The healthcare reform debate just reached a new level of vitriol, with a pro-reform protester biting off the fingertip of a counter-demonstrator in a fistfight between the two men, according to police in California.
The Ventura County Sheriff’s Department says the brawl erupted Wednesday evening outside a shopping mall in the Los Angeles suburb of Thousand Oaks.
Dozens of protesters holding a rally in support of President Obama’s healthcare reform plan got into a shouting match with a smaller group of anti-reform demonstrators across the street. The conflict escalated as a member of the pro-Obama group and a member of the counter-demonstration confronted each other and a physical fight ensued, sheriff’s spokesman Eric Buschow said.
The fisticuffs ended when the counter-protester, 65-year-old William James Rice, realized that the last third of his left pinky had been bitten off, Buschow said. He drove himself to a nearby emergency room, and a bystander who scooped the severed digit off the pavement and put it in a bag followed Rice to the hospital.
A hospital spokeswoman said Rice ultimately chose not to have doctors reattach the fingertip. Instead, his wound was cleaned and sewn up in the emergency room and he was sent home that night. She added that Rice was covered by Medicare, the government’s health insurance plan for the elderly.
Police said the biter has not been identified. Rice has admitted to throwing the first punch but says he did so because he felt threatened, Buschow said.
Rice gave investigators a photograph (above) taken just before the altercation. Rice is wearing a khaki T-shirt and olive drab shorts; his opponent is in black at right.
Depending on the outcome of the investigation, the biter could be charged with mayhem, an offense by which the perpetrator deprives another person of a body part, and Rice could be charged with battery for throwing the first punch.
“This isn’t a clear-cut situation,” Buschow says. “These are two people who by all appearances willingly engaged in a fight with each other, and that fight ended very badly. Had this happened in the context of a bar, we wouldn’t be talking. It’s all about the politics behind it.
“I’m sure that’s not what the Founding Fathers intended for public debate in a democracy,” he added.
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[...] the various town hall meetings have taken on the air of a barroom brawl; please see: Pinky finger bitten off in healthcare reform fracas. Having moderated barroom brawls myself, I can state that the typical bar fight is a good deal [...]
- Posted by Pushing Too Hard « The Brookhaven Bear Reportdean there is agreement in england that the national health care service, cannot be sustained as it is, it is costing to much money. What Obama intends doing over here,just push the bill through and leave the payment to be made some where in the future,not a good idea.
- Posted by brian leeWe are all adults here, and as adults we know there are consequences for are actions, so if you do not agree with his views on healthcare, you can a) do nothing, b) vote for him, c) not vote for him, d) protest and picket, its your choice, live the dream!
It all comes down to what you believe, either you are your brother’s keeper or are not. The healthcare system is broken, even when you play by the rules, because even when you are working and come down with something serious the insurance company can deny your claim and you are stuck using you own funds and filing for bankruptcy when these same insurance companies are paying out bonuses to those employees that deny claims and on top of that the same companies show record profits. We are already paying for emergency room care anyway for those without healthcare, it makes sense to me to cover everyone and not pay 10-20 times more for emergency room care.
- Posted by PaulRanting is not debating. Any new administration is not suddenly responsible for all of the sins of any previous administration(s) - either party. We can publicly voice our opinions in the U.S. (thank you founding fathers), but let our opinions reflect ourselves in a positive way by ensuring that we understand the facts by checking them out ourselves (no, that doesn’t mean listening to your buddy at the bar - sorry), and understanding that not everyone will agree with our viewpoint. A sign of maturity is also finding out that maybe you didn’t quite understand the issue the way you thought you did, and are ready to admit that maybe the “other group” does have some good points also. Reaching an informed-give-and-take middle ground for both groups is the way we grow personally and as a nation.
- Posted by Rayeric as a follow up to your original suggestions as to the three tiers of the government, are we seeing a new branch develop?. The Cazr branch,where people who possibly cannot survive scrutiny get past the normal vetting process.We have been informed that Van jones was excused this formality ,and the original car cazr had to make a hasty retreat when people started looking into his back ground.Although this might only be a temporary arrangement that could be reversed like the statues surrounding Ted Kennedys replacement.Incidentally Teds nephew has reportedly said that he would not apply for the job because he thinks it is more important to be doing what he now doing dishing out the Hugo free oil! Unfortunately there is scepticism about this statement, some say the prospect of a scrutiny investigation has a part in the decision,anyway Eric could you clear up this for us in case we want to take you advice and be more informed in the future because your accusation are making us feel slightly deficient.
- Posted by brian leehi eric, one thing we have established ,is that the guy was there on his own behest, because of the treatment method he used.If the other guy had lost his finger it might have been a workers compensation deal! acorn or the services union,their protesters are on the pay role. Although people are vague on certain details they are not when they sense that someone is going to pull a fast one! so liberals beware and good bye VAN.
- Posted by brian leeAll we have here is one side to the story, like many other immature men he just used physical violence because he was not able to articulate his position or use his brain to avoid one, never had the misfortune to be in a brawl myself, I only pity this man who felt the need to bunch his hand into someone’s mouth, so now all of you can claim he is something of a innocent victim. Walking away takes maturity some men have it others do not. What a pity.
- Posted by MontanaBrian, A study by the Annenberg Foundation - only 1/3 of Americans can name the 3 branches of government.
- Posted by Eric H37% can’t find the US on a world map.
The list of things that Americans don’t know goes on and on.
Certainly people have opinions but what are they based on? 24 hour news channel spin and media ranting.
I know I certainly don’t have the time or patience to wade through House and Senate bills and this whole health care debate is being waged by people who don’t know what they are talking about. Nothing has even been firmed up in Congress.
The group supporting the current healthcare policy(or lack thereof) are insane. They are being used again by the insurance companies, AMA, hospitals that dwarf city hall, with no regard for the common public. Finally, Obama has stepped in to end this Madoff-like scheme perpetrated on the average americans.
- Posted by Berry LawsThe republican party and the insurance companies have done an amazing job at convincing americans it is ok to pay a hundred thousand dollars for a surgical procedure that is done in europe or asia for a fraction of that cost. I am not trying to dispute that the U.S.has the most advanced health care in the world, if you have the means to pay for it. European nations have paid higher income taxes for years to support descent health care for all citizens and it works there. Why not in america?
- Posted by deanTell me why on earth any company will continue to provide health care to their employee’s when they can opt out for the public option. The fine for companies to NOT provide health care, will stil be lower than to provide health care insurance. Also what happens when funding inevitible runs out or short, i.e. during an economic downturn for instance. Here in california we have watched government funded health care take a hit with programs cut etc…and told tell me it would be any different for this MASSIVE program.
- Posted by Susan