Comments on: What if the Israeli doves are wrong? http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/ Wed, 13 Apr 2016 01:13:45 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-221 Sun, 19 Feb 2012 03:58:03 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-221 @xcanada2,

Guess you flunked History. Google the British Mandate of Palestine and the League of Nations support for the creation of a Jewish state there. Much of the land was purchased from Arabs. Yes, many who moved there came from Europe and were secular. So what?

Was there adequate Arab compensation? I wasn’t there. There wasn’t fair compensation to “Native Americans” as the United States expanded across the continent. The Arabs supported the Axis in WW II. They lost!

The “Palestinians” who suffered most in the process and displacement of Israel’s creation are long dead and gone. They aren’t coming back. It’s a “done deal”. Get used to it.

International agitators care nothing for those who would have the burden of creating and structuring an economically viable “Palestinian State”. The Israelis have made swamps and desert bloom. What of merit or export value is the principle export of the West Bank and/or Gaza?

Why do these people just sit, breed, eat and hate forever with no land, no education, no skills, and no future? Because it has become their “job”. They literally subsist solely on terrorist “support money” from rich Arab regimes. If that money ever ceases to flow, these people will starve.

Only they can build a viable future for themselves. The “accomplishments” of five plus generations the world sees is kidnappings, suicide bombers and rockets launched into Israel too inaccurate to destroy a specific target like the Nazi terror campaign of rockets into England as WW II ended.

Germany had more resources, and achieved NOTHING strategically or militarily with their random rockets. If the Palestineans expect anything different, no one can “fix” stupid.

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By: xcanada2 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-220 Sun, 19 Feb 2012 00:00:39 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-220 @UnUnPartisan:

Not only was that thousands of years ago, and this is now.

But, as you undoubtedly know, the strong majority of Jews who have moved into Israel in the last 100 year are not Semites, and therefore your point holds not a drop of water. They are Europeans. Actually, the minority Semitic Jews are treated as second rate citizens in Israel. Many of them came from North Africa, and got along quite well with Muslim Semites for hundreds of years, since the time of the 1491 expulsion from Spain, up to the time of the Israel problem. Moreover, the Ottomans welcomed them into their area, after 1491. They still have a substantial presence in Istanbul, for example. Jewish memorabilia is well represented in Moroccan museums, some still live there, and some are returning and being welcomed back. It was Zionism that queered the works for Jews in Arab countries.

By the way, “total annihilation” sounds rather like Hitler. At worst, it appears that Arabs and Persians are suggesting that the Europeans go back to where they came from, or at least somewhere else. You have also probably read that the demographics of Israel are such that wholesale emigration scenario looks increasing likely. And, that certainly is another route to peace!

Give it a thought. It is a lot better than a Hitler-type solution.

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By: UnPartisan http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-219 Sat, 18 Feb 2012 23:12:53 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-219 @xcanada2

You know the land belonged to Israel a couple of thousand years before the Palestinians were there. It is like the Crusades. The Crusades were originally launched in response to a call from the leaders of the Byzantine Empire for help to fight the expansion into Anatolia of Muslim Seljuk Turks who had cut off access to Jerusalem. Had the arabs not decided to back Hitler in his quest to kill all Jews, perhaps Israel/Palestine issues would have been resolved back then. They lost, and that is what they get for backing Hitler. There constant attacks into Israel will keep them forever in their situation. Isreal shows much restraint, this is a situation where total anhilation seems to be the only path to peace.

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By: xcanada2 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-218 Sat, 18 Feb 2012 17:08:42 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-218 @OneOfTheSheep

It sounds like you believe that there were no Palestinians in Palestine before the Zionists arrived en masse and took over? I suppose that once they were displaced, they have no right to try to recover their land?

I suppose Gaza Palestinians should be thankful for the the beneficence of the Israelis? Hail Sharon!

Question authority!

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By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-217 Sat, 18 Feb 2012 06:36:52 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-217 @xcanada2,

The only territory Israel has “taken over” is that previously under the control of countries that attacked Israel without warning or provocation. That territory is to provide a “buffer”, like the “demilitarized zone” between North and South Korea, against further such attacks.

Israel’s illusion of nuclear weapons has been necessary in order to be allowed to live “within it’s boundaries” surrounded by those who would wipe it out in an instant had they they means to do so. They have long demonstrated they have the will.

Israel pulled out of Gaza, and was rewarded with resumed attacks by suicide bombers and terror rockets. They have acted with admirable restraint as “Palestinians” dig tunnels into Egypt to circumvent border restrictions on materials and weapons of war.

What does Gaza and the rest of “Palestine” export? Only hate and hostility without end or compromise. And no, I’m not a Jew by blood or belief. I just believe they have the same right to live as you, no more.

Intelligent people already recognize these truths.

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By: xcanada2 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-216 Sat, 18 Feb 2012 05:03:55 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-216 What exactly does “Israel fails ONCE it will, once and forever, cease to exist” mean? This is apocryphal sounding language, but what exactly does “cease to exist” mean. To me, it means nothing more than what has to happen: “Israel needs to live within its boundaries, learn to live with its neighbors, get rid of its nuclear weapons and … drop the Zionist enterprise.” It doesn’t mean the lie (see Wikipedia) concerning Ahmadinejad said: “Wipe Israel off the face of the map”, or anything like this. This is just the usual, getting very dog-eared, Zionist propaganda. Cease to exist means, END OF ZIONISM. Nothing more, or less. It will be a great step forward for Jews, and for the rest of the world.

Zionism, taking over another peoples country for your personal gain, is just a crazy religious stunt, and it is headed for the rubbish heap, where it should have stayed in the first place. The sooner it is abandoned by the Jews and Zionist Christians, the better for the world. Sentient people will recognize this truth.

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By: OneOfTheSheep http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-215 Sat, 18 Feb 2012 01:03:14 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-215 @xcanada2,

Israel is as “muscle bound” when it comes to the actual use of atomic weapons as any other country. It does not “absolutely dominate” other than through it’s continuation to exist surrounded by avowed enemies.

Israel’s survival is owed solely to a brave, literate and capable military. It has mostly prevailed even when others strike unexpectedly and without provocation. While it’s enemies can and have failed again and gain, it is rather obvious that if and when Israel fails ONCE it will, once and forever, cease to exist.

The ostrich with it’s head in the sand may “feel safe” and yet not be. “Feeling safe” is probably overrated in today’s world.

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By: xcanada2 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-208 Fri, 17 Feb 2012 18:44:29 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-208 It appears that Israel figures that it only lives by the absolute domination of the ME through its nuclear weapons.

They can’t be expected to be very rational, given their constant replaying of the Holocaust. I’m much more fearful of them, and the US Congress and Administration sycophants, than of Iran.

For those who take the “bomb them just in case”-position, try reading Ahmadinejad’s speech, and try understanding their position. Iran seems much more rational to me than we are (dominated as it is by psychologically sick Holocaust-fear purveyors). [http://www.juancole.com/2012/02/ahmadin ejad-speech-on-nuclear-energy-advances-f ull-text.html#more-15798]

“What if”, “what if”, etc.: The only way for perfect safety is to kill everybody and everything, even yourself. (Actually, killing yourself would do it.) Life has risks. That’s just the way it is. I think the tone of this opinion piece is simply ridiculous.

Israel needs to live within its boundaries, learn to live with its neighbors, get rid of its nuclear weapons and probably drop the Zionist enterprise. Elsewise, it will never feel safe.

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By: redwood509 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-207 Fri, 17 Feb 2012 18:34:13 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-207 Good idea, but can Israel really make a dent in Iran’s march to go nuclear unless it deploys doomsday weapon grade?
In the event that Israel could flawlessly deliver several perfect hits, unless it is prepared to use some kind of radioactive material, there is now way it could render the facilities a no go areas…I doubt if Israel has such variety of weaponry, that it could make a non- suicidal mission work and be supported in secrecy until its completion, this is not a quickie like Ozirak or the NoKo op in Syria, this is the biggest operation ever undertaken by the IAF, I am not sure they are up to it considering the terrain they need to cross, refueling, pay load, etc….

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By: Toosoonold http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/2012/02/16/what-if-the-israeli-doves-are-wrong/#comment-206 Fri, 17 Feb 2012 14:27:25 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/john-lloyd/?p=178#comment-206 Whilst I agree with your scribe, there are matters of public discourse that should be noted.
When you have two wolves and a sheep discussing whats for dinner, your discussion is for naught,
Next, I would urge that public rhetoric be turned down a notch or ten. There is such verbal and print clutter, It seems the I’s have it. Israel, Iran. Iraq, India, Italy, Ireland and Islamabad, yes we are people of passion, but please stop egging these two schoolboy’ into a schoolyard brawl.
Wars are easy to trigger, difficult to stop.
Ben-Zion, Netanya, ISRAEL.

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