Islam, terror and political correctness

By Bernd Debusmann
February 19, 2010

– Bernd Debusmann is a Reuters columnist. The opinions expressed are his own. –

The Islamic terrorists of the Bush era are gone. They have been replaced by violent extremists in a purge of the American government’s political lexicon. Smart move in the propaganda war between al Qaeda and the West? Or evidence of political correctness taken to extremes?

Those questions are worth revisiting after the publication in February of two key documents issued by the administration of President Barack Obama, the Pentagon’s Quadrennial Defense Review (QDR) and the Quadrennial Homeland Security Review. Both deal with what used to be called the Global War on Terror. Neither uses the words “Muslim” or “Islam.”

The QDR says the United States is at war with al Qaeda and the Taliban, and speaks of the threat from “non-state actors” and terrorist networks. The Homeland Security Review identifies “al Qaeda and global violent extremism” as one of the main threats to the United States. No word on religion or al Qaeda’s use of a twisted version of Islam to justify mass murder.

To some, this omission amounts to a dangerous failure to deal with the root of the problem, evidence of a mind-set determined to avoid the appearance of anti-Muslim bias even if that endangers national security. Such charges flew thick and fast after a Muslim army officer, Major Nidal Malik Hasan allegedly killed 12 fellow soldiers and an army civilian in a shooting spree last November at the Fort Hood military base, shouting “Allahu Akbar” (God is greater) as he opened fire.

There was no mention of Islam, or Hasan’s interpretation of his faith and his publicly proclaimed anger over America’s wars in Muslim countries, in the 86-page Army report on the shooting. In the words of John Lehman, a member of the commission set up to investigate the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks on New York and Washington, the report released in January showed “how deeply entrenched the values of political correctness have become.”

President Obama’s initial description of the young Nigerian Muslim who attempted to bring down an airliner over Detroit on Christmas Day (“an isolated extremist”) also prompted charges from conservatives that his administration fails to recognize the link between Islamic radicalism and terrorism.

According to a variety of media reports, the Nigerian, Umar Farouk Abdulmuttalab, was fitted with his explosives-laden underwear in Yemen and was in contact there with Anwar al-Awlaki, a U.S.-born radical cleric and al Qaeda recruiter who also corresponded by email with Maj. Hasan before the Fort Hood shooting spree.

So what’s the other side of the story, that it is smart to use terminology that avoids routinely linking the words Islamic or Muslim and terrorist? This idea actually dates back to the final year of the administration of George W. Bush, the man who handed al Qaeda a potent propaganda weapon five days after the September 11 attacks.

BUSH’S GIFT TO AL QAEDA

“This crusade, this war on terrorism, is going to take awhile,” he said in an unscripted remark. Using the word “crusade” to describe American retaliation to September 11 was counter-productive in the extreme. It recalled one of the darkest chapters in Christian history, the killing of hundreds of thousands of Muslims by marauding Christian “holy warriors” in repeated attempts to capture Jerusalem.

Bush never used the word again but “crusades” has been a gift that keeps giving for Osama bin Laden and his followers who say they are waging war against “Jews and crusaders,” a conflict they still hope to turn into a permanent clash of civilizations.

“Al Qaeda and its affiliated ideologues … want to create a homogenous, undifferentiated Islam on whose behalf they speak and a coherent master narrative which justifies their action,” Marc Lynch, who heads the Institute for Middle East Studies at George Washington University, wrote in a recent essay.

Conflating terrorism and Islam and thus creating a mental connection between the two, in other words, serves al Qaeda’s cause.

In March 2008, the National Counterterrorism Center (NCTC), established by a George W. Bush executive order, issued an internal set of guidelines on “language issues that may enhance or detract” from getting America’s message across.

Key points:
** “Don’t Invoke Islam: Although the al Qaeda network exploits religious sentiments and tries to use religion to justify its actions, we should treat it as an illegitimate political organization, both terrorist and criminal.”
** “Don’t Harp on Muslim Identity: Avoid labeling everything ‘Muslim.’ It reinforces the “U.S. vs Islam” framework that al Qaeda promotes. Be specific (Egyptian, Pakistani) and descriptive (South Asian youth, Arab opinion leaders) where possible.
** “Use the terms ‘violent extremist’ or ‘terrorist.’ Both are widely understood terms that define our enemies appropriately and simultaneously deny them any level of legitimacy.”

At the time, “violent extremist” was a non-binding suggestion. It has now become the Obama administration’s phrase of choice. Whether that is tantamount to dangerous political correctness is still a matter of debate.

45 comments

We welcome comments that advance the story through relevant opinion, anecdotes, links and data. If you see a comment that you believe is irrelevant or inappropriate, you can flag it to our editors by using the report abuse links. Views expressed in the comments do not represent those of Reuters. For more information on our comment policy, see http://blogs.reuters.com/fulldisclosure/2010/09/27/toward-a-more-thoughtful-conversation-on-stories/

“Major Nidal Malik Hasan allegedly killed 12 fellow soldiers and an army civilian”

Why include “allegedly”? Is there doubt that he did it? Is more proof required before this statement is accepted?

Besides that, a very interesting article. I’ll be thinking about this for a while.

Posted by drewbie | Report as abusive

The only surprise about the “Islamic terrorist” sobriquet is how long certain elements of U.S. leadership chose to flay it like a rented mule and how readily how many xenophobic dimwits with how dreadfully little insight into the world at large chose to go on parroting it as though it lent their institutionally chronic paranoia one iota of gravitas.

The appendage of any adjective to the word “terrorist” implies that the speaker understands terrorism, which in itself makes the speaker’s sanity and allegiance suspect.

Posted by HBC | Report as abusive

Why not call a spade a spade? Reuters uses the term ‘militants’, Washington uses ‘violent extremists’, both of which let Muslims off the hook, like it’s nothing to do with them at all. That’s why Muslim organizations usually are silent about these atrocities. You guys really should read up on Eric Blair aka George Orwell and what he had to say about political/social euphemisms and the like.

Posted by Gotthardbahn | Report as abusive

I’m reminded of Reuter’s Editor blog post about only using a religious (or any other) adjective when the person being described’s actions were based on or around faith.

It seems to me that while flying planes into foreign buildings for a god qualifies, planting a bomb in your own country to kill foreign troops may not.

Posted by drewbie | Report as abusive

The future predicted by Orwell is upon us……..

Posted by JJWest | Report as abusive

Articles such as above reveals the enormous gap in information of what is Islam. It is a faith that has a great deal that is common to both Chritianity and Judaism. There are almost 1.2 billion people who practice this faith. It would be stupid to think 1.5 billion people wake up everyone trying to be a terrorist in some far away country that he or she knows nothing about. Most of them at one point or another have been the victims of CIA bred Jihadists who they used to fight the Russians in Afghanistan. They then conveiniently left them when the Russians withdrew, without ever deprogramming these monsters. And now itis chic, to go after a religion which never encouraged violence against any religion or people. On the contrary – they sheltered folks of jewish faiths who were being annilated in Europe. Here is another fact – Arabs Muslims represent about 15% of World’s Muslim Population. Most Muslims live in countries like Indonesia, India, Pakistan and Bangladesh. Pakistan, however was were CIA set up Madrassahs to train the Jihadists to fight the Russians.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

And who is this guy -Bernd, sounds European. Should we forget that Europe and with the support Europeans and from every corner rounded up their fellow Jewish citizens along with their children to death camps. A Jewish population of 9 million was reduced to 3 million. This was a horrible crime, beyond comprehension to most Muslims. It would have never happened in the Muslim world. Ahmedinejad does not represent the Muslim world only a small section in Iran.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

Delta Flight 253 details from a flight attendant at http://storyburn.com.

Why we police the world and spend trillions starting wars we cannot win is beyond me

Posted by muchstardude | Report as abusive

The Jewish done so many wrong things to European peoples are written in the history, now the Jewish try to kill all the Arabians and claim Arabians land as theirs.. Try to speak of justice please try not to blame Islam or Arabians peoples.. Stop killing muslims because of your hunger of blood and money, Jewish has a bad History with Muslim, it was they try to banish Islam from Arab and the world.. Please understand, Arabians try to protect their land and future, terror to America was made because their make the wishes of the Jewish came true.. Islam Battle on the field not by terror, they fight without fear and we should respect that

Posted by Cipto | Report as abusive

It’s not just the Muslims that are the problem, it’s everyone that believes in a religion that has them thinking more about what is to come after they die then when they are living.

Posted by USSoldier | Report as abusive

I wouldn’t say Islam never encouraged violence. In many countries Muslims resort to violence. Think of India, Pakistan, Indonesia, the Philippines etc… As a community I have not seen or heard of any Muslims standing up to the violent doctrine that perverts their faith.

There was a small article on this site about the mothers of young men programed to be jihadists and how they were taking their children back. That movement is small. And aside from that I’ve not seen any support in the Muslim community for the cessation of violence. Even in the international scene there is no condemnation of these militants by established Islamic governments.

And yet they like to paint themselves as peaceful people who mean no harm, (unless of course they don’t get what they want). Fort Hood is a good example of someone falling back on Islam to justify violence. That major might have had it tough being harassed by other officers, but a shooting spree was not the only, or the best choice he could have made. But “God is great” so who cares if a few infidels eat it?

Faith is certainly part of the equation. It is a perversion to say that God as creator and sustainer of the universe would command his children to kill their brothers and sisters. Yet this is accepted and quietly condoned by the Muslim community at large.

Posted by Benny_Acosta | Report as abusive

The post by ShamimH …

“Should we forget that Europe and with the support Europeans and from every corner rounded up their fellow Jewish citizens along with their children to death camps. A Jewish population of 9 million was reduced to 3 million. This was a horrible crime, beyond comprehension to most Muslims. It would have never happened in the Muslim world.”

This may well be true because in many Muslim countries EVERYONE is Muslim. They take care of people who attempt to follow a different religion one person at a time as they try to practice religious freedom. Google “Muslim attempting to convert” and you’ll see what is NOT beyond the comprehension of Muslims.

Holding up the Muslim world as an example of how avoid religious persecution is ridiculous.

The US is following an “extreme” political correct path that ignores the fundamental attribute of those that wish to attack us, they claim to follow the Muslim faith.

Posted by GOBO | Report as abusive

[...] a thought provoking piece published in this morning’s Reuters, Columnist Bernd Debusmann articulates what is for many [...]

I have always found it useful and often necessary to acknowledge a problem before it is possible to deal with it. If you can not acknowledge a problem there is a good chance you are hiding from the reality of the problem rather than dealing with it.

Mr President, surely you know wars are also wars of ideas. The best way to resolve the war is to win the war of ideas. How can you conceivable win this war of ideas by ignoring reality and presenting things that may be politically expedient but are simply not true.

You know we are not simply dealing bunch of criminals, but enemy combatants who have formally declared war against us. Some guy did not get on an airplane to simply blow himself up. He was clearly a soldier, part of a group, a world wide movement. He had his orders and had been provisioned. How can you be so stupid as to characterize him and treat him as a common criminal?

Mr President, how can you conceivable win the war of ideas when you seem unable to accept the war is about Islamic extremism and not simply violent extremists. Where did this guy get the idea he was a soldier for his God and that his life would be better by blowing himself up? You can not solve that problem by sticking you head in the sand and being unwilling to confront that Islamic teaching gone wrong!

Posted by Dave1 | Report as abusive

Obama continues Bush’s policies, albeit under different names. How long will it take the public to realize that Obama’s campaign promises for change were about as enduring as a covering of spring flowers on a graveyard. Politics is about appearances. Obama talks Left and acts Right, and there’s a word for that, used at Left Blog.

Posted by reverse_cloud | Report as abusive

I prefer the term “violent extremist”.

Use of the terms “Islamic extremist” or “Muslim extremists” conveniently ignores those terrorists who just happen to be white and not Muslim. Consider the terrorist Tim McViegh, Paul Hill, Eric Rudolf, Andrew Stack, Scott Roeder, etc who were terrorists motivated by religious or political goals as surely as any Islamic terrorist.

Posted by mcmcmcmcm | Report as abusive

GOBO writes: “This may well be true because in many Muslim countries EVERYONE is Muslim…” confirms how ignorant folks are when knowledge is a finger tip away.

Just like Europe when ignorance and the blame game faulted people of Jewish faith. And the convuluted mind set that led to mass murder. It was only possible because of 1000 years of inbreeding in Europe – murder and mayhem as been their history. WW II, we are told, led to the murder of 56 million people. Europeans are the last one to be pointing fingers on “murder and violence.”

Was the New World any better. Both continents were soaked in blood from the guns and swords of Europeans.

I for one who believes folks of Jewish faith have been a force of good, in this world and continue to be healthy influence in the World. And I was raised in a Muslim family that abhors violence.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

drewbie writes:” 1:59 pm EST“Major Nidal Malik Hasan allegedly killed 12 fellow soldiers and an army civilian”

And sick individuals roam around everywhere in the USA. One of them blew up building in Oklahoma killing many in order to fight the federal government. Some of them even go into a place of worship and shoot people up. Is Christianity to be blamed for this? Absolutely not.

Efforts to label a faith because some members born into that faith are mentally sick has no rational basis. And worst of all makes the fight against extremists that much more difficult.

Jews, Hindus, Christians, Buddhists and Muslims – the overwhelming majority of them are peace loving people and their primary focus is to raise their family in peace and prosperity.

The last thing we need is an idiot like “Bernd” create unnecessary and unhelpful divisions.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

mcmcmcmcm – You, and people like you like to pretend we are not at war. That is why you like the word “violent extremist” instead of “Islamic extremist” because it allows you to lie to yourself about that reality. If you wish to confront your self imposed blindness I suggest you google “Bin Laden full text declaration of war” and read several of the items.

Posted by Dave1 | Report as abusive

Islamic teaching never gone wrong, it’s your brain gone wrong..
It were written on the history that Muslim country never invade any country in this world just to spread their believes, even for money or their thirst of blood, it was those whom from the west start to take their land and believe by forces, killing and rapes.
If you smart and have hart you will not send your troops just to make another terrorist and let your soldier died only for plugging their land for your own economic profit.
How do you feel if your family being killed, your land taken, your wife and doughter being rape and being forced to enter another religion or none? Those have been made by US, allies, and the Jewish (Israel) to the Middle East country, that is why they angry and went to war.. Children or women even they would die because there was no hope to live in peace before your crusade mission and Jewish invasion stop.
Mr. President, be nice with em, stop the war, leave their country alone and don’t let your self being provoke by the racism in your country that live for decade after decade.

Posted by Cipto | Report as abusive

If 1.2 billion Muslims, if even 1 out of 100 of them was an extremist then the total number of Muslim terrorist would be 120 million. And that is unreal.

Problems of poverty and malnourishment is a bigger problem of Muslim countries than terrorism.

And then you add the ignorance of many in Europe the problem becomes a scapegoat for brain dead Europeans. They have to have someone to blame for their weaknesses. In the 30′s and 40′s it was people of jewish faith and now Muslims. Like I said when small landlocked groups do not venture out of their locals, they tend to inbred.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

Cipto – You say “Islamic teaching never gone wrong, it’s your brain gone wrong.” I am not sure I understand that. I have Muslim friends who believe in peace who do not think it is their duty and obligation to kill me because I do not believe the same way they do. What are you saying? Are you suggesting the Islamic terrorists who blow planes and people up for their God are properly following their Islamic teachings? Do you actually believe those terrorists go to heaven?

Posted by Dave1 | Report as abusive

Dave1 writes: “If you wish to confront your self imposed blindness I suggest you google “Bin Laden full text declaration of war” and read several of the items.”

So how many people does Bin Laden represent. Where would the war terror be if majority of the folks in Muslim Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Pakistan and Afghanistan were not supporting the US efforst.

Bit idiots like you make it difficult for the locals in these countries to fight the extremists. And as your ignorance suggests, you probably don’t know that majority of the victims of these extremists are Muslims.

Brits appears to be the only sharp people from Europe. And no other nation will ever match their feat – rule the world. And they did it with diplomacy and intricate understanding of the locals. I doubt any other nation will match them.

Even in Iraq they suffered far less casualties then Americans.

In this era – “kudos to the Brits” and “kudos to folks of Jewish faith”. You make the world a better place.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

Cipto writes: “Stop killing muslims because of your hunger of blood and money, Jewish has a bad History with Muslim, it was they try to banish Islam from Arab and the world.. ”

So a small strip of land in tbe barren desert is home to about two million people of Jewish faith along with their Arab citizens (mostly Muslims) have found a safe haven – after surviving a European holocaust.

Why can’t you let them live there? They can be the driving economy for all of the Arab lands. Educated creative, they can create a better life for all Arabs. Just stop shooting at them and they will stop shooting at you.

No one who lived through the hell of WWW II in Europe as the Jewish have can ever know and feel what it was like.

Let them have their peace in their small island and if you can accept them as fellow humans – you can give root to better future for the children of Arab lands.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

so…why are we labeling any terrorist attack on the nation by an Arab as “Muslim…” why did we not label the IRS bomber as a “Christian” terrorist? or the guy the bombed the FBI building as a whatever religion bomber? Its blatantly clear that racism and religious hate are playing a big role…and Allah u Akbar, I translated it into google, definitely does not mean god is greater you moron…it means God is GREAT…difference.

good luck with the backwards thinking and obvious religious hate.

I love how people say “I will think about this article for a while” what the heck is there to think about? Its so one sided its not even funny. It’s people like you that are keeping us behind the rest of the word, and why so many people hate us…

M

Posted by kassem277 | Report as abusive

Shamim writes “GOBO writes: “This may well be true because in many Muslim countries EVERYONE is Muslim…” confirms how ignorant folks are when knowledge is a finger tip away.”

I don’t understand where the ignorance is in that comment. Look it up – Egypt – 91% Muslim, Somalia 99%, Iran 99%, Morocco 98%, Afghanistan 99%, Saudi Arabia 96%. The list goes on. This is TODAY not 70 years ago.

My point is simple, these Muslim countries are the source of the people who want to attack western countries. These Muslim countries do not practice religious freedom. Their homogeneous populations allow extremists to inbreed and flourish. To decouple Islam from these extremists when attempting to talk about and address their acts is a mistake.

Shamim writes “And I was raised in a Muslim family that abhors violence.” I applauded the fact that you were raised in a Muslim family that abhors violence. However it is a mystery to me why there is virtually no Muslim outcry over the radicals taking over the Muslim faith. They certainly have a voice when it comes to newspaper cartoons and issuing fatwas.

Posted by GOBO | Report as abusive

Secular terrorists don’t go about shouting “Allah akbar”. They don’t concern themselves with promises of an afterlife. Secular terrorists don’t seek the validation or blessing of God before killing.

The kind of people we are currently “at war” with, are religious zealots who act in the name of Allah. The are a particular group connected by common interest and religious belief. There really is no other way to describe them than as Muslim terrorists or Jihadists. Are there other kinds of terrorists? Of course there are. But collectively it is the Muslim jihadists that Bin-Laden has galvanized against the US. And other Muslim militant groups are only to happy to jump on the bandwagon to have an excuse to kill.

Killing is a fairly simple process. Talking things out and working towards understanding and enlightenment is difficult. And so the real cowards resort to killing. They can’t handle the work of living. Expose the lies they live by and they will be powerless to subvert the minds of others.

Posted by Benny_Acosta | Report as abusive

Not all Muslims are terrorists but almost all terrorists are Muslims. This is a fact.

Posted by jacqo | Report as abusive

ShamimH – If is walks like a duck, talks like a duck and acts like a duck, it is a duck. It does no one any good to not acknowledge that it is a duck. You can not fight a war unless you can specifically and exactly identify your enemy and you can not do that without knowledge.

My point is simple. The enemy, the people who declared and who are carrying out war against us are “Islamic extremists.” You and others who would like to forget they are “Islamic” and you serve no one by avoiding that truth. My point is that you can never win the war of ideas unless you are truthful to both yourself and everyone else.

For you to participate in a cover up of the truth is to simply concede that war of ideas for your own political expediency. The end result of such stupidity is to wage a war of physical violence that can never be won because you are unwilling or unable to even confront the underlying cause. You MUST win to war of ideas to stop the violence!

Posted by Dave1 | Report as abusive

Actually all religious are against terror.Lets Obama plays his role how to varnish terror.Bush era are gone and we need support Obama to do it – so that our world will be Peace!

how to stop panic attacks
woodworking plan

Posted by anne109 | Report as abusive

Dave1 writes: My point is simple. The enemy, the people who declared and who are carrying out war against us are “Islamic extremists.”

Read all my posts – these are the remnants of CIA’s creations in Afghanistan from the perion when Soviets were there. Most of them trained in Jihadi camps by ISI and CIA with mileading scripture. Now to blame Islam and rest of the world is asinine. Just as easily we can call the Nazi’s and Facists are Christian terrorists. Of course, one can recall that the Pope of Rome did not raise against the deportation and murder of the Jews.

And then Yugoslavia – Christian terrorist murdered thousands of Muslims and contradicts that all terrorists are Muslims. The same Muslims who during WW II sheltered many Jews.

Calling Jihadists as Muslims is defeating. After all it is the Muslims who are in the frontline fighting a group of murderers created by CIA.

Or maybe more correctly we should call them “CIA terrorists”, just like the Sandista’s. Or should we call the Sandista’s as Christian terrorists. Blows a hole on the idea that all terrorists are Muslims.

Or should we say we have selected memory and we see what we want to see, ala Kurosawa’s movie Rashoman.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

RASHOMAN is a great movie. You should see it. A crime is committed, witnessed by more than one person. But as each recalled the murder they had a versiom different from others. Each saw in it what they wanted to see.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

jacqo writes: “2:39 pm ESTNot all Muslims are terrorists but almost all terrorists are Muslims. This is a fact”

Fact!! say’s who?…!! Get educated because you sound like an idiot. Sandanista’s in Nicaragua was funded and abetted by CIA like the Jihadists in Afghanistan. And then many in the USA claim that even 9/11 was staged to prop up George Bush, with the help of CIA or may be others. And who are the folks who sold Stingers to Iran, to raise money for Christian terrorists (Sandanista’s). Or, do we have selected memory and forget what happened in the 80′s and 90′s. Can anyone recall a group called PFLP. Popular Front of George Habash, Christian Palestinians fighting Israel. Remember – Leila Khaled of PFLP whose compadre’s hijacked 4 passenger planes and blew them up in the deserts of Jordan. Recall – Phalange – Lebanese Christian terror group murdering Palestinian civilians near Beirut. Of course some of us suffer from amnesia and not quite recall all those events.
Terrorists are tools of powerful nation players who wish to be hidden behind the scene. They do not occur in vacuum. Large sums of money is doled out to keep them going. Cut off the money and they disappear. And they are conveniently labeled to keep the main players conveniently hidden.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

The puiblic talks about religion and the scapegoats of the events BUT NOT ONE of you has stated the cause of the problem.
There is an industrial complex of companies who control this US government and most of the world governments. They have controlled the Kennedy assassination, 11 September, extortion from the bailout moneys, Haiti, and are about to takeover the country while you bicker over the religions.
The clock is ticking out and you are still asleep.

Posted by wwhitteker | Report as abusive

ShamimH – You are making stuff up and ignoring the obvious! If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck. The Islamic extremists formally declared war against us and waged war against us by killing the innocent and taking down the Trade Towers. I mean, how difficult it that for you? What makes you make stuff up when the obvious facts of reality stare you in the face?

Posted by Dave1 | Report as abusive

Quote: “How do you feel if your family being killed, your land taken, your wife and doughter being rape and being forced to enter another religion or none?”

Cipto, are you talking about what Mohammed did? Yes, he did all those things according to Islam’s own traditions. I am glad you brought this up.

The fact is that Islam is a religion of hate and violence. Look around and see the obvious. Remember these people love and respect Mohammad, a man that raided, plundered, murdered, enslaved men women and children. tortured and raped. Oh yes, he also beat Aisha, his child-wife. Read the ahadith!

Muslims refuse to be honest about Islam and its prophet. Their values are not our values. We condemn evil, even our own. Muslims refuse to look at the vile words in the Quran or the evil deeds of their prophet, so they always blame others.

Unless Muslims critically examine their religion and apply the same standards they demand of others, things will get worse.

Bad times are coming.

K.

Posted by kactuz | Report as abusive

peace to all
this is for kactuz

in islam ,it it mentioned in the quran “there is no compulsion in islam.the clear path is distinct from the wrong path”.try seeing islam deeply before believing what the media tells u and proclaiming it as bad as u described it in your comment.perhaps once u understand islam ,u will say islam is a gift to human being.have a peaceful day..xoxo

Posted by iknow_ampretty | Report as abusive

Dave1 writes:”The Islamic extremists formally declared war against us and waged war against us by killing the innocent and taking down the Trade Towers. I mean, how difficult it that for you? What makes you make stuff up when the obvious facts of reality stare you in the face?”

Who are these Islamic terrorists you are talking about?? Or was it an elaborate plot ?? 19 terrorists – 4 from Egypt 15 from Saudi Arabia. Hatches up a plot in Hamburg, Germany, trains in South Florida with money flowing in from Karachi, Pakistan. Launches an attack dressed in Western clothes, clean shaven – hardly the profile of religious zealots.

Then ask yourself, what happened to the Flight recorders or why tower 7 came down hours afterwards. Ask what the ISI’s (Pakistan’s – intelligent service) rep doing in Langley when the plane hit. Why is it that many of the actors of this terror plot started their journey in Karachi, Pakistan. Where was Khalid Shaikh Mohammed when he was captured? No, not in a mosque – his cell phone intercept that led to his capture came from a Military base in Rawalpindi, Pakistan. When the phone intercept was detected and co-ord’s provided to Musharraf he had no choice but handover the plotters. All these information is at your finger tip – do a search on a book called “While America slept” and read. Or, even read the 9/11 commission report. There is no such thing as Islamic terrorist. There is the Al-Qaeda – a group of mostly Saudi’s and Yemenis led by Bin Laden. And where is he ? Who is sheltering Bin Laden and why ??

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

This mindless mis-direction of grievances towards “Islam” by many in Europe and conservatives in North America is dangerous and counter-productive. Identify the groups and go after them, do not unnecessarily create more enemies than you need to. And if for no other reason alienating the man of the street in the Muslim world, whose help we need to locate these terror groups.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

Mr. I know

The problem here is that I know Islam better than you.

You say “no compulsion in religion” as if that were reality, as if there were no apostasy laws in dozens of Islamic countries and, most of all, as if there were no contradictory verses in the Quran that Imams use to enforce the sharia ruling on death to apostates.

Note also the hadith by your dear prophet that says “kill anyone that changes his (Islamic) religion”. Note that the word ‘Islamic’ is added to correct a stupid mistake, otherwise Muslims would have to kill concerts to islam.

So, if there is “no compulsion” then millions of people have been put to death because of the words of Mohammed, approved by Allah. You can’t have it both ways. Either Mohammed is a killer or Allah writes stupid verses.

About peace, look up Quran 9:111 and tell me where the “peace” fits in. Where exactly is the “peaceful” aspect of “Killing and being killed”. You have a good day.

Kactuz

Posted by kactuz | Report as abusive

Kactuz – know it all?? more like know nothing – What is Hadith ? Written 400 years after Mohammed’s death is supposed to be Gospel. In our language we call it “hearsay.” Yup a lot of illeterates talk about Hadith as if it was God’s work. And of course there are too many illiterates in the dugeons of Middle East and the Arab Peninsula. Arabs – we all know are an extremely poor example of a Muslim. Recall only 15% of the Muslims live in the Arab lands.

Read the Koran “Kactuz” and you will find a version – http://www.submission.org and then we will talk.

Posted by ShamimH | Report as abusive

wwhitteker – you observation is spot on. It beats me why a supposedly bankrupt country is so hated by such a supposed eclectic group of people, they must be very p!$$ed off about something.

Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:

‘Terrorism’ – Terrorism is the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion. At present, there is no internationally agreed definition of terrorism

‘Infidel’ (literally “one without faith”) is an English word meaning “a person who does not believe in religion or who adheres to a religion other than one’s own”.

I wonder what the Geneva Convention has to say about all of this ?

I also wonder why the word ‘Saudi’ surfaces so often during these debates ?

Posted by Ghandiolfini | Report as abusive

ShamimH, did you read my whole comment before responding to it? Because the part you quoted was quoting Bernd, and I was asking about a word choice (“allegedly”). Religion wasn’t a part of it.

Posted by drewbie | Report as abusive

Political correctness
Knocking ole Bush, no doubt he made some mistakes…….But Obama is trying to Kiss them to death….
that will be great until something happens here in the US again. Political Correctness will right out the widow.
The sad thing is, there is good Islamic folks that are paying a price for this.

WSOPNE777
http://wsopne.org

Posted by wsopne777 | Report as abusive

Has someone thought why there is so many different ideas on how to translate the Koran, the Bible etc. corect ?
Could it be that no one understands anything at all ?
Suppose “The father, The Son and The holy Ghost” from the Bible were Metaphors that says:
The father; Responsibility.
The son; Your task.
The holy ghost; Your will.
Suppose when the Koran has the man superior to the woman,
it says the same thing, hit your balls and bring on the show.

Posted by Breydel | Report as abusive

[...] according to French Foreign Ministry warning | Mail Online Muslim plot to blow up the pope. Islam, terror and political correctness | Analysis & Opinion | University students at centre of terror plots – Telegraph Suck on those. Reply With [...]

ShamimH – very good reading.
HBC – pompous politically correct arrogance

Posted by PhilK5 | Report as abusive