Comments on: Reflections on Iran http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/ Thu, 21 Jul 2016 07:57:19 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: bruce http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-24521 Sun, 20 Sep 2009 16:50:33 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-24521 Important to note that Israel intelligence services trained The notorious Savak secret police and supported the Shah’s regime supression of the iranian populace.As in Lebanon,Israel actions helped bring about radical Islam as with Hizbollah.Israel’s brutal 19 year occupation gave birth to the extreme Shia group and mideast suicide bombing as we know it.There was no Hizbollah before Isael’s invasion in the 1980’s.Hamas in Gaza as well was intially supported by Israel.

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By: Rob http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17702 Wed, 01 Jul 2009 04:23:32 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17702 One thing that is often overlooked in these historical forays is that the US doesn’t operate in a vacuum. While it is true that most of the legwork in operation AJAX in 1953 was done by Kermit Roosevelt and the nascent beginnings of the CIA under Allen Dulles; the birthplace of the operation was in the British foreign service who dangled the spectre of communism in front of the US.
There was a feeling during those days that any power vacuum would be filled instantly with Iron Curtain style communist regimes – in short, that the communists were as active in manipulating new governments as the west was.
That being said, the US has had a history of misreading nationalist and/or populist movements in the world, and particularly int he middle east. Anything that smacks of socialism or communism was instantly linked to the struggle against the Kremlin, which we now know to be a falsehood.
The first rule of foreign diplomacy should be “First, Do No Harm”. Obama in, staying on the sidelines, knows what previous administrations should have known and the founding fathers knew: Independence cannot be given, it can only be seized. It is for the people of Iran (and Honduras, and Iraq, and Afghanistan) to push for their own form of government. Don’t assume the worst case scenario, that any foreign people – left to their own devices – will make the worst possible decision about their governments.

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By: Michael Ham http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17602 Mon, 29 Jun 2009 18:26:00 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17602 Don,
If you’re a Bush supporter you should love Obama, he’s doubled the nation-builiding Bush started in Afghanistan and continued the snail-like pull out pace in Iraq. He’ll leave 50,000 there indefinitely too, music to your ears I would think.

What would the “manly” and “tough” thing be to do? Invade Iran? What should we do to Saudi Arabia or Egypt? Iran at least attempts to make it look like they have a democracy, you see 99% voting (lol) for the incumbents and none in Saudi Arabia.

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By: Anubis http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17597 Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:38:35 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17597 Don, do you remember Kent State?

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By: Anubis http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17595 Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:24:44 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17595 When will the proletariat wake up. There are few societies in the world that are truly egalitarian and democratic. It is hypocritical for a nation that allowed a court to appoint a President should be so outraged at developments in Iran.

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By: Niyaz http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17585 Mon, 29 Jun 2009 09:54:13 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17585 What is done is done, in order to solve the current problems we should not enagege wht is done in past. In doing so the world will never be satble and safe. What is happening in Iran is a local issue, it is unwise to blame the US & UK for the election fallout in Iran. People voted and they want their voice be heard. Even Mousavi-the opposition leader- is proud of islamic regime and islamic revolution in Iran. People in Iran are frustratesed for changes thats why the turnout of the election was stunning.

President Obama has repeatedly shown his interest of having deplomatic relations with Iran, so we can not blame the US fro more tensions between the US and Iran. The one who should be blamed is Iran since after 12 june election Ahmadinazhad is reluctant to start negotiations with Iran and he critisized presiden Obama for “meddling” in Iran.

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By: Jay Kain http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17576 Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:26:21 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17576 Alright, I never intended to justify the acts of present Iranian regime. No doubt the treatment they have meted out to the protesters is atrocious. No one should stand by a regime like that of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.
I am only trying to expose just one of the many ugly faces of this debate.
The fact is that the US WILL NOT come to the aid of people in Saudi or Egypt if they decide to take to the streets. Simply because it is not in their interest to do so. And that’s the crux of the problem. US interest(read greed).

Look, you can either have principles or you can have greed. It is not possible to have both. Principles are not supposed to change with geographical location. Are they? If they do, as in the case of US, no one will believe you !! and that is what the Iranian clerics are using today to rally support back home. You may not like it, but they do enjoy a lot of support.

And before I am classified a US basher, please note that I am trying to highlight just one issue. There are so many of them, most of them intertwined, that it is simply not possible to post it in one comment.

As far as the present Iranian protests are concerned, we stand by them unconditionally, but unless we look at this problem from every angle, even those that are uncomfortable to us, there will be never be a solution.

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By: Folklight http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17569 Mon, 29 Jun 2009 01:38:55 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17569 Jay, you can make anyone believe anything.. persuade perhaps.

While some look backwards into history, history is being written on the streets of Teheran and in the secret conversations of clerics and enforcers across Iran TODAY!

Despite threats of execution by radical mullahs an estimated 5000 Iranians joined in orderly peaceful protest through Teheran to an area near Qoba Mosque in a show of solidarity and to honor Mohammed Behesthi, a cleric killed in a bombing 28 years ago today. Mousavi had called on his supporters to participate and he made a “drive-by” appearance to the crowd but did not address them. This demonstration was the first in a number of days and reports filtering out have been scarce due to heavy electronic jamming. Meanwhile hackers are coming to the aid of the Iranian protesters by attacking websites of the regime and setting up secure networks by hosting proxies outside the nation.

While western governments (and some news outlets) are mostly supporting with words, musician and bandleader Jon Bon Jovi along with Iranian Superstar and Andy Madadian went into an LA recording with Richie Sambora to record “Stand By Me” as a musical message of global solidarity in both English and Farsi. This classic American tune will likely become a theme song of besieged Iranian people writing history on hearts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RASKaZFZt S8
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— Pray for Peace —
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFyMh2igs hs

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By: Paul Rosa http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17568 Sun, 28 Jun 2009 22:04:21 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17568 Mr Kay: The US alone can’t be blamed for making a mess of the world by dividing it into us and them. Every country, everybody, does that. The people(s) with the greatest power and influence just make the biggest and deepest cuts before the next strongest cuts off his piece. We are all still carving up or just trying to hang onto our territory and prey and protecting our access to it. We may not be able to do that as easily now – there are so many laws outlawing cannibalism and related activities – and we are forced to work together to distinguish ourselves from the prey. But we are civilized and I value that. I’m happy there are all sorts of laws banning cannibalism and I’m glad I have certain legal rights with those strong people who protect my status as possible (more likely probable)prey.

And perhaps an answer to your question about why the standard of states is always a double standard is because their dealings with each other are frequently double dealings. The ability to define a truly honest or fair deal in anything in life, let alone the dealing of one state to another – and all those minds at different times -,is always an improvisation and trust in it all tends to diminish the farther those dealings are from the “end-user”, i.e. you and me. And all the powers have to give repeated and very public performances of being allied (and much more importantly sign papers – that are publicly accessible) to prove to each other their dubious sincerity.

The public understanding of performances of trust varies considerably. One can even hold them in contempt as so many of us do, because they are so far removed from our daily lives as to be considered luxuries to follow at all. And that is why the luxury of the performance – the grandeur of it is important. It must be ennobling or the show is about States showing the least attractive sides to each other. Only very honest, very trusting or very stupid people will ever let the least attractive side of themselves show if they want allies. Ain’t that so?

You can be certain that the editors of the world’s organs of information must also be the retouch artists for the lapses from grace of states. They do it selectively and have enormous power. In a global world the emperor of the world is media. Doesn’t the reader of news today really need to read with several perspectives and from many sources. And no one’s trustworthy source ever seems to be the right one.

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By: Jay Kain http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2009/06/26/reflections-on-iran/#comment-17559 Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:52:57 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/?p=4218#comment-17559 In 1971 when India sent in it’s forces to protect citizens of Bangladesh, then East Pakistan, from an obvious slaughter by Pakistan army; the United States sent it’s nuclear armed USS Enterprise in the Bay of Bengal to threaten the Indian forces…. Despite healthy relations between India and the United States now, no one in India has forgotten this little piece of history. Given this how can one expect the Iranians to just forget and forgive the West? Conservatives may take pot shots at this article, but the fact is that NO ONE likes to see his country invaded, his countrymen murdered, and his countries enemies supported. The United States has made a mess of this world by dividing it into ‘Our Allies’ and ‘Our Enemies’. We are talking about a country that has no interest in bringing democracy in ‘allied’ countries like Saudi Arabia, which are equally bad if not worse. I wonder how the Sunni clerics in Saudi Arabia will react if their women come out on the streets demanding equal rights. I would also like to see how the US reacts to that situation. The base line is this- If you cannot make your ‘allies’ to believe in principles of democracy and individual freedom, how will you ever manage to convince your enemies???

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