Boycott of U.N. racism conference

April 20, 2009

 

A United Nations conference on racism is being boycotted by the United States and many of its allies.

 

They fear the meeting in Geneva will single out Israel for criticism. A previous racism conference in 2001 in Durban, South Africa, was marred by anti-Semitic street protests and attempts to pass a resolution equating Zionism with racism, prompting the United States and Israel to walk out.

 

The final declaration of that conference omitted that language and was hailed by Israel’s foreign ministry as a triumph.

 

Canada and Israel had long made it clear that they would not attend the follow-up conference in Geneva, known as Durban II.

 

Now, despite President Barack Obama’s policy of re-engaging with the rest of the world, the United States has decided to stay away too. So have Australia and Germany among others. Britain and France and current EU-president the Czech Republic are represented only by their ambassadors.

 

                                  

                                   The only head of state to attend is Iran’s President Mahmoud Ahmedinejad,

who has called for Israel to be wiped from the map and cast doubt on the Nazi Holocaust, which is also commemorated by Jewish communities on Monday.

 

He used similar language again on Monday, denouncing Israel as a racist regime oppressing the Palestinians and founded “on the pretext of Jewish sufferings”, and accusing “Zionism” of penetrating mass media and financial systems in other countries to impose its domination worldwide.

 

 

 

Several advocacy organizations, such as Human Rights Watch, have said the United States and other Western countries should take part, arguing that their boycott constituted a blow against efforts to promote human rights.

 

Even in Israel, some people say that a boycott leaves the floor open to critics of the country.

 

Still, those who object to the conference can draw some paradoxical comfort from Ahmadinejad’s words. According to one conspiracy theory making the round of the Palais des Nations – the U.N.’s European headquarters where it is hosting the conference – the boycott, by allowing the spotlight to fall on Ahmadinejad, simply proves the point of the opponents: that the U.N.’s international diplomacy is flawed and its efforts to discuss human rights always end up in an attack on Israel.

 

 

 

51 comments

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Well it is now,one more time, confirmed the racist and hate position of The President of Iran, and his lack of care of his own people and Islamic world, and of course the rest of the world. Cklear he do not care,only his own interests.He is showing again,that he do not have scruples of any kind, that is a very risky and dangerous characteristic for a president.MANIPULATION AND HATE SPEECH MUST NOT BE ACEPTED.Even you are the victim, it is so vile to be used for hate propaganda, ignicting, promoting division of the world,with violent words.He is more bold now , maybe that is so sure about his power because is nuclear program?

Posted by Maria | Report as abusive

The countries that have boycotted the anti-racism conference are making fools of themsleves.This is anti-racism conference and as such racist countries are bound to get attacked and everyone knows that israel is the epitome of racism followed by australia, the usa and canada. is it any wonder why these countries “boycotted” the conference?

Posted by Alain | Report as abusive

Sorry, but Palestine was forcibly appropriated from the Palestinians, who are descendants of Jewish converts to Islam–not just “Arabs”–by Zionist Jews, who are descendants of European and West Asiatic converts to Judaism.No amount of protests against “anti-Semitism”–as if all Jews were “Semitic,” and all Palestinians and Arabs are not–will change this simple historical fact.

Maria,How is Iran’s president pointing out the land stealing and suffering of Palestinian people is considered a ‘hate speech’? Basically, Israel can kill many people as possible and steal all the land in the world and no one will dare say anything because if they do they will be label as anti-semetic and hater.

Posted by winter32842 | Report as abusive

Why can’t Israel be criticised? How can there be a conference about Racism and no mention of a highly racsit state such as Israel?I’m ashamed of the western governments, who as usual have displayed their bias nature and once again shown that they are uncapable of having a honest debate.

Posted by Alan | Report as abusive

I am proud of my country for not taking part in this conference. The UN is truly a waste of time when it treats Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, one of the world’s most notorious racists, as an honoured guest.

Posted by Proud Canadian | Report as abusive

The world should be asking itself this one simple question; why has the USA and other British born countries always quick to defend Israel? Why is the USA bribing Egypt with 2billion dollars annualy so it points its guns away from Israel?We may not be able to deny that all is not well in Iran in terms of religious liberty, but it does not take away the fact that Israel as a state now is based on racism and religious segrigation. The state of Israel was created solely for inciting or stearing conflict in the region because now the papacy can use it as an excuse to launch papal crusades against Islam (Somalia, Sudan, Afghanistan, Kosovo/Serbia, Iraq, Palestine etc).I happen to be a christian and where I come from (Botswana), christians and Muslim community get along just fine

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

AlanThe only fools are the ones who attended.And worse are those who try to justify their hate, by accusing the other of being racist.It is called projection. Look it up in a dictionary.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

the countries participating in the anti racism conference use it as a smokescreen for their own discriminatory and racist socities. the west had its racist past and learned its lessons therefore it fights for personal human rights. many other states do not confront their own crimes against humanity or are able to hide it from the world by singaling out israel. a large crowd applauded ahmadinejhad’s racist hate speech. this is the state of the world today.

Posted by thomas | Report as abusive

Since Mr. Smith feels that those attended are fools, does that mean that he expects the world to fold its hands and forget the existence of racism? Because if that is the case it legitimizes the then apartheid governemnt in South Africa and white farms grabbing in Zimbabwe! is that the type of political system you want to live under, where your worth as a human being is determined by the color of your skin, religious and political party affiliation? Lets think before we talk!

Posted by KABO | Report as abusive

The world shouldn’t put up with blatent racist apartheit regimes. The West should have the gall to isolate such countries like it did with South Africa. Why is it that talking honestly at the 1,000 innocent babies, kids and women killed by Israel would label me a anti-semetic. It really shows who controls the west and the media.

Posted by David Luberman | Report as abusive

I am absolutely at a loss to understand the preferential treatment of Israel when it comes to things like this.. You could call just about any other regime out there racist and as long as you had the facts to prove it that’s ok. But when you point the finger at israel, clearly a cruel, agressive, racist and repressive regime with policies towards palistinians surpassing apartheid and bordering on genocide, OH MY GOD YOU ANTI-SEMITE!!!Zionism is without question COMPLETELY akin to racism and should be defined descriptively.Its truely unbelievable that at a conference on racism you would not only not want to discuss the worlds worst offenders, but actually walk out instead of trying to disprove the accusations like a diplomat should.If western nations can support an agressive racist regime with as many illegal nuclear weapons as Israel they dont belong in an anti-racism conference in the first place, and their credibility when critisizing Iran is a joke..

Posted by brian | Report as abusive

Yes brian, If those diplomats stayed and took Ahmadinejad on, they will be forced to deal with questions like: why is it that when the holocaust is mentioned sympathy is drawn only for the Jews? What about the Germans that Hitler killed because they will not support his genocide? The moment you explore these questions you will start to reveal the sinister evil plot behind the holocaust and creation of racist Israel. So the best option was the cowardly walk out!

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

No one is saying that Israel is a perfect country run by flawless leaders but it seems to me that there is a difference between an honest discussion about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and questioning the right and the basis for the existence of the state of Israel. the Iranian leader does not disguise of his feelings and motives about this issue and the rest of the world stands by and provides this person a platform to spread his ideology and outright denial of facts.If he would like to talk about injustice, cruelty, and racism let talk about the Jews from Arab countries such as Iraq, Yemen, Egypt, and many other muslim countries who were considered second class citizens (dhimmi) and ultimately told that they were no longer welcome in there host countries.And what of the indiscriminate murder and killing of innocents in the name islam in the past decades wars and battles of resistance. and of the human rights abuses and discrimination that occurs in countless muslim countries across the globe even today.There are many other atrocities that are happening right now around the globe which demand much more serious scrutiny without so much attention being paid to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Just look at what is occurring in Sri Lanka. Tens of thousands of innocent civilians have been forced to flee and many have been killed or injured in the conflict and this has been happening for 3 months. The reason so much attention is being paid to this conflict is that people are obsessed with Israel and the Jews. We are a nation of 7 million in a world with a population of 4 billion and there can be no other reason to explain it.It goes without saying that it is not easy being a Palestinian living in the occupies territories or an Israeli Arab but it also goes without saying that when you have one population bent on ‘wiping you off the map’ that Israel will take whatever measures are necessary to protect there population and I suspect that any other independent and sovereign would do the same.And if and when the Palestinians do ever achieve their ambitions of having a state to call there own (which I personally hope they do), who exactly will that state be created for. Definitely not the Jews. So if anyone would like to speak of apartheid just have a look at the proposed state that Palestinians are asking to create, not to mention the Islamic Republic of Iran as another.Long live the Jewish Republic of Israel.

Posted by observer | Report as abusive

One of the primary signs of racism:You believe that the other race is part of some worldwide evil plot.A plot so secret, so sinister and hidden, that for some reason only the stupid people can figure it out.They hate that race. And racism is a very irrational belief to have. So racists need to hide it.And the best way to do it? Say that the race you hate are the real racists. Yes, it is always the hated, never the one who hates.To all who accuse Israel of being racist: Look in the mirror. And wonder why intelligent people don’t share your views.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

I’m so glad the Iranian President continues to enrage rabid Zionists, particularly Lieberman and his ilk.Israel is indeed a racist state. One only needs to take a look at the vile settlers, the ultra facists in Israeli society, and the politicians in the Knesset who support them. Their goal is the same – to remove the original inhabitants of Palestine once and for all in order to extinguish any hope of independence.While Israeli officials and their gimps are busy painting Iran as Nazi Germany, Israel continues to pass laws aimed at destroying the political, economic, and social fabric of the Palestinians. House demolitions, land theft, water restrictions, denying family reunification, and upholding the new marriage law are just some of the obscene legislation passed by this ‘light unto the nations’. They’d rightly be considered outrageous by any standards and yet the objections have barely amounted to a whisper.Sadly, anyone who rejects Israel’s racist occupation is labeled a ‘Hitler’, an ‘anti-Semite’ or a ‘self-hating Jew’. This is because they can no longer justify the humiliating rituals Palestinians go through as ‘self-defense’. Like Zionism, their argument is based on a myth.

Posted by Nu'man El-Bakri | Report as abusive

John Smith:To all who accuse Israel of being racist: Look in the mirror. And wonder why intelligent people don’t share your views.My question is, who are these intelligent people? The diplomats who walked out on a conference that is crucial to making a turn around on how we relate as human beings? I think probably you meant to say ‘Cowardly people’!

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

Kabo:Why do you think the conference was going to make a crucial turn around on racism?In case you didn’t read the news lately, Mahmoud spend half an hour ranting about how he hates Israel. Even though he was told to behave himself.The stupid people were the diplomats who applauded him. Those with a brain left the moment he started.The thing is that Mahmoud didn’t succeed. He didn’t even offend anyone at the conference. Because he was treated exactly the way all racists are treated.He was ignored.PS. Why is it that whenever somebody makes a post here claiming Israel is racist, they tend to be filled with hateful words?Like coward, vile, facist and evil? Like thinking the jewish people somehow control the media, and want to take over the world?Don’t these sound just like the words a racist would say when describing a race they hate?And yet these people act surprised when they are labled anti-semites?

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

Here we go again with these John Smith types, when people speak out against Israel it’s under the assumption that you can understand we’re speaking out against their government. Is it their citizens murdering children in the street and leaving the wounded to slowly bleed out and die? No, it’s the government. We hate the Israeli government, it’s trash, does that mean we hate Jews? No of course not.The US government is trash too, does that statement mean I hate all Christians?I’d prefer the UN to be done away with completely, so people skipping meetings means nothing to me. But countries skipping meetings on the pretext of other countries having different opinions (more rational ones) than ours is childish and stupid.

Posted by Michael Ham | Report as abusive

You say that the Israeli government ‘murdered’ those people? Murder implies unlawful. It also implies willful.Israel aims for military targets hidden by Hamas in civilian areas. Gaza aims rockets at civilian targets, with the aim of killing civilians.Do you see any moral difference here? I hope so.Israel acted according to the laws of war. The death of civilians is not in itself a war crime. Look up the UN conventions yourself. It’s all there.How would YOU react to daily missile bombardment? That question was asked of the Turkish Prime Minister, and he refused to answer. Can you do better?Operation Cast Lead resulted in Hamas stopping its rocket fire. After all attempts at negotiation failed.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

It all comes down to government.The Israeli government bombed Gaza. Because Gaza’s “government” was launching rockets over the border.

Posted by Ham Actor | Report as abusive

John Smith,I can tell you’ll rationalize anything the Israeli government does, I mean the death of a bunch of Palestinian civilians is just collateral damage anyway right?It is willful, like the IDF cares about who dies when the missiles hit. Why not send in a swat or special forces unit when a Hamas gunmen runs into a civilian building rather than blowing the building to hell no matter who’s inside?You’ll have to point out where I said anything good about Hamas, there’s nothing good about them but when 900 civilians are killed in comparison to 3 who should the outrage be against?It’s a chicken egg argument, Israel and Palestine have been fighting for 60 years and to think Israel was having rockets lobbed at them for no reason is nothing short out medically diagnoseable insanity. Both are in the wrong but Israel has the nukes and Hamas has the Kaleshnikovs.

Posted by Michael Ham | Report as abusive

If there’s one thing jews have become good at its being defensive, theyre so lost in playing the victim that every crime comitted in the name of Israel is justified on the grounds of ‘protecting our survival’..You have the right to survival, but Israel does not, period. Palistine was carved up by the victors as the spoils of war at the end of an age of imperialism, and despite our sympathies for the jews suffering in WWII, the world does not recognise fanatical religious claims on land from thousands of years ago.The mistake was made all those years ago, and naturally this injustice should have been corrected, but not only did the incoming jews not care that they were moving onto someone elses sacred homeland but they had absolutely no qualms taking it away by force.Now this does not seem like a people that deserve my sympathies, given the fact that they are willing to attack and commit the same crimes against their new hosts right after they have suffered such loss themselves.If you think for a second that its been a fair fight or that Israels standards are more humanitarian than the “terrorist” palistinians, just look at the death tolls. Enough said.Israel meets and exceeds every single category for a dangerous, racist, agressive, illegal, repressive, terrorist rogue state with illegal weapons of mass destruction. And if it were anyone else behaving this way they would be spoken about like they were Iran, North Korea and Zimbabwe combined.. instead of constant UN vetos and huge financial and weaponary support, financial assets would be frozen and sanctions would be imposed. They would absolutely be the next country to be ‘liberated’.But they are our friends, our racist bigot friends.Its not their fault they are the chosen people..

Posted by brian | Report as abusive

John SmithLet us get one thing clear my friend, I do not support the Iranian regime or any theocracy anywhere in the world for 1 simple reason; when church and state combine, religious tyrany is the result. But just because John Smith is a theif does not mean he has no moral standing to tell me I should not steal. The whole ideal of human relationships is based now on having system of governance that identify individual culprits and punish them for their crimes against humanity. I want to believe that your own government practices the same John.Since you and fellow believers are adamant on the right of Israel to defend itself, the question I want to put to you is this:1. since The MOSSAD is the best intelligence organization on the planet, why have they ‘failed’ so far to stop weapon smuggling into Gaza?2. The combined efforts of the USA and Israli technology has shown that you can take out enemy installations without civillian casualities, why has Israel ignored usage of this tech but instead resorted to cruel weapons like cluster bombs?As brian and Michael Ham are saying John, Hamas may be wrong but the fact that more Palestinian civilians are being killed daily by Israeli forces is a dark record against Israel. I’m rather dissapointed that you have allowed yourself to actually accept that it is ok for a civillian in palestine to lose their life! Does that mean that everyone who disagress with how Israel does things ought to be killed?

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

Your answers, Kabo.1. Mossad is an intelligence agency. No intelligence agency is all-seeing or all powerful. And weapons smuggling, by it’s very definition, is usually carried out in secret.2. The idea that you can somehow take out military targets without any civilian death is incorrect. Especially when Hamas intentionally fights in an area where civilians live.Even without that fact, cluster bombs remain legal under current UN law. And if you bother to check, most missile strikes by Israel are not cluster bombs anyway.The death of any civilian is terrible.Hamas is hiding in civilian areas, because it KNOWS women and children will die.Israel has the power to defend itself, even if the enemy is hiding behind civilians.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

Weapons smuggling is usually carried out in secret?? So therefore its beyond the reach of the best intel in the world..? How old are you “john smith”?you say,”The idea that you can somehow take out military targets without any civilian death is incorrect.”How is it incorrect? actually please dont answer that..”Especially when Hamas intentionally fights in an area where civilians live.”Yeah instead of fighting the F16s out in a field with their kalishnakovs……The human shield theory is just propaganda.. If you want your army to uphold humane practises its your responsibility to decide how you fight your battles, you cant ask your enemy to come out into an open field so you can bomb them. You have to use a ground force, less effective than dropping bombs in civillian areas maybe, but then again if you simply dont care about civillian deaths then the choice is an easy one.you said:”amas is hiding in civilian areas, because it KNOWS women and children will die.”This to me is an example of the absolute insanity the defense of Israeli crimes has come to for some people… If youre making excuses like this theres no use reasoning with you.

Posted by brian | Report as abusive

It is highly regretable to find someone like John Smith, reasoning that it is absolutely acceptable for a fellow human being to lose their life so he and his race can live. I wonder if Mr Smith does ever look in the mirror because you are echoing the very sentiments that the Iranian President is so popularly criticised for by the USA and its alies.It is quite unfortunate that people like you Mr Smith exists because the foundation of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is your type of conviction. You are no different from the very Hamas you are criticising, infact you are worse because you are better armed, better financed and enjoyed the support of the dominant world super powers.But let me share a small secret with your kind, in not so long a time Israels role and usefulness in the race to world dominance and supremacy will soon expire and hope you will have enough life and wisdom in you to come before God and declare you repentance. As brian says, right now trying to reason with you is a complete waste of time because you seem to have made up your mind that Palestinian suffering and killing is the only option out.

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

The unfortunate thing is that the people that Mr Smith is applauding for having stayed away or having walked out of the conference on racism are the very people who are going to turn on Israel as we know it today and destroy it. Jews will remain across the world but there will be no state of Israel!

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

To hide behind civilians is the worst breaches of international law. Repugnant and vile behaviour.So it is no wonder that the supporters of such tactics will try to justify it. And the best way, my friends, is to accuse the other side of being just as bad.”It’s not our fault we hide in a city. We can’t fight any better”- Is that the best justification you can find for war crimes? What utter garbage!”You can storm Gaza with troops instead”- Do you have ANY idea how many innocents would die in a FULL ground invasion? And you call ME stupid?”Because Hamas is hiding behind children, Israel should just sit back and let Hamas launch rockets for the rest of existance”- Sorry guys. NO country would stand for that. And it is racist to treat Israel differently.”Israel is racist”- Why? Because it defends itself? Because it reacts to ROCKET FIRE? And SUICIDE BOMBS? Just like ANY nation would? This has nothing to do with race. If Hamas stopped launching rockets, Israel would have no reason to respond.But if you have not figured it out yet, I doubt you will listen this time either. But I will let you in on a little secret:Israel is recognised as a nation by the entire world. By Europe. By America. By Asia. Only the Arab nations think different.So when you have fantasies about Israel somehow ‘disappearing’ one day, I hope they keep you warm. Because that dream, born out of racism you refuse to admit, will never come true.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

Wow! It just keeps getting better.. “John Goldstein” must be a jew, there are few people out there willing to stoop to that fanatical level of intellectual humiliation to defend the indefensible. I cant believe you brought up international law in your defense.. my god where do you think that conversation is going to end for israel?

Posted by brian | Report as abusive

OK. Brian. So lets get this straight.You think I must be Jewish, just because I feel that Israel’s actions comply with UN law and the rules of warfare?And you believe that only a Jewish person would justify Israel’s actions?You have just proven, to everyone reading this page, that you are a racist. You have shown it in your own words, as all racists eventually do.Checkmate.I urge you to actually READ about international law and the laws of war. From your posts, it does not appear that you actually KNOW what they contain. Or having read them, simply don’t understand them.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

It is amazing how much you seem to respect the UN and its chatters. If you have been paying attention to the way the UN conducts its affairs and wat you call international law, the reason your hated enemy HAMAS exists is because it has friends in the UN, the reason Sudan has gotten away with genocide is because it has friends in the UN, the reason Mogabe is still president of Zimbabwe even though he was not elected is because he has South Africa as his ally in the UN, and the reason why Israel can mudder so many civilians and get away with it is because she has friends in the UN!Why do you think Bush never bothered to route his invansions through the UN? He knew the UN is where you move around in circles as friends of your enemy shoot down your motions! The UN cannever solve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, but it is obvious you are not intrested in a peaceful resolution of the conflict. Maybe thats why you guys muddered your own prime minister who was the only man to ever realy give palestinians a chance at live: Yitzhak Rabin!

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

John,Faced with overwhelming evidence of Israel’s racism, you reduce yourself to gnawing at the same predictable and tired myths that has shielded the Jewish state for so long. Until now. Like a squirrel watching helplessly as a larger rival takes away its nuts, all you can do in the face of such evidence is to sink your teeth into a tree and start ripping it to shreds.Some corrections to your previous post:’To hide behind civilians is the worst breaches of international law. Repugnant and vile behaviour’ – I’m assuming you weren’t referring to the countless incidents of Israeli troops kidnapping Palestinian children and placing them on the bonnet of their jeeps. Or the dozens of Palestinian civilians killed for refusing to act as human shields.’So it is no wonder that the supporters of such tactics will try to justify it. And the best way, my friends, is to accuse the other side of being just as bad.’ I trust you’ve heard of Mark Regev, the Israeli PM’s spokesman. He’s turned this into an art. Sometimes the IDF even places a spokeswoman, heavy makeup and all, smiling as she defends the murder of 400 children. Needless to say, Israeli officials pioneered this tactic.“It’s not our fault we hide in a city. We can’t fight any better”- Is that the best justification you can find for war crimes? What utter garbage!” – Huh? There’s plenty of evidence for war crimes. If you can be bothered to leave your smug home and visit Gaza, you’ll see for yourself what vile and repugnant behavior really looks like. The ICRC, Amnesty, Human Rights Watch, Oxfam, and others have all documented cases which seem to support the prevalent attitude within the IDF, eloquently summed up by one soldier:”You feel that you are the law. You are the one who decides… As though from the moment you leave the place that is called Eretz Yisrael [the Land of Israel] and go through the Erez checkpoint into the Gaza Strip, you are the law. You are God.”“Israel is racist”- Why? – Ask the refusniks who refuse to take part in something that, they say, is destroying Israel’s soul. And that includes Gaza by the way. Their courage puts yours in the shade.”Because it defends itself? Because it reacts to ROCKET FIRE? And SUICIDE BOMBS?” No, because it sees the Palestinians as a surplus of humanity; as lab rats to test their latest weapons; and as a people who should be kissing Israel’s backside for this ‘enlightened’ occupation. Not that you care, but Israel recently demolished another home in East Jerusalem, and the Mayor, Nir Barkat, had this to say about the international support for the former Palestinian home owner: “The world is backing the process of illegal building in east Jerusalem.” At least he has his sense of humor intact. 88 more homes are destined to meet the same fate, leaving over 1500 Palestinians homeless. No John, this is not racism. It’s municipal planning, right?”If Hamas stopped launching rockets, Israel would have no reason to respond.” They did. In fact, they offered Israel a permanent ceasefire if they lifted the devastating siege (because they won a free and fair election) and agree to address the 11,000+ Palestinian prisoners held in Israel, most in perpetual detention. Israel’s response was operation ‘Iron Dump’It seems the only fantasy wafting around this forum is yours Mr. Smith.

Posted by Nu'man El-Bakri | Report as abusive

Lets keep this simple, shall we?1. Gaza is launching missiles at your nation. Several hundred a day.2. They are intentionally aiming at civilian areas.3. They demand for you to end a blockade, even though you KNOW this will allow them to send suicide bombers and kill more people. As they have done in the past.WHAT DO YOU DO?No excuses. No rambling paragraphs. Just answer the question.WHAT DO YOU DO TO STOP THE MISSILE FIRE?

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

That good progress John, that is the question you should have asked right from the beginning. Allow me to answer you by a question:Why is Hamas firing missiles into Israel?Keep in mind that I neither support Hamas or Israel government, just the civilians from both sides of the fence!

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

john, why would we bother answering a fantasy situation like that? Seriously where do you get your information?? ‘Several hundred a day’, ‘UN Law?’, ‘laws of war?’, ‘palistinians want their women and children to die’, ‘IM a racist because you appear fanatically jewish’…I think youve lost the plot a little in your fanatical defense of this murderous state.Are you instead talking about the “SEVERAL a day” (has a single person been hit by a rocket yet?)or UN “Resolutions”… Which constantly fail to stop Israel from cruel and inhumane treatment of the palistinians thanks to constant US veto.I think you mean the international declaration of human rights and the Geneva convention when you say international “LAW”, and “laws” of war.ABSOLUTELY ANY WAY YOU CUT IT- Israel is the worst offender when it comes to breaches in these standards.. and has been constantly attacked by every human rights group and consciensious government on earth for its cruelty.Youre trying to say its illegal to hide behind civillians, can you show me the law that states this?? No, because youre full of it. How do you ‘hide’ behind a civillian?? pull a gun on them?However there IS a rule that says you arnt supposed to bomb civillian areas… enough said.In fact there are plenty of rules being broken by Israel, when it invades its neighbors, when it develops illegal weapons of mass destruction, when it demolishes houses and builds illegal settlements, when it builds walls, when the IDF shoots unarmed civillians, when it destroys infrastructure, when it holds governments under seige, when it assasinates abroad, when its military constantly lies to the world, the list goes on almost endlessly..The ONLY reason israel can get away with being the most agressive, criminal and dangerous state in the world is because the US needs them to destabalise the region as a strategic ally. And there hasnt been stability since..

Posted by brian | Report as abusive

Attacking the question just shows you can’t answer it. And answering a question with a question is just avoiding the issue.So try to answer the question this time.1. Hamas is launching missiles into civilian areas.2. And they will only stop if you lift the blockade, which will make it easier for future suicide attacks.WHAT DO YOU DO TO STOP THE MISSILE FIRE?Answer if you can.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

I was hoping for a better response than that John. Since you want to be like that, let me remind you: Palestinians and Jews are fighting for land! The land is not only a place for settlement for humanity but it is a resource for our daily sustainence. When you take someone’s land, you have to offer or provide them with an altenative source of livelihood, something Israel is not prepared to do because they are basically invading.There is also a limit to how much land someone may be willing to give to you even if you had the right money, something Israel does not care about because they think they are the rightful owners of the area.To do a head on your question: Give palestinians the 2billion a year instead of Egypt, immediate stoppage of invansion into palestinian farmland, uplifting of naval blockade to allow palestinians to trade and most of all, to allow the rest of the world to trade with palestine and help build its economy. Just remember John, when you push a dog into a corner with no possible escape route, it will turn around and attack you, Human beings are no different! Hamas may seem like terrorists to you, but I can bet you will be doing just the same if the position were turned.

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

So let’s say this happens. Israel allows trade into Gaza and relaxes the blockade.And the result is that:1. Hamas can now smuggle more weapons into Gaza.2. Because the Israelis relax their border control, suicide bombers can now enter Israel.3. And dispite these concessions, Hamas resumes launching rockets into civilian areas. Because it knows that this will lead to more concessions.WHAT DO YOU DO TO STOP THE MISSILE FIRE?

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

- No occupation = rocket fire- No siege = No rocket fire- Freeing 11000+ prisoners = No rocket fire- Releasing Palestinian MPs = No rocket Fire- Allowing Gaza students to pursue an education without fear of harassment = No rocket fire- Ending the obscene practice of mock executions of Palestinian detainees = No rocket fire- Stationing a multinational force along the border = No rocket fire- Ending the prohibition of family reunification = No rocket fire- Allowing the West Bank and Gaza to integrate = No rocket fireOr am I just being a complicated racist? John Smith couldn’t care less about the rockets or the civilians. His solution to the whole matter is to simply view all Palestinians with disgust rather than dignity.

Posted by Nu'man El-Bakri | Report as abusive

Numan,And what happens when Israel releases the prisoners? And does what Hamas wants? And Hamas launches still more rockets?What happens when Israel opens the borders. And suicide bombers start killing innocent people again?And Hamas starts crossing the border, killing soldiers and stealing the dead bodies for prisoner exchanges?Have you read Hamas’s charter? It will continue to try and kill innocents until Israel no longer exists as a nation. That is what THEY say.When Israel gives concessions, nothing comes back.-Israel pulling out of Gaza did nothing.-Israel releasing prisoners did nothing.-Israel trying diplomacy did nothing.-Israel allowing UN aid into Gaza did nothing.-Israel proposing ceasefire did nothing.-Israel pleading “please stop launching rockets before it is too late, we do not wish to start violence.” did nothing.Your solutions are bad. Please come up with better ones.I ask again:WHAT DO YOU DO TO STOP THE MISSILE FIRE?

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

John,Your ignorance is breathtaking. And so is your ability to predict the future.- Israel did not pull out of Gaza. It still maintains total control over land, sea, and airspace- Israel hasn’t released prisoners. They’ve released a handful of people who were illegally detained.- Israel has yet to try and find a diplomatic solution. It still has an obsession with Iron – Iron wall, Iron dome, Iron fist, Iron boot, etc. etc.- The people of Gaza do not meet their minimum daily requirements, hence the tunnels to smuggle in food and fuel. Israel has been accused by the UN of tightening the noose, especially when Palestinians are in desperate need.- Israel never proposed a ceasefire. It rejected one.- Your last point is particularly amusing. The actual Israeli plea was “Please die in silence. Do not try and break the siege. You must accept that you are a defeated people. You are a cancer amongst the chosen ones. We are just itching to unleash our full fury’But this is nothing new. All this is enshrined in the Likud Charter:”The Jewish communities in Judea, Samaria and Gaza are the realization of Zionist values. Settlement of the land is a clear expression of the unassailable right of the Jewish people to the Land of Israel and constitutes an important asset in the defense of the vital interests of the State of Israel. The Likud will continue to strengthen and develop these communities and will prevent their uprooting….The Government of Israel flatly rejects the establishment of a Palestinian Arab state west of the Jordan river.” (1999)I think it’s quite obvious whose existence is really at stake

Posted by Nu'man El-Bakri | Report as abusive

It seems we are going around in circles.Whenever I try to show you that Israel’s actions are a logical response to Hamas’s actions, you refuse to accept it. You see racism behind everything. And it is not my concern to change your mind.So let me predict the future for you again:Israel will give Gaza every opportunity to give up violence. The day that Hamas realises that violence will never succeed, will be the day that peace will come.But it is not Israel’s job to change Hamas. Hamas can smolder and fume for the next fifty years if they wish. But their hate will never succeed.When Hamas uses rockets fired from civilian areas, the response will be rational. Israel will give them an opportunity to stop, and show to the world that Hamas is not after peace.Once more, the international world will watch as the rockets continue, and Israel restrains itself.And then, regretfully, Israel will be forced to take military action again. And though civilians may die, this will still comply with the UN law of Proportionality.But I hope this does not happen.The western world is now assisting in ensuring Hamas will not rearm. Because they, unlike you, have recognised that Hamas is the primary reason that this conflict continues.The UN does not care about propery claims from 50 years ago. They only care that Hamas stops provoking Israel.One day, even Gaza may realise this.Aside from that, there is little more to be said.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

What else do you expect John? There cannever be progress in a situation where you have deeply adopted the attitude that Isreli government is made out of Angels while Hamas are demons who don’t have any concept of peace!Your sentiments are just of the kind of a person who sees nothing wrong in ethnic cleansing. Hate them all you want brother, but God takes care of the oppressed so the Palestinians are going nowhere in a hurry!

Posted by Kabo | Report as abusive

You are just an angry person john, living in denial because its too hard to admit that your people have become everything they hate.It seems youre only willing to see the facts through a filter of victimisation that flies so selfishly in the face of the obvious truth.It must be hard to admit you are perpatrating the same inhumane crimes you were once the victim of..

Posted by brian | Report as abusive

Might as well wrap it all up. So lets see here:1. You accuse me of being angry. Yet you are the one who posts insults and slurs in your post. If you can’t make civil comments, YOU look like the angry one.2. You accuse me of being racist. Simply because YOU think so. And in the same breath, you claim I am jewish? I am not jewish. Do you know which nation I live in, or religion I follow? Sounds like YOU are racist to me.3. You accuse me of denial. Hamas provokes Israel. Hamas fires rockets from civilian areas. Hamas refuses to extend a ceasefire (And check your facts before you start denying that). But you refuse to accept this. You simply say “Israel is racist” over and over and ignore all that Hamas does. Now THAT is denial.4. And the worst of your problems? I ALWAYS try to keep on topic. But all the Hamas supporters can’t stop making personal attacks. And THAT is a sign that YOU have a bad argument. Because otherwise you would stop attacking me, and try to make some coherent argument.I already assume that your next post will contain one or all of the above flaws. This is because your arguments are based on these flaws, which is why you lose.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

Guys don’t be at John, he’s a victim of our public american education system and he’s constantly fed his information from the Rupert Murdoch lie machine (Fox News #1 newschannel in the U.S., Wall Street Journal, New York Post, etc) and just like every conservative his point of view 100% echoes the neocon talking points in this country.

Posted by Michael Ham | Report as abusive

*mad at*

Posted by Michael Ham | Report as abusive

Yawn.Yet another personal attack. And now you think I’m American? Yet another conclusion based on NO evidence. After the last few rounds, hardly surprising.You want to know why left-wingers get stereotyped like they do? Read your own posts and figure it out.Serious. You guys are lucky the reuters censors don’t check your posts. You are hardly persuasive when the best you can do is childish name calling.If this is it for your ‘arguments’, then then I think this debate is as good as over.I hope the spectators enjoyed it. They got to see you all at your worst.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive

Not so fast John! I have previously asked you a question and up to now you have not answered it:Why is Hamas firing rockets into Israel?.One of the things a trainee teacher is taught is that before punishing a student, you first must find out what is making them behave the way they do. This strategy does not in anyway condone the behaviour of the student or exempt them from disciplinary action, but it is a move rather aimed at going to the root of the problem rather than addressing a symptom! My argument is Israel and her friends are addressing symptoms of a problem that is making life difficult for palestinians. Treat that problem and Hamas will have no reason or scapegoat to fire anymore rockes into Israel.Kindly answer that question brother

Posted by kabo | Report as abusive

Sure thing, student. Time to point out your errors.Why is Hamas launching rockets?-Because Israel has closed its borders.Why did Israel close the borders?-Because Hamas kept sending suicide bombers during the second intifada. And smuggling weapons into Gaza.Why did Hamas send suicide bombers?-Because they claim Israel took their land.Why did Israel take their land?-Because Palestine lost it as a result of the 1948 Palestinian civil war/ Arab-Israel war.Why did that war start?- Two races were living in British Mandate Palestine. The UN partitioned the two groups. The Arab nations rejected the UN ruling and attacked Israel.So what is the problem here?- The Arab nations do not accept the existance of Israel. Three wars were fought to try and defeat Israel. Each time, Israel gained more territory.What is the solution?- Hamas needs to stop the rocket fire and organise a lasting truce. After a long truce, Hamas should negotiate for opening the border.So why did Cast Lead occur?- Israel wanted to renew the ceasefire. Hamas refused to extend the ceasefire, unless Israel *also* opened the border. Israel refused. Hamas started launching rockets. Israel bombed Gaza until they stopped. Now Hamas is happy to have a ceasefire.

Posted by John Smith | Report as abusive