Reuters Blogs

Front Row Washington

Tracking U.S. politics

16:11 October 15th, 2008

Does Joe the Plumber know Joe Six-Pack?

Posted by: Emily Kaiser
Tags: Front Row Washington, , , , ,

(Corrects third paragraph to say Joe about to buy a business) 

Joe the Plumber was the surprise star of the third and final presidential debate, getting no less than 13 mentions in the opening minutes.

So who is this guy? His full name is Joe Wurzelbacher, and it turns out he had a close encounter with Barack Obama a few days ago. John McCain adopted Joe’s cause as a way to tar his opponent as a tax-and-spend liberal. rtx9llq.jpg

The apparent problem is that Joe is about to buy a company that makes a little over $250,000 a year, and under Obama’s proposal that would put him into a higher tax bracket. Obama told Joe that he wasn’t trying to punish his success, only to spread the wealth around.

“Joe wants to buy the business that he has been in for all of these years, worked 10, 12 hours a day. And he wanted to buy the business but he looked at your tax plan and he saw that he was going to pay much higher taxes,” McCain said.

“Joe, I want to tell you, I’ll not only help you buy that business that you worked your whole life for and be able — and I’ll keep your taxes low and I’ll provide available and affordable health care for you and your employees,” McCain said, staring straight into the camera.

McCain got a little caught up in the moment and muddled in his message to Joe by saying at one point that “fifty percent of small business income taxes are paid by small businesses.”

Still, Joe the Plumber has become a bit of Internet celebrity and Republicans quickly latched onto his plight, issuing a statement saying his comments to Joe showed that Obama would “tax to death” the American Dream.

Obama’s response was that Joe the Plumber needed a tax cut five years ago, and Obama wants to “make sure that the plumber, the nurse, the firefighter, the teacher, the young entrepreneur who doesn’t yet have money, I want to give them a tax break now. And that requires us to make some important choices.”

As for Joe himself, directory assistance had no telephone listing for him in Toledo, Ohio. If you’re listening, Joe, we’d love to hear how you’re handling fame!  

Click here for more Reuters 2008 campaign coverage

- Photo credit: Reuters/Gary Hershorn (McCain makes a point at the presidential debate)   

307 comments so far

Joe the “Plumber”? He should vote for McCain and he probably voted for Bush twice and GHW Bush as well. It’s a phoney macho persona that Republican’s are “more tough” on evey issue and are out to protect his right not to pay taxes.
What this sockhead does not get is the fact that the GOP went crazy over the last 8 years spending money we just don’t have, but he and his children will someday have to repay. These are not conservative ideas or actions - on the contrary. They are perverted flaming liberal socialist ideas that spend tax dollars and imorally tranfer (spread the debt)equally to every man woman and child in the country.
If Joe thinks McCain and VP wannabe Barbie will help him or anyone like him step up, he’s just a bullet headed dope he appears to be.
He’s a lier (goes with the territory of being a phoney conservative)and a tax dodging leach. Anyone who is middle class and votes for McCain/McBarbie is either not paying attention on purpose, or is just plain stupid.

Look, if Obama screws up, I’ll be the first to vote him out. As far as voting for a ticket who wants to give the same tax cuts to everyone (do the math on a 1% cut on $200,000 worth of income v $40,000) has got to be kidding. Unless Joe the Plumber is really Joe Sixpack in which case, he can buy a sixpack with the tax break these two are claiming to deliever.
That tax cut will be funded by more debt which (like buying groceries with a credit card) will eventually make this country a bananna republic we are heading for if things don’t change soon.

Go ahead Joe, pull the lever. When people can’t pay for a plumber, maybe you’ll start to vote for your own interests.

Jerk

- Posted by T

I am so tired of McCain\’s reference to Joe the plumber. All I do now is turn off the TV or change the channel. This Joe the Plumber is driving me crazy!!!!!

- Posted by Eugene Diaz

Again… Let’s just move to a FLAT TAX - let’s say 20%.

- Posted by DJ Jayito

Joe the Plumber is a hero.

The point is not whether he “is an average American” or not.

The point is you are being taxed to death, and Joe the Plumber is being character-assassinated and attacked for speaking up and voicing an opinion - as though there were something wrong with that.

Obama and his cronies, including those who vote Democrat, would like more of that.

Punish the successful and hate and degrade those who oppose their creeping Marxism.

- Posted by Big Paul

Let’s not forget the millions Joe the Plumber is likely making right now through McCain endorsements.

- Posted by DJ Jayito

FLAT TAX!

Let’s revolt for a FLAT TAX system. No one could EVER claim that isn’t fair for them. It’s completely EQUAL TO ALL!

YOU SHOULD ALREADY HAVE YOUR MONEY UNDER A MATTRESS. First… Interest rates are nearly at all time lows. Then, secondly… Banks are failing left and right and will continue to do so as RISKY mortgages fail and housing builders who took out HUGE loans can’t sell enough homes to cover these loans.

McCain / Obama… NO ONE can fix this problem, near-term. It’s all about CYCLES… The EXTREME high in the housing market must be met with an EXTREME low in the housing market. UNLESS OF COURSE you bail out the hugh corporations. What does that end up accomplishing? The stock market plummets 2000 points in mere weeks as the majority of america is FURIOUS and SCARED as to what the government has just done. Would they bail you out, if you made bad business decisions?

Now… What happens when you can buy a BRAND NEW home from a building company - the exact same home / same model / same lot / same community - as the one down the block (which was bought a 1/2 year - year ago (or so) for 50,000-100,000 less than your new neighbor… SOMETHING IS WRONG… and it will only get worse. It will get worse when half those homes sold a year ago are under foreclosure. This is happening ALL OVER my neighborhood in Davenport, FL. An entire block - just about - in a 3 year old neighborhood - is abandoned. I am NOT kidding. Jocelyn Drive - Davenport, FL… Awful. Big beautiful new homes. VACANT! You can buy a “short sale” home for 1/2 the price they were bought at - not even 3 years ago.

On another note… I still am bothered by the “if you work HARD, you will make a lot of money,” thought. I think this was the case during Reagan and Clinton (perhaps). And yes, in most cases, you HAVE to work hard to make a lot of money, but in a LOT of cases - in today’s economy - hard work is the work you are doing TRYING TO FIND A JOB THAT EQUATES TO YOUR SKILLSET! What do you do? For those of you who don’t have a clue… In order to pay your mortgage, you will get a job at BESTBUY or APPLEBEES or even WALMART just to make JUST ENOUGH money to keep the house. Your $100,000 / year has just become $10 / hour. And - on top of that - those who didn’t go to college - let’s say 5 years ago and got that hourly wage job at BESTBUY - and stayed there - are likely to be manager now and making 50,000+ / year. FUNNY HOW THINGS REVERSE!

I’d like to see some of the “rich” people in this thread - and what they would have to say - if by some horrible chance things reversed for them. Let’s say for instance, to the person who was talking about how she and her husband bought homes - and sold them for a profit. What if you bought at the peak? OOPS! You’d still OWN all those houses and you’d be praying for goverment assistant, at that point.

- Posted by DJ Jayito

A lot of people posting here seem to think that a business is taxed on gross income — the total amount it brings in. It’s not. It’s taxed on its profits — that’s after all the bills and the employees are all paid. The idea that lots of successful small businesses will have their taxes raised under Obama’s plan is a lie, no more, no less. 95% of small businesses would see their taxes lowered under Obama’s plan. Look at the figures, ask a financial analyst. Obama’s plan will lower taxes on small businesses and is better for this country.

- Posted by Alice Carli

Get real,Joe the plumber? How about Jane the Fashion Model? 150K on clothes,I havent spent that much on my entire wardrobe over my lifetime. Hypocrisy run rampant.Im middle class and I wouldnt have Sara the valley girl represent me under any circumstance.

- Posted by rick righi

here is the thing that puzzles me…percentage-wise I am payin way more in taxes than that of those who make more than 250,000.00 per year. so, the question is, WHY?? Wht would someone who could afford to pay the same tax rate as me more easily getting the breaks. Look, fair is fair, I pay my taxes and I get benefits from it and I appreciate those benefits. However, i am single with no children and i am getting HAMMERED at like 14%!!! tack on the state tax and SS and medicare it comes out over 20% of my pay going to taxes. I am TIRED of towing the line!!! I want a freakin’ break!! I’m sick of being penalized for not having had children!!!!!

I simply cannot listen to someone making 3 times more money than me whine about losing tax breaks!!! they can freakin’ afford to pay!! I know, because I pay my taxes and i have a pretty good life despite that.

It’s all good when the cutoff goes the other way and people making under 250k are paying a higher rate than you… Kiss my butt!!!

It’s simple pay your EFFing taxes JOE!!!

- Posted by Danny the Plumber

To James Behlke. No disrespect but do you really know what senators make? Not in their salary but from all the perks they have? And if Obama and his wife only make $77,000.00 per year what are thier college educations in? That makes it $38,500.00 for each. I went to college, got a degree, left the field I studied and ended up making close to $100,000.00 per year because of hard work, willingness to work, and the opportunity to better myself but not at the expense of the American people. If you think there is economic turmoil now, if Obama is elected you haven’t seen anything. Better pull your money out of the bank and put it under your mattress.

- Posted by Bill Michaelson

He doesn’t make 250,000 dollars a year, his BUSINESS makes 250,000 dollars a year, a lot of which is going to go into paying employees and other business expenses. That’s not how much he gets paid.

- Posted by Robert Farland

I would like to see equal PERCENTAGES paid in taxes. Yes I chose to be a teacher, a profession where I will never be rich, because of my love for children and desire to make a positive impact on the world. My problem is that I notice people making more than me paying a smaller percentage of their earnings than I do. If I, a lowly teacher, am expected to survive off a certain percentage than surely Joe and the rest of the hardworking 6figure earning population should be able to do the same.

- Posted by DeMoCool

You’ve made a good point, Maxwells, one I also tried to make in this song:

Joe the Plumber
Dr BLT
words and music by Dr BLT copyright 2008

http://www.drblt.net/music/Joe2Long.mp3

a new mix of the song should be up at my website, from the album, Lipstick, soon:

http://www.drblt.net

- Posted by Bruce

As we saw from later reports, Joe the plumber is the average American with debts and dreams and not a $250,000 a year income.
What troubles me and should trouble all Americans concerning Joe and the Obama campaign is that the people conected with Obama went after Joe like a pack of hungry sharks. They sought to discredit him and ruin him and it appears that Obama did nothing to stop this. Is this how Barak Obama intends to help the middle class? Is this how Barak Obama will respond to questions concerning his policies if he becomes president?

- Posted by bookdiva

After reading through most of the posts on this page many things are obviously being misconstrued, thus I agree with the very small amount of people stating that questions do need to be asked. One main question that needs to be clarified is the $250,000 question. For the few that may have taken the time to do a bit of research, granted, I did brief research, Obama states that individuals making over $250,000.00 would see a tax increase, so the question is how would that apply to a small business owner? The business, though run by an entrepenuer, is not the persons personal earnings, and with all of the assistance available to small business owners, especially new owners, there should be enough breaks in there to negate the possible tax increase effect. But again, the plan states for individuals and not businesses. So then the question becomes, does that mean if I work for Company A and make that amount or does that mean if I own a company with 3 employees and that company grosses $255,000/yr that I will see an increase?

One thing some people recognize is that the middle class are the ones with this country on their backbone. There\’s far more people in the middle class facing higher taxes IN OUR PRESENT state of things then there has been in history. The economy has done nothing but decline under Bush and more evident the mortgage crisis in which big oil companies sought they still wanted their billion dolar profits and continued to raise oil prices. Even though gas in on a decline, it has no reason being that high in the first place and now that the economy is on lego building blocks, it\’s funny how all of a sudden oil prices plummet and theres no talk anymore of the weakening dollar and how they had to raise prices to compensate…all of that was just food for thought, now back to the blog topic.

Oh wait, part of the topic has evolved around an economy where even someone with a PhD cant even find work. As for Joe, if he\’s smart enough, he should buy the business if he\’s done enough research to seek the right assistance. Most of the problem is that people don\’t know where to look or expect it to fall in their lap. He obviously should know what he\’s doing as a plumber if he has saved enough to buy the business or qualify for the loan to purchase it, so its just a matter of what happens on his end. But then again, under McCain, he wouldnt necessarily get a tax break either, unless Joe found a way to grow mushroom his plumbing business to qualify for McCains big business tax breaks to those who really dont need it. What good does it do to give tax breaks to big businesses that claim to create jobs if they had a break, yet those jobs never reach American soil? At least Obama states that he would encourage big businesses that create jobs in America by offering them breaks…Big Difference.

As for the government, it is out of control and something needs to be done about it. Honestly and truthfully, this Country is supposed to be run by the people, someone in transgression we have gotten away from that to the point where a few hundred men sit in a room and decide things that effect billions if not trillions of people. Their spending money like someone broke Hoover Dam and left the faucet on. Last time I checked, I didnt agree with the War in Iraq, I agreed that something needed to be done about the attacks here in the US, and last I heard, they weren\’t in Iraq.

- Posted by Talk Too Much

Not an Obama fan. Not a fan of people who believe that those who have worked hard for what they have should be spreading their wealth even further. I took out loans for college, found good jobs, paid them off. I have worked for corporate america and have owned my own business. Husband has worked very hard and went to college on the GI Bill. We have been moderately successful. We bought houses, fixed them up, sold them for profit and did it again. The American way. Life has not been golf, sailing and yearly vacations to foreign lands. I am retired and plan to enjoy it. He will continue to work for a few more years. We go to church and believe in minimum 10% tithing knowing that portions of that money will go to food banks, farm workers, seniors and much, much more. I work in community ministries helping to teach children to read, be respectful, be able to make good decisions and have responsibility. I am not alone in this. Their are thousands of us living in communities throughout this county who believe in giving back. The Obamas believe in giving back, giving back other people’s money. Go to the internet and look up what they have given in charity. They did give $72,650 to charity. The money was linked back to convicted real estate developer Antoin Rezko as campaign contributions given to the Obama campaign by Rezko’s relatives. As for themselves, I read that they gave, before running for President, 1% of their income. Funny how a presidential campaign can disclose who the stingy ones are. Stingy with their earned income and generously giving with money made by others.

- Posted by Joan

I see many posts accusing Joe of being an above average american making a quarter of a million dollars a year. If you read the article it says he plans to purchase a business that makes this amount. This does not mean that his take home after salaries and business expenses will be even close to this amount.

Aside from this I have to wonder from where your sense of entitlement stems. What makes you think it’s ok to use the government to take what someone else has worked for? If you are not happy with your current financial situation find a way to improve it that does not force others to work for your luxuries.

- Posted by Jay Pops

50% tax?! What kind of nonsense are you talking? This country has been a PROGRESSIVE TAX STRUCTURE for MANY YEARS! The more you make, the higher percentage you are taxed. It’s for “the benefit of the country as a whole.” It doesn’t have anything to do with LAZY! There are a lot of people who - for MANY REASONS - cannot get high paying jobs. They work 2-3-4 jobs to make a living. That isn’t LAZINESS! Congratulations to you and your husband for making TONS of money. If you don’t want to help the country, then maybe you need to live somewhere else. AND KEEP IN MIND, there are MANY countries who’s income taxes are MUCH higher than ours.

AND - by the way… I am a college graduate. I graduated MAGNA CUM LAUDE and had a 4.0 within my major field of study - banking and finance. I have spent the last 12 years working in financial research. Now, because financial research is a dying profession and the financial markets are in shambles, I can’t even FIND WORK that would come even remotely close to what I deserve or expect to get paid, in my career.

Am I lazy?

- Posted by DJ Jayito

I am so tired of hearing about Joe the plumber and his $250K a year business. I worked with Joe at Global Crossing in Phoenix, AZ several years ago and he is a super nice guy and shouldn’t be scrutinized this much. BUT, BUT…here is what I want to hear about…I want to hear about what is going to be done to HELP my best friend and her husband who have lost their home because they can’t find work. BOTH of my parents who have been laid off and have their retirement tied up in the stock market which goes down every day…the fact that I am a college student working 3 jobs (oh, wait…make that 1 job…I lost 2 of them last week). WHAT is going to be done to help us? I’m glad that Joe is going so well…lucky Joe. When I graduate college next semester with my degree, am I going to be able to find a job? Or will I be bartending for the rest of my life?

I don’t know about Joe and his $250K per year, but I know about my $2.90 per hour and the fact that my tips get worse every single weekend. I know that between working and school I don’t have enough time for sleep. I know that I worry about my parents who are out of work and several friends who can’t support their families.

Let’s STOP focusing on the ONE person John McCain has found to swing around by his puppet strings and start focusing on those of us who make FAR less than $250 a year, and there are a lot. Those Americans who are losing their homes, their families, their jobs…let’s focus on the worst recession since the great depression. Let’s focus on AMERICA!! And let’s do what we have to in order to get back to being able to live comfortably! Obama is offering us the chance to do just this. But what do I know? I’m not a plumber.

- Posted by shaylin White

The problem with America is that too many people compare themselves with someone else they think may have it better or have more than they do. Comparison always leads to discontent!!! If I’m Joe the plumber, I should choose what I give away, not the Government. The Government has wasted our tax dollars giving to programs that don’t work! Organizations like Habitat for Humanity work because they are efficient. Our Government is anything but efficient. Government is too big in this country. Giving them more of our Tax dollars will simply make it bigger!

- Posted by Charlie

Post Your Comment

*
To prove you're a person (not a spam script), type the security word shown in the picture. Click on the picture to hear an audio file of the word.
Click to hear an audio file of the anti-spam word

House Rules:
  • We moderate all comments and will publish everything that advances the post directly or with relevant tangential information
  • We try not to publish comments that we think are offensive or appear to pass you off as another person, and we will be conservative if comments may be considered libelous information.