War clouds over South Asia

December 24, 2008

There is a strange dichotomy in Delhi at the moment. If you read the headlines or watch the news on television, India and Pakistan appear headed for confrontation – what form, what shape is obviously hard to tell but the rhetoric is getting more and more menacing each day.

Pakistan army chief General Ashfaq Kayani promised a matching response ‘within minutes” were the Indians to carry out precision strikes against camps of militants inside Pakistan, whom it blames for the Mumbai attacks.

And as if they were doing a dress rehearsal, Pakistan Air Force jets have been flying over Islamabad and Lahore for the past two days, prompting one blogger  to report that some people had called up media outlets asking if the Indian Air Force was on its way.

Indian army chief General Deepak Kapoor meanwhile went up to the freezing heights of Siachen, the world’s highest battlefield, to test operational preparedness.

And yet off the front pages, and on the street and in living rooms, it doesn’t seem like a nation preparing for war. Instead Delhi is in the full swing of the marriage season when the astrological stars are right and thousands upon thousands of young couples trailed by a veritable army of friends, families and neighbours get betrothed.

There are also the Christmas/New Year festivities where the conversation is not about the possibility of war but the economic meltdown that has spoiled everyone’s party, including India’s. To be sure, there is rage each time Mumbai is mentioned, and there are many who say “they will have to pay for this”. But war? No, that isn’t at the top of people’s minds yet.

So what’s really going on? Is the threat of a fourth India-Pakistan war real, not counting 1999 when India and Pakistan fought over the heights above Kargil on the Line of Control? Are the two countries inexorably moving toward conflict without their people realising it?

Or is this the Cold Start  doctrine  that strategists speak of, in which you don’t really mobilise troops and armour for weeks on a vast scale and then go to war like in ancient times, but instead go quickly into action from forward bases both in the air and on the ground for a short and sharp thrust ?  

Your guess is as good as mine, but in another two days it will be a month since the Mumbai attackers struck.  As far as India is concerned, that is time enough for Pakistan to have acted against the men and groups that it says are involved in attacks on India. Is there a clock ticking somewhere?

Comments

I represent the country OF love, peace, tolerance and courage. We have been many time victimize by false claims – I am THE PAKISTANI.
indian media has done its level best and still striving to defeat Pakistan in the race of economy, progress and prosperity, but we have survived all ill-intentions of india – There are tall stories about Pakistan involvement in mumbai attacks, but there exist no evidence – none has been provided either to Pakistan or anyone else in the world. FBI, for instance asked india to bring evidences on the table to prove Pakistan involvement, and infact bring out the black sheep among them. Pakistani Army Chief has slapped the indian forces and politicians by saying we are ready to face any operation whether it is war or otherwise, and this has done in front of the whole world.

Some newspaper all over the world has even said that it is only a drama created by indian themselves just to cast away thier fear towards Pakistan.

Other things you have forgot or may be ignore are indian brutality in occupied Kashmir, indian support to gorillas to fight against Srilanka military

My recommendation to all who dream of Pakistan defeat on any ground is to consult good psychiatrist because this dream of your never comes true.

Long live and prosperous Pakistan.

There exist sheer misconception, and correction is needed in minds of people who tooks media reports as evidence and then start debating and writing articles – Print media is very strong way of communicating ideas and news – but it also require certain responsibility and accountability – which is lacking in various articles posted here. Some very intelligent guys said that half truth is much worse than lies and result in results which no one could even imagine.

Following points, although pointed out previously, presented here again to refresh your memory:
1) Dawood Ibrahim is an indian and not Pakistani
2) Russia being an oldest ally of india, and envy to Pakistan, will only say the words which are spoon feeded to it.
3) FBI has urged india to bring out the (true) evidences of Pakistani involvement in mumbai attack, and to idnetify balck sheeps among them.
4) Lone surviving terrorist is Hindu, why his wrist band removed from photos which are being showed on various indian media.
5) China said it is as friendly to Pakistan as it was in previous years and ask india to prove its contentions
6) Check out the statistics of 1999 Kargil incident, who went to US and which side had more fatal casualties. Same was the history in 1965. Who supported the separation of Pakistan in 1971. india always have ill-intentions towards Pakistan
7) No corroborative evidence so far has been provided either to Pakistan or anyone in the world to prove involvement of any Pakistani or any muslim in mumbai attack – which were self imposed by india.
Another name of india is “Hindustan” which means “land for hindus only”, just think what it would be for other religions. Brutality in Kashmir by indian is on news since 1948.

These are things which i can count on my fingures, there are lot many stories…………

Posted by Peace | Report as abusive
 

It is a war between two ideological positions. And India is winning. Thats why so much desperation from Pakistan side. If a dalit like Mayawati – downtrodden for centuries – can rise and become chief minister of a state and indeed hope to become prime minister of India, what was the need for seperate muslim homeland? The ruling class of Pakistan is faced with this question for which there is no answer. So it is easier to create bogey of India, hell-bent on destroying Islamic Pakistan, thus keeping raison-d-etre alive. This Mumbai attack and subsequent denials is part of that plan.
Current attack is definitely handiwork of establishment (undermining the elected government). Elected PM had agreed to send ISI head for investigation. He was made to eat his own words, because establishment does not want peace with India. Peace with India negates the need for Pakistan.
We in India have no such compunction. A Pakistan ruled by its people\’s will rather than feudal lord is welcome. It is time for people of Pakistan to rise and demand \’BSP\’ – Bijalee, Sadak, Paani and not war with India. How come elected representative not be able to order his army chief? Its time Pakistani people make their army chief realise that he serves people not rule them.
If Pakistani people need any help, entire world is with them.

Posted by Nvp | Report as abusive
 

Certain elements in this forum are vociferousy putting forward that Pakistan is not involved in the mumbai terror attack. Another argument is that India has failed to provide evidence. I would like to say both are wrong. There is ample evidence but Pakistan doesnt have the will and machinery to act. Because Pakistan’s law machinery is in shambles and held hostage by its army and fundamentalist forces. The telephone calls made by the terrorist Ajmal Kasab were to a number in Karachi, is the evidence. His confession of being a pakistani national is the evidence, which pakistan and its media is denying.His parents have disappeared over night from thier village. Kasab is asking for help again and again from Pakistan high commision.The terrorist called up a media channel in India, their accent was distinctly of NWFP, Pakistan origin.Pakistan has for years supported insurgency in kashmir and Afganistan.What more evidence would anyone need? Pakistans leadership is a spineless leadership and it went back on its word several times during the whole episode. It never sent ISI chief to India after it promised to do so.Several times the statements have been made and changed. Dawood ibrahim is an India agreed but he is also a criminal in India, and India has demanded sevral times that he should be handed over , why hasnt pakistan govt done that??
Few days ago there was a blast in lahore and the Pakistan govt shamelessly tried to paint it on India, and it was later known to be an act of a Islamic fundamentalist group in pakistan.
Some elements here spoke about greatness of Pakistan, what greatness
How many technological institutes or management institutes or higher educational inst are there in Pakistan which are famous in world??
Where is the economy in pakistan headed. It had to ask a loan from IMF to avoid bankruptsy of its economy,
I dont understand what idiotic info. are people in Pakistan living on.
Some elements claim to have won wars against India!! which war ? each time Pakistan tried the misadventure of a direct attack it had to face defeat so it took to cowardly ways of suporting terrorism
Today pakistan closest ally US accepts that mumbai attacks were carried out from Pak’s soil
which evidence are you talking about??
Lets talk some sence here and take people who are ill-informed can take their uneducated self to some other forum.
No point in pointing fingers the time has come when Pakistan takes some action to reign in the fundamentalist forces at work otherwise the day is not far when it will look like war ravaged Afganistan , with only orphaned kids handicapped men and raped women surving.
Its time you guys start giving good education to your kids and give them a positive and a productive view point rather than the religious ‘jihad’ poison that you are feeding to young minds
The choice is urs either wake up or in some time you wouldnt be there on world’s map .

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

to add further to statistics :
Pakistan’s literacy rate : 50% incomparison 65%-70% in India, though India is much larger in size.
How many pakistani companies can claim to be in Fortune 500 or in even Top 1000 companies??
People living below poverty line : in pakistan the percentage is 35% incomparison in India its 25% even though india has a much larger population.
How many pakistani nationals have won nobel or any other academic, literary prize the answer is none!!
Which greatness are pakistani nationals talking about here???
I dont understand!! and these are full truths, verifiable by international agencies.
All you have is some outdated weaponery and lot of hungry fanatics ready to kill innocent unarmed people of civilised society !!
and what you call jihad is nothing else but some rich powers are using pakistani nationals as cheap fodder to fuel their interests and you hungry morons have no options..but to give in.. because there is no future for you anyways ..

which greatness are you talking about ??

The truth is pakistan’s whole existence has been centered around hatred for India and thats why you are a nation of negative people.
Grow up !!

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

@Parshuram
It seems You’re pessimistic and sadistic person. it seems like your root is from somewhere else tribal. would you compare your parents with road side naked beggars?

 
 
 

@Peace,

What you call Kashmiri violence, most countries would call maintaining Territorial Integrity against separatists and terrorists.

Don’t you remember, the Bengali separatists, what you Pakistan did to them, you systematically genocided 2.5million hindus and even kille 500,000 of your own muslim people to avoid them being separate from Pakistan. By that standard, if India is doing so called ‘brutality’ against the Kashmiri’s, what standard are you having against your own country? That makes Pakistan a purely evil state, doesn’t it?

Please don’t be so one-sided in your analysis, it shows your insincerity in dealing with the issue.

My family was originally from Lahore. They were told to leave, otherwise they would be killed. I talked with my grandfather (may god be with him) and he said the muslims mercilessly killed on a 10:1 ratio basis, the non-stop beheadings are still etched in his mind.

Wholesale liquidation slaughter bloodbath genocide, was always served fresh by the Pakistani army, where ever it went.

Posted by Peace..is gained by giving up violence | Report as abusive
 

@Umair, Peace, Ali,

Is official, Zardari admits at UN today, Pakistan has a great cancer in it..terrorism…..

Either you are with Zardari, or with the terrorists.

Pls take a position.

Posted by Sanjay | Report as abusive
 

OK! indirectly but atleast some sensible guy from india accepted that they are brutally killing Muslims in Kashmir which is suppose to be Pakistan area.

Posted by Peace | Report as abusive
 

lol@Sanjay,
All the three went to meet Kayani for taking position.

Posted by Indian | Report as abusive
 

please go through this link .

USA PREDCITED OF FUTURE PAKISTAN .2025

http://newsonterror.com/future.html

OH MY GOD , PAKISTAN will be out of map.
as per this link from US intellingence

Posted by cj | Report as abusive
 

The trouble of Asia is India because they are blackmailer, they are killing innocents in Kashmir, they are killing peoples from more than 20 freedom fighter movements inside India, they are feeling mini super power in the world but they are not able to control poverty on there own country, they kill minorities & killing christens, Muslims and others on the name of Hinduism by RSS,BJP and many more fundamentalist Hindu organizations.

Indian govt and Indian peoples are under Pakistanfobia and whatever happens in India they always blame Pakistan and try to embers Indian Muslims.

Indian govt is not trustable for china

Indian are threading Bangladesh and occupying one island of Bangladesh

Indian are feeding Tamil tigers move in srilanka and they are the founder of tamil

Indians are doing economic blackmailing with Nepal

Who is safe in Asia from Indian terrorism and blackmailing?

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

After reading through the threads I have realized that people from Pakistan are either ill-literate or they dont understand the language of logic. The whole world is bearing down on them, their own president accepts his folly and still morons out here are arguing with Indians.
Sahi kaha kisi ne “laat ke bhoot, baat se nahi maante” guess that the treatment they deserve.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

I think its time to answer a few points, which our friends from pakistan have raised all over this blog, once and for all.

1. ISI is under the scanner for its alleged involvement in many violence in Kashmir and other parts of India. After the Kabul Indian embassy attacks, YOUR ally’s(i mean Pakistan’s) agency CIA pointed to ISI involvement.
ISI reports to your Army and your elected PM has no say whatsoever in its functioning(The drama your politicians created over sending ISI chief to India highlights that). While RAW is Indian intelligence agency, which reports to the NSA who reports to the Home Minster of India. And HM is elected by the people.

2. You people say this same nonsense again and again. Look Mr. Hemant Karkare was a brave officer. He was admired by almost every one in this department for his honesty and sincerity. Instead of praising his valor, you people are talking rubbish.He was one of the first to be gunned down, because he was there within minutes to save his city. When he heard the news that the COWARD terrorists ,unable to withstand our police firing ran like chickens into a hospital ,where helpless people where being treated, he, without thinking twice prepared to fight these cowards. These COWARDS instead of fighting him face to face attacked him while he was still in his vehicle. Even after being shot Mr. Karkare fired back at them, hurting one terrorist. So PLEASE in your effort to hide the truth about your country’s involvement in this, don’t hide the sacrifice done by the martyrs like Mr. Karkare,Mr. Kamte or Mr. Salaskar.

3. And for heaven’s sake don’t fool the public. The world knows that Pakistani forces were decimated in the three wars. If India had lost, then why did your general surrender his army to India? Why was Bangladesh formed? Why is Kargil still a part of India? Ponder over it!

4. Kashmir issue has no sense here. Mumbai attack is something different. Please don’t bring Kashmir into this. And by the way, Kashmir is a part of India. No one can claim it!

5. India will not act like the immature Pakistani government. We will issue statements which we mean.Not like your government people who are so confused and keep changing their comments each day. Kasab is still under investigation, and the probe has not finished. How do you expect the Govt of India to give you half baked evidence? All we know now is that these people came from Pak, their commanders are in pak etc, and we have shared it. Full report of the investigation will be given only after the probe is complete. And am sure it will be shared with Pakistan. But I wonder if they will take any action.

6. India does NOT aid the LTTE. They were responsible for the assassination of our ex PM. And he is the husband of “India’s most powerful woman”.How do you expect us to support them? What do we gain?
Some political parties in the south are against the SL army. And that is ONLY because they are torturing Tamil civilians who live in LTTE controlled SL.

7. And I don’t understand why my Pakistani friends are not talking about their fellow citizen Kasab anywhere here!?

Now my answer to a non-Pakistani who seems to support the “underdog”:

There is a clear distinction in in our minds between the people of pakistan, the civil government of pakistan and the culprits(ISI, terrorists etc).
India supports democracy and stability of Pakistan. India does not want to take decisions which affect the people of Pakistan. Eg: Delhi-Lahore bus is still operational,Trade routes are still operational.

Electronic media has been a mess(at least in India). I agree with you on that. It really needs some maturity. But don’t forget Indian electronic media is still young and will learn its lessons.

If India was not partitioned, these terrorist groups wouldn’t have formed! US used Pakistan to form these groups to fight against USSR. Now that it is over Pakistan has happily diverted them towards India.

What happened after 9/11? Now, replace USA with India and Afganisthan with Pakisthan. India demands the Pakisthan government to give back the terror mastermind same way US demanded Bin Laden. Pakistan refuses, the same way Taliban did. But India didn’t declare war against Pakistan the way America did. I hope at least now you understand our motives. We are a peace loving nation. We follow MK Gandhi’s views.
Finally, Kashmir is a part of Republic of India. Pakistan cannot get even an inch of its land.

Posted by yogesh | Report as abusive
 

I would like to bring to the notice of the moderators about some people indulging in abusive language. Sir/Madam, these comments have been written in hindi I am not sure if you understand hindi. Please remove these comments. It doesn’t look good to have these illiterates writing abuses all over your renowned site.

Mr. Peace,

You are the prime example of what pakistan thinks about peace.You call yourself peace and do all sorts of nonsense. please go do this in your back yard and not in the internet.Stop posting nonsense about india, you seem to have the knowledge of a 2 yr old(as someone rightly pointed out!), and have no common sense whatsoever.
Remember one simple rule, before posting something on the internet, read a good newspaper, or some reliable source.

Posted by yogesh | Report as abusive
 

Sanjeev
(my apology for late reply)
In response to your question, i believe yes it is correct it is difficult for India to step back now. For Pakistan also, bowing to Indian pressure is no option, both country’s leaderships need to sit down and do introspection. Indian government was very slow to respond to the realities. Pakistani civil society and judges movement made Musharraf Resign. The free and fair elections brought in a democratic government. President Zardari had said Kashmiris fighting in Kashmir are terrorists, that India is not a threat to Pakistan. These remarks were historic. But India did never respond positively. After that Mumbai was a disaster in the making as the peace process was a bridge to nowhere.
At this stage let the two Prime Ministers of both countries sit in two rounds of talks, One In Islamabad and next in New Delhi. Let the countries sign an extradition treaty and hand over fugitives like Dawood Ibrahim, both nations need to work together and cooperate with Interpol and UN. Mediation should be welcomed by countries like, USA, Saudi Arabia which have friendly ties with India and Pakistan both. Only this is the way to move forward. We need leadership and statesmen on both sides.
Thanks

Posted by Umair Malik | Report as abusive
 

Dear Umair
You are the first voice or reason I have heard from the other side of the border and I really appreciate your view point. Terrorists dont have a religion neither any affliation and history has proved it ample times. A disruptive element would disrupt civilised societies one after the other. We saw the way afgansitan went and ceratinly we cant allow democracy, independence and freedom to held hostage by fundamentalism and terrorism. Its the future our nations and children which is at stake. Its about what form of society are we breeding and then handing over to them. Whether we support a society which welcomes the rule of law, reason , a society which is progressive and respects it members and gives them the right to make choices in their life or we end up supporting a society which believes in pre-historic traditions and is against progress, is despotic and fundamentalist the choice is ours but is certainly going to make the life of our kids better or worse. I would urge everyone to believe in democracy and mutual understanding because thats the way we can defeat mindless terrorism and ensure the road of prosperity for both India and Pakistan.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Pritviraj & Indian Bloggers,

This is a small request as a fellow Indian.Don’t try to engage people from country where we can never ever be friends with.While it is essential to co-exist, beyond that strategic interest there is nothing else we should seek rather we should discontinue any kind of interactions with them.A time will come when the victory of truth versus lies will be decided.

As a nation we got to understand there is a government which has mandate from the indian people to take decisions for us.I think that government whether we like it or not has to be strengthened & we need to firmly beleive they would have toiled hard more than any of us can imagine in putting India’s interest ahead.

Our focus should be in pushing the government for right resource allocation for education, social development & integrating various societies. We need to push & ask in the coming elections why a nation of billion people has not made transformational research in science & technology which guarantees international security & also creates new trillion dollar industry. How is it that our energy security is not being plugged.

India had given to the world major scientific discovery like the mathamatical systems, astronomy, medicine so what has gone wrong that we have not been able to become the first in the world in the past 60 years in any major scientific,energy or defence research.Why have we so far not created a export related defense industry or an aircraft industry or a shipping industry.

Corruption is not something common to government alone, there are Private sector companies in india where also it is prevalent,but the beauty is whereever talented people & men with high integrity have joined they have virtually isolated these people.We are in a promising phase as a nation & we will take headon the challenges.

Posted by Vijay | Report as abusive
 

Mr. Miglani,

Wrote some comments but never passed through your filter which makes me doubt your intentions. I tried to write because of my faith in REUTERS, nothing else. With a little ability to read between lines, I had thought it was to worth share what I have been lately seeing as a political manipulation of facts by nations. Anyway, Good Bye to your blogs!

Posted by Appu | Report as abusive
 

I am happy that my effort to clear Pakistan position is being noticed and I am happy that my effort to show the truth to world is effective.
I am more than happy to have comments from indians through which they are showing that they turn faces when truth is presented to them.
My country is smaller in size as compare to thiers but we all have the language of truth which the people of thier country doesn’t have.
I proved that success lies in truth – that’s why they have start attacking the personal image and shifted from commenting on article.

Posted by Peace | Report as abusive
 

This guy ‘peace’ really looks retarted to me and speaks very much the way , those moron terrorists were speaking to our news channels… I mean he is playing the same old record no matter what evidence is presented or what logic is given .. looks like the guy never grew up its for ppl like him i wrote some time back “laat ke bhoot baat se nahi maante”

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Dear Indians,

When you say “laaton kay bhoot baton say nahen mantay” it means you feel that you are able to use your laat but ur govt proved us on Indian TV channels that” bhonknay walay katetay nahen”

I know your Indian govt is exposed in front of International community & your total media campaign against Pakistan is not successful.

I like all Indian news channels because of there funny videos about Mumbai attack and I feel like watching cartoon movies. you showed the world that Indian media is capable to convert serious incidents into cartoon movies.

Please tell your govt to provide evidence to Indian news channels and they will distribute everyone in the world because from the day 1 Indian TV channels are showing us Indian movie clips as proof.

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

@ Peace, Umair, Nasir, Amjad,

We don’t want Pakistan destroyed, we don’t want war with you, we want friendship, above all. We don’t want to tear your country apart.

All we ask you to do is admit is that you have an Islamicist Virus in your country and be willing to move mountains to eradicate radical Islam and hate against India from Pakistan and Pakistani hearts. Can you please do this by not antagonizing us. Please quit preaching hate against Hindus to your children, please stop training suicide bombers, please stop wasting so much money against Military escalations against India.

Please protest against your Madrassas and tell them “We Reject, your policy of Hate and Jihad”…..is there one of you in Pakistan, does even one of you have the heart and the guts to reject Hate and Jihad against any human being on earth with your heart???? Look inside your heart. Is it possible for you not to go one day, without hate against another Non-Muslim???? Is it possible to go one day to Mosque and not have the Imam spew hate against Hindus or non-muslims? Will you please have an anti-hate awakening???

I don’t think the great prophet wanted hate to be perpetuated for all of infinity??? I guarantee you, if you stop hating, even as individuals, your life will slowly begin to approve.

Hate is like a very large weight and stops your spirit from growing. Can you please quit blaming others for your problems????

Can you go one day without hoping destruction and death to Jews, Hindus, Americans or other Kaffirs? Can you grow beyond the basic guidelines provided by the Koran?? As humans, it is our duty to grow beyond the original words of God, otherwise humanity will never progress.

@You guys, can one of you start today, to stop hating? If you try from your heart, I guarantee, by the will of the Great God almighty and merciful, you will see heaven all around you and god’s love all around you in little, subtle ways. You will see that hate consumes those around you, like a large weight and never leaves you think beyond the hate.

Can you please try to set the hate aside for one day, with your heart and really try?

If you choose not to set aside hate, you will be playing a dirty trick on yourself and be tricked into believing that its someone else’s fault.

The IBLIS and his tireless JINN do not want you realize the Grand Secret of this all…That peace and love is in the control of your heart, if you choose it. If you choose the path of peace and love, unconditionally against all humans, which are God’s creations, you have taken the first step to something truly great, something even the Great Prophet, could not contemplate in his grand wisdom at that time, in the situation he was in.

Inshallah – Jai Raba

Posted by Use your heart | Report as abusive
 

Look here, my friends from India, Pakistan and all over. We can keep going on and on and on and on till we’re all blue in the face OR we can come to the root of this dissent and solve the underlying problem once and for all.

In fact, at the risk of sounding like a broken record, and please pardon my borrowing a line from the 1st Clinton run, but it is indeed:

THE KASHMIR PROBLEM STUPID!

The sooner India, the world’s biggest democracy, shakes off it’s positive allergy to SERIOUSLY discussing this important issue fully and finally (remember the Kashmiri plebisite?) the sooner the that WHOLE region and by extension, the West can feel safer. Our courageous Musharraf and his multi one-way unanswered gestures (how unfortunate) may have left the scene, but PLEASE understand this:

Cosmetic and mere lip service CBM’s, stubbornly refusing to include a chorus of near impatient 3rd party mediators (US PRES. OBAMA being the latest) with the real hope that the issue will somehow be swept under the rug by the passage of time are a waste of both time and money. Ain’t going to happen.

HEEEELLLLLOOOOO????

Indian friends, is your government listening? We REALLY do need to stop putting the cart before the horse!

Posted by N. Javed | Report as abusive
 

@N. Javed

Well spoken, if India gives up Kashmir, Pakistan should be willing to give up Balochistan, NWFP, Swat, Sindh, Punjab, or another other ethnic region. Once you have chosen which part of Pakistan you would be willing to give up for the sake of self-rule and autonomy, I promise, I will tell India to let go of Kashmir.

So, please just keep it shut.

Posted by Equalizer | Report as abusive
 

Dear Amjad and other people of pakistan first things firts
1) Stop harping about the proof of mumbai attacks again and again. The proofs have been provided to your government by not only Indian agenicies but by American and British agencies as well. Go through some news to open you eyes.
2) We recently conducted free and fair elections in kashmir where the sepratist forces didnt get peoples support.People in valley have realized that it is their goodwill to be with free, democratic and liberal India.
3) If it was only about Kashmir then why bomb blasts in UK, USA Spain? and why is that Afganistan is ravaged? and let me tell you the face of terrorism and its identity is same behind each incident.
4)Another issue raised is “bhonknay walay katetay nahen” well the Indian govt is a responsible govt and it doesnt want unnecc loss of civilian life if the issue can be solved diplomatically but it seems Pakistan is not complying and trust me by doing so it inviting an attack .Let me tell everytime you can’t run and hide behind America sooner or later your ‘daddy’ will stop protecting you. so Grow up.
5) Last but not the least ” Kooyen se bahar nikalo, kooyen ke medhak” learn, get educated and improve your way of life go to schools and not some prehistoric stuck up madarsa. Its only the you will realize that acts of terror are not cartoon movies, you a##hole.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

N. Javed
‘(remember the Kashmiri plebisite?)’
—No Prob, prepare Pakistan,your country to also declare it in the POK & Northern Areas…

Posted by Anup | Report as abusive
 

Dear N.Javed
When u say problem is Kashmir you should also ponder on why the problem is there. The problem has been not Kashmir but your govt and it sagencies who for vested interests wanted to occupy kashmir. And whats the logic because it is muslim dominated then by that logic very soon you will be talking about occupying Saudi Arabia as well.
so to clear your doupts :
1) Kashmir is not one geographical or etnical area, it comprises Hindu dominated Jammu and Buddhist Ladhak as well.
2) To answer your query on Plebicite ,Over the years terrorists sponspered by pakitan have serially and brutally murdered people in Kashmir and specially Hindus and Sikhs. Part of Kashmir is occupied by Pakistan and China, how can then be there be a free and fair plebicite??The dynamics of the regional population has been changed through brutal mass murders and exodus of other ethnicities!!!
3) Why should there be a plebisite? the King of kashmir and its council which represented the population, themselves conceded to join Indian Union.
4) The politics of the region created a Faux-pas that led to a situation where pakistan started fuelling seperatist sentiments to serve its vested interests.
5) Last and most important thing your president hiself has admitted before the world media that Pakistan has problems, it has a cancer in its society which is not only harming the world but pakistan as well
6)Now is the time for you friends to wake recognize and deal with situation at your home.Your nation has become a breeding ground for facists and terrorists, dont let that happen it will prove to be an “aasteen ka saamp” for u. wake up friend before its too late.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Prithviraj,

This is what I was expecting from Indian peoples and I know you peoples are not able to face realities.
1. If you have any proof give it clearly & don’t confuse things, give evidence to you media so show us and give it clearly. Our govt says there is no evidence provided by Indian, INTERPOL says no evidence, FBI says no evidence.
If the evidence is only to believe what your govt says then its not possible because your past is not good with Pakistan.

Now coming back to the Kashmir point, sooner or later you will realize that it’s not possible to keep peoples without their will, the problem for you modern peoples is you are living on settled stats of India like Mumbai, Delhi and other states and you can’t see how your military is dealing with Kashmir’s, enjoy your TV channels watching free and fair elections but reality is different.

Now coming to your loose talk at the end I will say that this is not your fault, first you are fundamentalist Hindu who hates Muslims and fearing from Muslim population in India increased +50% of total population.

Last but not the least “Tu halal ka bacha ho nahen sakta aur Hindu kabhi sacha ho nahen sakta”

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

Amjad
The last line you said explained everything about your mentality. I dont think people in pakistan would understand, elected government, democracy and accountability because you never had all these things to start with. Pakistan is on the brinks of being a failed state. Your government is going back and forth on statements. Do you guys have anything as independent educated media in your state?? I dont think so. Try watching CNN, BBC etc. and I guess you missed the topic of this blog on reuter. The Blog is “Pakistan Now or Never” the question is simple when will guys start cleaning the crap you have created. Dont Argue with us on Kashmir , look what have you and your army has dome in bangladesh and what is your state doing in NWFP. And let me tell you something more muslims in India are Indians you heard that they are Indians as Indian as i am and they are not one of you, so dont count on them.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

It seems that there’s alot of mudslinging going on between the two sides on this forum, even though the governments are getting cooler.

Can both sides cool down and stop resorting to name calling.

Prithviraj, just one really minor and irrelevant point…we do have a Nobel Prize winner in Abdus-Salam, however he isn’t nationally trumpeted now because of his Qadiyani faith, which is sad. And please cool down with the anti-Pakistani sentiment, likewise for all other Indian friends.

Peace, you are seriously seriously troublesome and self-deluded. The continuous paranoia of unfounded Indian conspiracies (I won’t deny there haven’t been some, just not every day!) shows immaturity. These beliefs is what caused the ISI to wreck havoc in the region of which now we are suffering a militant blow-back. You’re propagating more harm than reason, if at all. I wish I could talk to you face to face to explain why your beliefs are superstitious. For the meanwhile please practice some introspection and avoid posting.

N.Javed…any chance of being Nusrat Javed the journalist? Anyways our country is mired in a militant backlash. I have yet to hear them ask the Pak government anything in regards to Kashmir. No, the problem between India and Pak is Kashmir, which will only get rid of part of regional instability, but the problem with Pakistan is a surge of Wahabi/Deobandi/Salafi extremism (which is a global problem) with different agendas (Kashmir,Afghanistan,Sharia Law,etc) and a lack of high critical standards from already established educational institutions. Add the list of poverty, security, corruption, etc. How much do you want to bet there’ll be attack on a Shia Muslim procession or Imambargah during this month of Muharram? I doubt that’ll be a statement for Kashmir.

Amjad, again cool down with the anti-Indian sentiment and don’t stereotype. Indian media was horrid, but its sickening to compare disturbing images to a cartoon which shows a lack of class and inhumane.

I’m generally harsher on my own compatriots though many posts from the Indian posters have stung. I like to demand higher quality of posts than what I’ve been reading. Its important for Pakistani posters to self reflect. Lets admit there’s a problem. Stop being concerned with India doing this or that. I disagree with many things happening there but why bother crying foul and bring up the past just to get a one up? This advice is also useful for the Indian posters.

I’ve opened myself up to criticism and a backlash. I hope most realize I’m just trying to cool down this forum.

Posted by Saf | Report as abusive
 

Saf
I admire your efforts and voice of reason is what is needed at this hour from both sides.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Dear Saif,Pirthivi

I appreciate your efforts to cool down the situation but getting sentiments by media and doing negative internet campaigns against Pakistan by Indians is the reason we are here to defend ourselves.

on every post from Indian peoples they blame ISI, jihad, my country, my govt and when I told them the problem on their side he said don’t talk about Kashmir, WHY NOT they are killing peoples because they need freedom and everyone knows so there is no point to hideout.

Indian govt along with Indian peoples are damaging our image with their fake reports, propagandas, having 10 steps theory on Indian channels that how they will control Pakistan and u need us to stop from what.

I fully support peace between both countries but not in the terms of our respect, within 1 hour Indian media said the attackers are from Pakistan & Indian govt also supported.

My Indian friend is calling CNN and BBC independent channels and I think everyone knows how much independent they are, if u call them independent channles then u doesn’t know anything.

We are proud that Pakistani channels are better than your Indian channels showing all the time war hysteria and having Indian movie clips as proofs.

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

Amjad,

I totally understand the frustration, bhai. Certain posters like Om and Raj’s comments have stung me hard too. You have a right to defend yourself. Likun (But) not with Aggression.

Calling tragedy a cartoon is low brow and poor or a very ‘Mela’ thing to say. We should defend ourselves absolutely. But not like that. You must use rationality in your posts when making serious arguments. Its a sign of education, discipline, maturity and prestige. Hey, I’m not perfect, but I try my best to stay above the fray. Why purposely hurt people’s sentiments?

Then there was your comment calling all Hindus liars. It may fly in Pakistan, but in truth it is a racist comment. As well as a sign of weak stance on your topic attacking a people’s integrity (there are times to attack a person’s integrity but that’s a debate lesson in itself) and hence lose credibility. It gets hot, yes, but don’t punch below the belt. Always keep your standards high. Remember Faith, Unity, Discipline.

Many moderate Indians have criticized the unprofessional sensationalist reporting that went on too. And yes, there’ll be some Indian dudes saying, it was perfect. You can’t change that.

I absolutely know how bad the Indian media was. I was watching Star News or something when it broke. My God, there was a man screaming and telling us what he was seeing. I thought he was the Reporter on the ground and got shot and going hysterical…only to find out it was the anchorman in the studio screaming! It was horrid and pathetic. He absolutely took advantage of our fears and sensationalized it. How bad for the cameraman’s family and others.

But if they were knee jerk, so were we. I mentioned before, a so called senior ‘professional’ journalist on AAJ TV, kept on blaming RAW, at the same time kept complaining of ‘no proof’ of India’s claims. If you didn’t have proof of anything then how can you place blame on some other agency, then? That’s not reporting that’s conspiracy mongering (which the Indian media was also accused of earlier).

What do you think an Indian is going to feel watching that? It cuts both ways. Both of our media’s must improve. But I’m proud of our media too. It has come a long way baby! Remember the days of PTV and NTM…OMG!

Let’s not kid ourselves, Amjad. Lets take some responsibility. You and I both know the shadiness and how the ISI operated. The whole world is accusing us. And do you really want to deny it even after all that’s happened? We also know from many sources of rogue ex-army and ex-ISI agents, as well as some who may still be employed. We have a militant problem and we shouldn’t be afraid in discussing it.

Yes, Kashmir is something many Indian posters don’t want to touch. You and I know there’s more at stake. But why get frustrated? The issue and problem is 60 years old. You can go ahead and criticize the Indians and they can go ahead criticize us. Mud slinging didn’t help then, mud slinging isn’t going to help us now. Do not get too upset when someone is not willing to talk. Sometimes people come around sometimes people don’t and deny. In fact I feel the same way when I talk to my Pakistani friends about some controversy about Pakistan, they shriek and don’t want to talk about it either. Should I swear at them? No. But if someone isn’t talking about the Kashmir issue, don’t stop trying, there is always someone willing to talk, just be respectful. As you can see Pirthvi was hot and could have just blasted me. He cooled down instead. (thanks Pirthvi)

What would constitute an independent channel Amjad? How about independent newspapers? There are stories in newspapers too of possible involvement. Our DAWN newspaper is reporting a recorded tape of one of the suspected militants phone calls being handed to Pakistan by the US as evidence. Its unclear whether it was a US recording or an Indian recording which was passed through them. Most have agreed it is legible and our authorities are getting ‘convinced’.

Our image is damaged because it reflects ground realities. Nothing an Indian can say is going to change it. And if our image is damaged why be envious of India’s growth? I’m upset they bypassed us, but I’m not the type who likes to see a neighbors house burn down because mine was smaller. Let’s just build a better or bigger house or move into one. Let’s work for it. I thought India’s politicians tone was disrespectful and mean. But why hold a grudge? They just got screwed. We’ve been screwed too. Let’s find the source. Sadly its pointing our direction. Lets get these rascals and make sure they don’t mess with us or our image again. Of course I’m totally against any Indian Strike. It’ll halt only if we’re serious with our own problems, which if you notice is happening.

I’m sorry if I was harsh, Amjad. Shayd Meray Ghalti Tha (Perhaps it was my mistake) that I’m mentioning this publicly on blog posts. I’m not exactly sure how I can Private Message someone. I’m critical of my countrymen because I care and demand the best. Practice Discipline in your Posts and keep Standards High. When you are arguing minimize your emotions and fight with rationality and maturity. You will notice your credibility amongst (most) posters will Sky Rocket and chats will be smoother and cooler. Hope this helps. Thanks. Sorry for the long post…again!

Posted by Saf | Report as abusive
 

Dear Saf, ( SAY PAKISTAN ZINDAABAD)

My friend I am not aggressive and I assure you that we are not an aggressive nation because our religion is religion of peace and we totally believe on it.

You said calling cartoon is a low and mela thing but my friend while watching their proofs of Indian clips with very funny audio it feels like a cartoon movie and this is what I feel and may be you disagree with me because this is your right to agree or disagree.

You said I called all Hindus liars but my friend this is a quote from someone maybe was hurt by some Hindu but this doesn’t reflects on Pakistan and we have also Hindus in our country and they are very nice peoples. Every Pakistani believes on faith, unity and discipline but we also know that there is one thing called respect and this is what we are expecting from our neighbors.

You said there are many Indians criticized Indian reporting but I never seen anyone in my entire life criticizing there wrong things but they always try to prove that they are right especially for my country. I am proud that being a Pakistani you are still defending Indians and this show how peaceful and understandable we are.

Yes Indian media played a very bad roll on the entire situation but there is no one from India saying this on this blog. I can understand camera man’s family suffering but it doesn’t allow Indian channels and Indian peoples to blame on Pakistan.

About blaming on Indian RAW you are saying only AAJ TV but in India there is every single channels blaming on ISI and Pakistan and this proves how they feel about us. Yes we have proofs about RAW involvement in Balochistan and soon our govt is going to UN.

Yes I am proud of our media and we are able to fight against any media wars.

My friend we are not a kid and we also know how other agencies are working but please make a list of accuser on ISI and realize who they are, just write the names of countries who are accusing ISI and see the result by yourselves.

We always welcome anyone who talks based on reality but when our opponent fails he always try to run from the topic. We are ready to talk on every single issue between us but when our opponent accuses then we have no choice but to reply him.

I am sorry my friend but there is no tape from DAWN newspaper and if the recording is done by Indian agencies then this proves its fake because there past proves us how they play with evidences,
On Samjhota express they said its from Pakistan but Hamant karkary found it was someone serving military kernel of Indian army along with RSS killing more than 100 innocent Pakistanis and now karkary is under the grave because he was a honest man.

When Indian parliament was attacked they said Afzal Guru belongs to Pakistan they sent their troops on our borders for 2 year but nothing happened and at the end they found no link with Pakistan. You need us to believe the evidence from Indian but there past is not clear.

I will not agree with you that our Image is damaged because our friend countries are with us and yes when our friends will not support us that day I will say the same thing but we believe on our friends more than our enemies. We are not against Indian growth but growth doesn’t allow anyone to become “GABBAR SINGH”.

You said you are against any Indian strike but there military knows that strikes against Pakistan is not possible because we are capable to re-strike and then this will be deadly for both sides.

No my friend this is not your mistake because I totally understand who you are and the way you wrote on your post I totally understood about you. You know we Pakistanis are capable to understand peoples by their words and your words are not like us.

I am sorry to say that changing a name to SAF will not help you Indians to do negative propagandas against Pakistan.

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

Hi Saf
I really like your line of thought and argument.I guess if we have more people thinking like you in Pakistan, we will be able to deal with the whatever issues exist between us sooner than later. though I hate to say this but your fellow countryman Amjad is a seriously ‘self deluded cartoon’ he proved this by his last post again. I will again request him to grow up and come up with mature posts.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Dear Pirthivi,
Do you think that after hearing from your govt, your channels and from you peoples in the internet against my country anyone can believe on you?

If one attack from someone is effecting on our so called friendship then it’s better to be enemy forever because friendship with India is not healthy for us and we Pakistani doesn’t trust you anymore.

We have problem with your government but we know that Indian peoples are like us and they want friendship with Pakistan. We need a friendship on the basis of respect for each other.

When we have joint mechanism between Indian and Pakistan to fight against terrorism then why your government went to UN and asking others for help. Indian and Pakistan are neighbors and we will live on this region forever and no one has choice to change neighbors so why you didn’t took this incident as test case to strength our friendship other then damaging.

Today the evidence provide by you to FBI which was the ID card of the attacker found a duplicate and they said there is no record + card itself is duplicate and not issued by NADRA Pakistan.

Now the peace process is already damaged and no trust between both nations and it needs more 8 to 10 years to come on the same position when it was before the attack. No tell me who is wrong now Pakistan or India.

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

Dear Amjad
This time i felt you spoke from your heart and so will I. As you rightly said that no one wants tension building up in sub continent as both the neighbours are nuclear armed. Its few politicians who will decide but the fate would be decided for lot of innocent civilians. When it comes to what is being served by media in our living rooms then i take that with a pinch of salt. I agree with u when you say some channels totally dramatise it but my friend the issue is there are channels in india like Times Now or CNBC which are first of all independent in their views and secondly give the news as it is and they dont dramatise it. So you should realize that, as I do, that some channels might be feeding you on half baked truths in your country and speaking the language of your agencies.
Well now coming back to what is being said. I will tell you why no Indian is buying your argument on proofs. Because the news we see here tells that not only Indian govt but so also US and Uk governments have supplied Pakistan govt with proofs. But Pakistan is hesistant to act for the reason it knows better. Here we get to see panel discussions in which not only international strategist from UK and Israel but even your ex army chief was invited and we see him dwindling and not being able to give clear cut answer when he is asked questions.
We get to see that USA has asked Pak to handover LeT chief to India but pakistan is not complying.
We get to see coverages on militant training camps in pakistan.
We see your president making one statement one day and completely opposite statement the other day in front of media and the camera .
Statements about agreeing to send ISI cheif to India then going back on it. Agreeing to arrest LeT chief then going back on it. Dawood is known to be in karachi but pakistan govt denies to hand him over. Russian intelligence confirmed his role in mumbai attacks then also he is not arrested and handed over india.
You talk of one attack there several attacks ,there are people dying every now and then and dont you think that is going to make an average Indian angry? when we know that its pakistani agencies and organisation operating out of pakistan who is supporting them . We know that an average pakistani citizen is not unfriendly or a terrorist.But my friend what you should realize that the political, economical and ethnical position in pakistan is such that it has become a breeding ground for terror. Who doesnt know about Taliban operatives in Pakistan. If they are not there then tell me why does USA fires rockets and missiles inside pakistan’s territory. If the terrorists and taliban is not their then against whom US forces are fighting in Pakistan. If you talk about Kashmir I will ask u a similar question that just because there are insurgents in un-ruly NWFP who wants its independence would you suggest your govt to give independence to NWFP or would want your army to control insurgency so that the pakistan as a nation remains intact.
If you are able to answer all those incomfortable questions then my friend come to me and we will talk. If you talk about trust , tell me how do we trust Pakistan when we know that most terror attacks are sponsored from your soil. and am not saying your government is doing it. But as i said the conditions in pak are such that democratic govt no matter how good intentioned is not in control. U can listen to the twisted stories that your media tells you or try some independent research on internet to get un biased view.choice is yours. Arguing with me, blaming me or trying to prove me wrong wont change ground realities.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Prithviraj,

your latest post is a good initiative. The link below gives a good idea of the media hysteria.

http://www.dawn.net/wps/wcm/connect/Dawn %20Content%20Library/dawn/news/pakistan/ the+medias+role+in+war+and+peace–il

Posted by saf | Report as abusive
 

Dear Pirthivi,

You said maybe some Indian channels dramatize the situation and right after you said our channels are speaking the language of our agencies. This is the reason what I am fighting for that by words you realize your mistake but again finding a point to blame on the Pakistani Agencies.

My friend you said you can’t believe our arguments and proofs from US and UK govt are supplied to Pakistan, but my friend do you feel that anyone can believe on proofs from these countries in Pakistan.

The recent example is IRAQ where they have proofs but after doing all the things they accepted that they were wrong, you said you invited some ex-army chiefs from Pakistan in channels and they were not able to answer your questions but my friend they answered as per there view and if you feels right answer is to support whatever you say then you are wrong, and by the way what is the definition of right Answer?

I watched so many Indian channels and I know what they ask to all Pakistanis either its politician, army man or anyone, one Indian anchor asked one politician from Pakistan that we have evidence but Pakistani govt is not doing things the way Indian want, then he replied that here we are talking about cooperation between both countries and we already offered joint investigation where no one can blame anyone and they will have full right to act as independent investigation. The Indian anchor said but we have the proofs and need that Pakistan should act as per the evidence provide, the Pakistani politician said but we need to know and need to check the source of evidence and the authentication and she replied but we need Pakistan should hand over the list of the peoples provided by India. Now my point is if this is the way to find the cooperation then I am not sure anyone will be happy to cooperate.

The second interview was on last Tuesday on NDTV one lady anchor asked one Pakistani politician that we have evidence but your govt is not acting responsibly and while he was replying the answer she argued with him 7 to 8 time and asking continuously different answer and then politician replied I feel that I am the anchor and you are talking more than me, let me to have my point of view and then she said thanks for your talking. If this is the way to get answers then I don’t think it’s a right way.

There are many interviews I have seen and never found any single interview without this behavior, when your member of parliament said we have some doubts on the Himanat Karkary murder(the ATS chief killed on attack) and he said that we should investigate, everyone in India said he is with Pakistan and he is talking the language of Pakistan, why you have problems with investigations, why your agencies are fearing from his murder investigation, he is the one who captured one serving Indian military officer found guilty in killing more than 50 Pakistanis on Samjhoota express and they burned the entire train because there were Pakistanis.
His killing proves that there are some elements behind his murder and maybe behind the whole attack on Mumbai.

Now coming back that US asked Pakistan to handover LeT chief to India, first of all that the govt has no idea where he is, he is banned in Pakistan from 2001 and they are also looking for him.

Secondly, suppose if we found him there is no agreement between Indian and Pakistan to handover prisoners and it needs to be trail in Pakistan with your provided evidence.
Coming back to the coverage you have seen training camps in Pakistan are in TV videos only and our agencies are not allowing any training camps.

Talking about Dawood Ibrahim in Karachi and our govt is denying, my friend if u know where he is please tell us the full address not just he is in Karachi and capture him. Your govt always come up with clues without proof , give us details other than using these names to blackmail us internationally. If Russian intelligence knows ask them where he is and give us full details not by media.

You said that Pakistan is becoming a ground of terror activities but my friend you know how we are suffering from the terror activities and our army more than 150k is fighting with Taliban’s and extremists. Everyone is safe in the world because of us and specially your country because if we not fight against them the first country to enter for them is India. We are fighting bigger operation then 1971 war between India and Pakistan but at return we have attacks from US, blackmailing from your govt and so many problems but we are not giving up and are fighting for everyone, we have lost more soldiers then any country in the world against this fight.

My friend, if anyone from NWFP asks for independents from Pakistan I swear to God that Pakistan will not keep them and the truth is we will not be able to keep them with us without their will and I am sure you have no idea about the peoples from that area. For your information most of the peoples in our military are from NWFP and now decide how they feel about their own country.

On Kashmir issue your point is irrelevant, because there is UN resolution passed by UN to have referendum in Kashmir to allow them what they want. We don’t want Kashmir but we need you to have free and fair referendum in Kashmir under UN to see what they want, let kashmiris to decide what they want.

For your information your Prime Minister Mr.Nehro went to the UN on Kashmir Issue and UN passed the resolution against India. You should remember how you cheated on Kashmir on 1947 and take over the area so you have no right to say that it’s a part of India.

At the end you said the entire terror source in India is from Pakistan and we have the same feeling and some examples are SARABJIT SINGH who found guilty and said he is from RAW doing bomb attacks on early 80’s, we have proofs about RAW interference in Balochistan and many more.

This is what I want to say, you peoples are only watching Indian media to believe on, I am not arguing with you but I am here to clarify about your wrong propaganda against my country.

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

Amjad
U tried to build a case against pakistant but my friend its a weak case for following reasons
1) U say since pakistan is fighting Taliban, therefore world is a safer place !!! Would u mind answering me who gave birth to Taliban?? I will tell you it was pakistan!! and let me tell you that even today your agencies dont want taliban to lose, because an unstable afganistan is in their strategic interest.
2) Read my post properly i had said ‘your’ media is speaking the language of your agencies and not Indian media. Media in India is free and they take on the Indian establishment also when its needed.
3) Last and most important point ,referundum on Kashmir in UN has certain clauses which are
Plebicite will take place when :-
a) Pakistan withdraws its forces to where they were before 1947
b) Indian troops will remain only to the extent of maintaining law.
and for your information UN sec general himself said that UN referendum on Kashmir is dead for all pratical purposes why, I will tell you
1) Pakistan never withdrew its forces
2) Pakistan supported terror outfits in kashmir
3)China occupied a part of kashmir
4) Pakistan illegally gifted a part of PoK (pakistan occupied Kashmir) to China
5) Due mass murder of Hindus and kashmiri pandits which was done on purpose to change the demographics of the region so that the vote doesnt swing in india’s favour .
6) and most Important, who is Pakistan to promote Kashmir’s independence ?? If u say Pakistan has no interest in kashmir then why at all you are bothered whether they are free or not ?? are you UN??
If you are so supportive of freedom struggles then why doesnt Pakistan support the freedom struggle of Tibet,??? where tibetians are fighting against chienese domination!!no you wont do that …

You are happy if US and UK want to mediate in kashmir issue but you object if they give you proofs of your involvement in mumbai terror attack, dont you think thats double standards ??

Amjad, Pak had a history of unstable govt, political assasinations and military unsurping the power. You should realize that its in your army’s interest to fuel hostility with india, because that way they can ensure and justify there being in power.

I will tell you why was mumbai attacked and all the war hysteria build by your army so that part of the forces from the afgan border can be moved to indian border and therefore USA’s war against Taliban suffers there and Taliban gets a chance to strengthen itself.

Today if you are suffering from terror then am sorry but you are suffering becasue of your own wrong doings and because of the terror outfits that Pak has created. Those outfits are now beyond your control. Its like a cancer which is engulfing your society because you were irresponsible and you created an infection for others, which is now turning against you as well. Because terrorist my friend have no religion, no value for human life, and the whole world is also suffering because of that.

and like I said dont depend on your news channels or our news channels do some independent research.Blaming Indians wont help you, recognizing and correcting your mistake certainly would.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Dear Pirthivi,

I am glad to see different stories everyday from your side and your work hard to prove your points but my friend your points about Kashmir for UN resolution are totally wrong, UN resolution asked Indian to remove their forces from Kashmir and so on…..

I know you peoples are good trained for negative propagandas and this is a habit of every Indian to prove his points if its against Pakistan.

I have found one thing from our whole conversation that you guys are impossible, because your dramatic theories never ends and you always try to change the truth and hijack the situation like you are doing now with Mumbai attacks.

Posted by Amjad | Report as abusive
 

Dear Amjad,
I am sorry to say but you live in a make believe world which is also called “fool’s Paradise” ..so get educated. I have simply stated facts which are very much verifiable.

Posted by Prithviraj | Report as abusive
 

Amjad , which Kashmir are you talking about ? Under what authority are you talking about Kashmir? While talking about Kashmir, dear friend Amjad, we must not forget that Kashmir has so many divisions , whether you are talking about Kashmir under occupation of Pakistan or the part which has been gifted to China ? The recent elections have shown that all those people talking about plebscite in Kashmir should mind their own business. People of Kashmir are capable of solving their own problems. Whether plebiscite or no it will be decided by the people of Kashmir ,they have also shown to the world that they have not given any right to advocate or champion their causes .

Posted by Manish | Report as abusive
 

Dear Sreehari So close to the point. Just few question away from the whole truth. Who will benefit from this war or current situation? Why when india and pakistan are getting closer something happens? Who was the real power behind gandhi family assassinations and why? Mark Twain said and i quot him”If you don,t follow media,you are uninformed and if you follow media you are misinformed.Banking system controls the world and media is their covert hit man. Check jfk,mlk,rfk and a lot of other assassinations in the world, and why they were killed?Go find the truth behind viet nam war,american mexican war, american spanish war and so on. There is no substitute for peace and love, if any one found it, let me know too. GOD BLESS YOU ALL…

Posted by abdali | Report as abusive
 

i really appreciate the comments by saif.i think ,amjad is still taking mumbai strikes as a india – pakistan issue. i agree there are extremists are present in india but they are present in any other country too.
we indians would like to have a stable neighbour and not a neighbour under military control. for this we need to have friends like saif. pakistan should realise that they have turned to a “terrorist state” with larger areas not under government control. pakistan is now too a victim of terror and india and world have a right to defend themselves.
moreover a country which has the blessing of ram ,allah ,jesus ,gurunanak ,buddha has no fears. may good sense prevail in both country

Posted by swaraj | Report as abusive
 

Lot are being said here about Kashmir, India and Pakistan, many commentators have tried to highlight the fact that since Pakistan is also victim of terrorism , but the points to ponder that if your house is burning , shall you put your neighbours house on fire, since Pakistan is victim of terrorism, will that mean Pakistan will export terrorism to India, if Pakistan is victim of terrorism , for this situation Pakistan and its people are responsible , they were fighting proxy wars by creating various terror outfits on behalf of their clients in US, Saudi Arabia etc ,for this present mess in Pakistan, the sole responsibility lies with the people and govt of Pakistan . How Pakistan can justify the terror attacks in India by terror outfits based in Pakistan.

Posted by Manish | Report as abusive
 

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