wake up one day wondering how he lost so much money in a madoff scheme, or maybe just why are the returns no better than the markets in general.

In any case, my point is why do incredibly wealthy people need to maximize their income from passive activities?  Do they really need to make another few bucks?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe, TFF, but if that&#8217;s the case, he will eventually realize the banker is yet one more person he has to personally manage.  And it&#8217;s just not worth it, because he has to learn about all the stuff the banker is going to try to get him to invest in.  If he doesn&#8217;t learn about that, he&#8217;s going to wake up one day wondering how he lost so much money in a madoff scheme, or maybe just why are the returns no better than the markets in general.</p>
<p>In any case, my point is why do incredibly wealthy people need to maximize their income from passive activities?  Do they really need to make another few bucks?</p>
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		<title>By: TheBasisPoint</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41834</link>
		<dc:creator>TheBasisPoint</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2012 19:16:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41834</guid>
		<description>you nailed this Felix. I&#039;m a mortgage banker in San Francisco who cometes with First Republic. I expanded on your theme here: http://thebasispoint.com/2012/07/16/who-gave-zuckerberg-a-1-mortgage/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you nailed this Felix. I&#8217;m a mortgage banker in San Francisco who cometes with First Republic. I expanded on your theme here: <a href='http://thebasispoint.com/2012/07/16/who-gave-zuckerberg-a-1-mortgage/'>http://thebasispoint.com/2012/07/16/who- gave-zuckerberg-a-1-mortgage/</a></p>
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		<title>By: TFF</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41831</link>
		<dc:creator>TFF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2012 19:04:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41831</guid>
		<description>Isn&#039;t my playground, KenG, but I would imagine these guys have &quot;personal bankers&quot; to handle the six- and seven-figure stuff for them, so they can focus on the 10-figure stuff?

That &quot;personal banker&quot; won&#039;t be working with the full $30B, just with the liquid assets, and may feel it is worth a few hours of his time to save $140K/year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn&#8217;t my playground, KenG, but I would imagine these guys have &#8220;personal bankers&#8221; to handle the six- and seven-figure stuff for them, so they can focus on the 10-figure stuff?</p>
<p>That &#8220;personal banker&#8221; won&#8217;t be working with the full $30B, just with the liquid assets, and may feel it is worth a few hours of his time to save $140K/year.</p>
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		<title>By: KenG_CA</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/07/16/when-zuckerberg-fired-morgan-stanley-mortgage-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-41829</link>
		<dc:creator>KenG_CA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2012 17:37:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=16104#comment-41829</guid>
		<description>realist, Zuckerberg sold shares at the IPO to pay the taxes he incurred when he exercised options.  I was under the impression he had sold shares well before the IPO, on the secondary market, as he was living well beyond the means of a startup CEO&#039;s salary.  His salary is only $1 now, I believe, so he&#039;s not paying the mortgage out of his paycheck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>realist, Zuckerberg sold shares at the IPO to pay the taxes he incurred when he exercised options.  I was under the impression he had sold shares well before the IPO, on the secondary market, as he was living well beyond the means of a startup CEO&#8217;s salary.  His salary is only $1 now, I believe, so he&#8217;s not paying the mortgage out of his paycheck.</p>
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