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	<title>Comments on: Is stock-picking just another hobby for men?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/</link>
	<description>A slice of lime in the soda</description>
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		<title>By: TFF</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44884</link>
		<dc:creator>TFF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Nov 2012 02:32:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44884</guid>
		<description>Sound investing is easy. Buy quality, let it ride.

Stock-picking is devilishly hard. Keeps me humble! HPQ anyone? :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sound investing is easy. Buy quality, let it ride.</p>
<p>Stock-picking is devilishly hard. Keeps me humble! HPQ anyone? :)</p>
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		<title>By: modernist</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44882</link>
		<dc:creator>modernist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Nov 2012 00:22:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44882</guid>
		<description>Mr. Salmon, if Seeking Alpha&#039;s subscription program is dumb money, why don&#039;t you make a bet on it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Salmon, if Seeking Alpha&#8217;s subscription program is dumb money, why don&#8217;t you make a bet on it?</p>
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		<title>By: spectre855</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44876</link>
		<dc:creator>spectre855</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2012 21:56:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44876</guid>
		<description>Thought provoking post as usual Felix. I think you&#039;ve pretty well nailed this but I&#039;d also add in another aspect. I think there is a bit of the psychology of gambling involved as well. I think a lot of amateur investors look at stock picking as a form of scratch off ticket in which they think that they can tip the odds in their favor with a bit of (usually misguided) research. It&#039;s just like blackjack where everyone thinks that their method is superior and that they&#039;ll come home from the casino rich.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thought provoking post as usual Felix. I think you&#8217;ve pretty well nailed this but I&#8217;d also add in another aspect. I think there is a bit of the psychology of gambling involved as well. I think a lot of amateur investors look at stock picking as a form of scratch off ticket in which they think that they can tip the odds in their favor with a bit of (usually misguided) research. It&#8217;s just like blackjack where everyone thinks that their method is superior and that they&#8217;ll come home from the casino rich.</p>
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		<title>By: phil_20686</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44871</link>
		<dc:creator>phil_20686</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2012 15:26:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44871</guid>
		<description>You seem to have a blind spot when it comes to passive investment strategies.

Markets are basically weak form efficient, which is that they aggregate the opinions and views about the future of those traders who trade in them. 

However, this creates a natural inefficiency about time frames. Most fund investors have one year time frames, and most day traders are much shorter, so there is large inefficiencies due to a lack of large investors with long time frames. These are prime conditions for the buy and hold strategy ala Buffet, Graham etc. There remains the opportunity for (reasonably well informed) retail investors to beat the market by having a long enough time horizon.

Passive investing is essentially a variant of buy and hold. However, ETF&#039;s have become too popular, and they are crowding the trade. In the UK, for example, share prices get bloated or hammered just by being promoted into the indices. As soon as ETF&#039;s have become big enough to affect the market, they are creating an inefficiency, and inefficiency means they are creating the ability for active investors to add value, just be researching shares that are not inside the ETF bubble. 

ETF&#039;s were a great idea when they were small, they were benefiting from the efficiency of the market. Now they are the dumb money, which is distorting the market, and creating the ability for fund managers to outperform the index. 

Look at, for example, the Horizon Asset Management Hedge Fund letters, comparing similar companies that are more and less popular among ETF builders. The less popular offer around 2% better return.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You seem to have a blind spot when it comes to passive investment strategies.</p>
<p>Markets are basically weak form efficient, which is that they aggregate the opinions and views about the future of those traders who trade in them. </p>
<p>However, this creates a natural inefficiency about time frames. Most fund investors have one year time frames, and most day traders are much shorter, so there is large inefficiencies due to a lack of large investors with long time frames. These are prime conditions for the buy and hold strategy ala Buffet, Graham etc. There remains the opportunity for (reasonably well informed) retail investors to beat the market by having a long enough time horizon.</p>
<p>Passive investing is essentially a variant of buy and hold. However, ETF&#8217;s have become too popular, and they are crowding the trade. In the UK, for example, share prices get bloated or hammered just by being promoted into the indices. As soon as ETF&#8217;s have become big enough to affect the market, they are creating an inefficiency, and inefficiency means they are creating the ability for active investors to add value, just be researching shares that are not inside the ETF bubble. </p>
<p>ETF&#8217;s were a great idea when they were small, they were benefiting from the efficiency of the market. Now they are the dumb money, which is distorting the market, and creating the ability for fund managers to outperform the index. </p>
<p>Look at, for example, the Horizon Asset Management Hedge Fund letters, comparing similar companies that are more and less popular among ETF builders. The less popular offer around 2% better return.</p>
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		<title>By: JJButler</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44868</link>
		<dc:creator>JJButler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2012 12:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44868</guid>
		<description>The 62 year old conservative saver &#039;hobbiest stockpicker&#039; does not appreciate the Eddie James salesman having them fill out a survey, the results of which directing to put half their money into a bond fund yielding less than the salesman&#039;s fees.  Further, the salesmans&#039;s mutual funds are expected to do less well than the market.  Throw in some intellectual and emotional stimulation as yes, these men enjoy a $100 year subsciption site such as mine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The 62 year old conservative saver &#8216;hobbiest stockpicker&#8217; does not appreciate the Eddie James salesman having them fill out a survey, the results of which directing to put half their money into a bond fund yielding less than the salesman&#8217;s fees.  Further, the salesmans&#8217;s mutual funds are expected to do less well than the market.  Throw in some intellectual and emotional stimulation as yes, these men enjoy a $100 year subsciption site such as mine.</p>
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		<title>By: y2kurtus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44851</link>
		<dc:creator>y2kurtus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2012 03:14:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44851</guid>
		<description>TFF nailed it as usual! 

And as a PS to Felix my bank manages 150millionish for customers and we&#039;re almost big enough to afford a Bloomberg subscription at a cool $1,750/month!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TFF nailed it as usual! </p>
<p>And as a PS to Felix my bank manages 150millionish for customers and we&#8217;re almost big enough to afford a Bloomberg subscription at a cool $1,750/month!</p>
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		<title>By: dedalus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44849</link>
		<dc:creator>dedalus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2012 00:48:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44849</guid>
		<description>I dunno. Have I, by reading Grant&#039;s Interest Rate Observer ($965/yr) since the late 80s, been engaging in -- what Felix calls -- &quot;an upper-middle-class hobby rather than as purely profit-focused investing activity&quot;? 

Yeah, I spose so. But who can forget when Grant famously wrote in his December 2006 newsletter that CDS protection on CDOs was way too cheap? As Lewis reported in The Big Short (p. 178): 

&quot;In Jim Grant&#039;s [Dec. 06] essay, Steve Eisman found independent confirmation of his theory of the financial world. &#039;When I read it,&#039; said Eisman, &#039;I thought, Oh my God, this is like owning a gold mine.&#039; &quot; 

Of course Grant has been wildly wrong on very many other predictions. But he sure is fun to read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I dunno. Have I, by reading Grant&#8217;s Interest Rate Observer ($965/yr) since the late 80s, been engaging in &#8212; what Felix calls &#8212; &#8220;an upper-middle-class hobby rather than as purely profit-focused investing activity&#8221;? </p>
<p>Yeah, I spose so. But who can forget when Grant famously wrote in his December 2006 newsletter that CDS protection on CDOs was way too cheap? As Lewis reported in The Big Short (p. 178): </p>
<p>&#8220;In Jim Grant&#8217;s [Dec. 06] essay, Steve Eisman found independent confirmation of his theory of the financial world. &#8216;When I read it,&#8217; said Eisman, &#8216;I thought, Oh my God, this is like owning a gold mine.&#8217; &#8221; </p>
<p>Of course Grant has been wildly wrong on very many other predictions. But he sure is fun to read.</p>
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		<title>By: TFF</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44848</link>
		<dc:creator>TFF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 21:55:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44848</guid>
		<description>LOL! Okay, you got me there, Felix! Yeah, stock picking is a bit of a hobby for me. In one of my retirement accounts I trade more frequently than I need to implement a sensible strategy (which is &quot;rarely if ever&quot;), and I&#039;m always curious to see if the latest batch of trades put me ahead or behind where I would have been if I had sat on my hands. (Overall doesn&#039;t seem to make much of a difference, so I indulge my hobby.)

Two major reasons why it is a predominately male hobby. First, men have traditionally managed finances in families, and there aren&#039;t many people younger than 40 with enough money saved to be worth the trouble. Second, women (even today!) are socialized to seek certainty and avoid risks -- and there is never any certainty in the stock market. (If you think an investment is a sure thing, you are being taken for a sucker.)

But I agree with you, it is idiotic to spend money on stock-picking publications (unless for amusement only). Even counter-productive, since you introduce an asymmetry in the information processed. Hard to weigh alternatives evenly if one was featured on your stock-picking list and another was not.

Ultimately, for me, the reward isn&#039;t a dream of becoming wealthy -- it is peace of mind. As everybody does, I began as a naive mutual fund investor (i.e. &quot;stupid money&quot;). Got taken to the cleaners by Janus Funds, as they promised sound value-driven management and delivered massive losses in the dot.com bubble. Oops! Started taking it seriously in 2004 when I took a retirement account rollover. Finished rotating out of mutual funds in early 2007 when I was aghast as some of the commentary I was reading. (This particular fund manager was advocating home builders and big banks at the time. Again, THAT is your &quot;stupid money&quot;.)

Five year cumulative returns of just under 50% aren&#039;t going to make me rich, but that isn&#039;t the goal. I just don&#039;t want to lose what I&#039;ve worked so hard to save. I don&#039;t always call them right -- but I&#039;ve never done as poorly as the people I was previously paying to lose my money.

What price, peace of mind?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LOL! Okay, you got me there, Felix! Yeah, stock picking is a bit of a hobby for me. In one of my retirement accounts I trade more frequently than I need to implement a sensible strategy (which is &#8220;rarely if ever&#8221;), and I&#8217;m always curious to see if the latest batch of trades put me ahead or behind where I would have been if I had sat on my hands. (Overall doesn&#8217;t seem to make much of a difference, so I indulge my hobby.)</p>
<p>Two major reasons why it is a predominately male hobby. First, men have traditionally managed finances in families, and there aren&#8217;t many people younger than 40 with enough money saved to be worth the trouble. Second, women (even today!) are socialized to seek certainty and avoid risks &#8212; and there is never any certainty in the stock market. (If you think an investment is a sure thing, you are being taken for a sucker.)</p>
<p>But I agree with you, it is idiotic to spend money on stock-picking publications (unless for amusement only). Even counter-productive, since you introduce an asymmetry in the information processed. Hard to weigh alternatives evenly if one was featured on your stock-picking list and another was not.</p>
<p>Ultimately, for me, the reward isn&#8217;t a dream of becoming wealthy &#8212; it is peace of mind. As everybody does, I began as a naive mutual fund investor (i.e. &#8220;stupid money&#8221;). Got taken to the cleaners by Janus Funds, as they promised sound value-driven management and delivered massive losses in the dot.com bubble. Oops! Started taking it seriously in 2004 when I took a retirement account rollover. Finished rotating out of mutual funds in early 2007 when I was aghast as some of the commentary I was reading. (This particular fund manager was advocating home builders and big banks at the time. Again, THAT is your &#8220;stupid money&#8221;.)</p>
<p>Five year cumulative returns of just under 50% aren&#8217;t going to make me rich, but that isn&#8217;t the goal. I just don&#8217;t want to lose what I&#8217;ve worked so hard to save. I don&#8217;t always call them right &#8212; but I&#8217;ve never done as poorly as the people I was previously paying to lose my money.</p>
<p>What price, peace of mind?</p>
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		<title>By: KidDynamite</title>
		<link>http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2012/11/28/is-stock-picking-just-another-hobby-for-men/comment-page-1/#comment-44847</link>
		<dc:creator>KidDynamite</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 21:33:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/?p=19615#comment-44847</guid>
		<description>&quot;But the Seeking Alpha model is quite a clever one: the articles are behind a paywall for 1-3 days, then they get opened up to the public&quot;

ah hahhhh. sounds to me like SA is trying to sell early access to information which they think will move markets...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But the Seeking Alpha model is quite a clever one: the articles are behind a paywall for 1-3 days, then they get opened up to the public&#8221;</p>
<p>ah hahhhh. sounds to me like SA is trying to sell early access to information which they think will move markets&#8230;</p>
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