U.S. considering raids into Pakistan’s Baluchistan-NYT

March 18, 2009

For some months now there has been a steady drumbeat of reports in the media saying that while the United States had made significant breakthroughs in its covert military campaign in Pakistan’s autonomous tribal areas, it could not continue to ignore the vast province of Baluchistan to the south where the Afghan Taliban leadership is based.

This is where the Taliban’s reclusive, one-eyed leader Mullah Mohammad Omar, along with his deputies in  the Quetta shura, is believed to be orchestrating the insurgency in southern Afghanistan.  And this where the United States must target its covert war inside Pakistan carried out largely through missile strikes by unmanned aircraft, U.S. generals and policy makers have begun saying

The New York Times, in a report just ahead of the Afghan-Pakistan security review, says the Obama administration is considering just that: expanding its covert war to strike at Taliban sanctuaries in and around Quetta.

“Some American officials say the [drone] strikes in the tribal areas have forced some leaders of the Taliban and Al Qaeda to flee south toward Quetta, making them more vulnerable. In separate reports, groups led by both Gen. David H. Petraeus, commander of American forces in the region, and Lt. Gen. Douglas E. Lute, a top White House official on Afghanistan, have recommended expanding American operations outside the tribal areas if Pakistan cannot root out the strengthening insurgency.”

According to Danger Room,  the United States has launched missile strikes in the Federally Administered Tribal Areas six times in the past two months, making clear its intention to continue  the previous administration’s policy of taking the battle to al Qaeda and the Taliban in Pakistan.

But widening the war? Striking Baluchistan would constitute the deepest U.S. advance yet into Pakistani territory and be of a significantly different level than targetting the FATA.

In FATA, you could argue these were remote “ungoverned spaces” led largely by local tribals which the much more powerful Taliban  and al Qaeda had exploited. Even then, arguing these were a legitimate target for U.S. missile strikes would be difficult to justify in any international court of law, several experts on this discussion on America’s NPR said.

But Quetta? This is the provincial capital and the seat of an elected government. Every U.S. incursion even in the FATA reverberates through Pakistan and the New York Times itself reports a U.S. official as saying that “an expanding U.S. role insidePakistan may be more than anyone there can stomach.”

The United States is also simultaneously considering a huge increase in aid to Pakistan, which some may see as intended to soften the blow of an intensified military campaign, the Gulf newspaper the National said.

John Kerry, the Democratic chairman of the Senate foreign relations committee, and Richard Lugar, the top Republican on that panel, are expected to introduce legislation soon that would triple non-military aid to Pakistan to US$1.5 billion annually over the next five years. They have proposed another $7.5bn in assistance for the five years beyond that, the paper said.

But it also noted there would be vigorous debate in the U.S. Congress over the aid amount as well as over what strings should be attached.

[Photos of trucks burnt outside Peshawar and a protest in Quetta)

62 comments

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“…non-military aid to Pakistan to US$1.5 billion annually over the next five years. They have proposed another $7.5bn in assistance for the five years beyond…”For goodness sake!!!! The Pakistan military has its fingers in many, many businesses that are non-military. So, giving this aid to non-military is not going to make any difference to where it ends up.

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

seems like after making a disaster of iraq, and failing to bring peace and sanity to afghanistan, the US is bent on turning pakistan up-side down. pakistan does not need the US dollars, the americans should know they are not helping the bankrupting economy by funding corrupt leaders and army.short-term solutions are not the solution to any problem.

Posted by Mr. Ketchup | Report as abusive

“…the president stressed the need for adopting a comprehensive strategy to persuade the international community to assist Pakistan in these troubled times through mechanisms such as allowing market access to Pakistani goods, oil supplies on deferred payments, barter trade, trust fund for the development of Fata and debt swaps.”(from The News, 08/03/2009)Zardari and Pakistan’s attitude is to convince the world that if Pakistan fails then the world fails. I say, “BULLSH*T!!” If Pakistan fails, leave it alone to clean up its own mess. He is still begging by putting a gun to his head. This is his comprehensive strategy.There is a global recession and WE (rest of world) have to keep propping up Pakistan. The protests already cost BILLIONS in trade to Pakistani businesses.Well, Pakistan could ask its all weather friend China, but China’s January exports were down 17% and in February they were down 25% (NY Times).

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

Although it’s obvious that the americans are slowly ‘buying’ pakistan, but amazingly the ultra-capitalist american society is not questioning the gov. whether of what socio-economic contribution or value-addition could a terrorist zone like pakistan be of to them?

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

I thought I read somwhere that these drone attacks were being conducted FROM Pakistani soil and not from across the Afghan border. If so, then what violation of sovereignty is the Pak govt whinging about?If the Americans attack into Baluchistan then they better be very careful not to go near the Iranian border. The Iranians love to take foreigners into their country and show them their lovely collection of maps with contours and borders. They particularly like to show the world how they see your position in relation to theirs when it comes to sovereignty.

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

anup,Most Americans could not care less about Pakistan. Just that if the worst comes to the worst then its nukes are removed. Don’t forget that the unemployment rate in the USA is 8%. Pakistan is not at the front of their minds.I read on a NY Times blog from an American that his Pakistani friends, in the USA, are currently ashamed to tell people that they are from Pakistan. Soon most Pakistanis over the world will be saying that they are Sindhi, Punjabi, Pashtun…etc.

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

“I read on a NY Times blog from an American that his Pakistani friends, in the USA, are currently ashamed to tell people that they are from Pakistan”bulletfish, i don’t think most people are ashamed, frightened yes they must be. there are countless americans who are ashamed when they leave their country to be telling people where they are from. so u see, the feeling is mutual

Posted by Mr. Ketchup | Report as abusive

Mr. Ketchup,’Ashamed’ was the word they used, not mine. I can understand them being slightly afraid to being as frightened as a Muslim guy with a beard and no moustache boarding a plane after 11/09/2001.If they tell someone they are Pakistani then you can easily predict the direction the conversation is going to go:”Do ya know where Osama bin Ladin is hiding?”"Why don’t y’all git rid of ya terrorist camps?”"Are yo’ a member of Al Keeeda?”Back to the topic. The Pak foreign minister has already dismissed this report (Pakistan rejects US strike report, BBC South Asia). If the USA carry out covert operations in Balochistan, then they would have to keep paying Pakistan govt more and more money.If Sharif gets Zardari’s seat as President, then it becomes even more difficult for the Obama administration to do deals (backroom or other) with him.Pakistan govt will carry on creating situations which will require the USA to operate on its soil in order to get more and more money. Isn’t this called racketeering?

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

This is the time for action against Taliban and Pakistani Military homegrown proxy war terrorism.There is no permission required. Droning all and every locations of actionable intelligence is required and necessary to do what the Pak. Military is inept or unwilling to do.Good/bad Taliban, I don’t care, declare open season on Taliban. Once the Taliban is finished, it is time to drone Pakistani cities and drone Headquarters of proxy war armies and proxy army training camps. It does not matter even if those terrorists are sitting plotting moves at ISI offices, actionable intelligence must be acted upon immediately, whereever it is, any city.It is time to wipe all non-state actors off the face of the map of Pakistan. Let the Pak Military sit on the chair and let them watch how it is done properly.It is much cheaper to drone Pakistan than give it money.After FATA, Baloch and NWFP are droned, they can start Droning Sindh, Punjab and Kashmir. Every proxy terror training camp in Kashmir Pak must be destroyed, after all, terror in any form is unacceptable, right?Droning and withholding free money for Pak is far cheaper and less messy collateral damage than an all out American occuppation of Pakistan.The world welcomes fully and wholeheartedly any actions, which will immediately immediately eliminate Taliban, Kashmir Terrorists, Proxy War Traing Camps and any hideouts supporting terrorism of any kind.No permission is needed or required to attack terrorism in whichever form it exists in Pakistan.

Posted by Global Watcher | Report as abusive

If the UN had the guts to label Pakistan a terrorist state, no country needs permission to used Drones, Sharif would be irrelevant. I would welcome the Russians to join in and drone all terrorists and their locations in Pakistan, as well.Again, no permission is required when fighting terrorism.

Posted by Global Watcher | Report as abusive

It makes good sense to think that increased aid from US means increased drone attacks..the news is already there that US is preparing to put hundreds of those hot air balloon crafts for watching the Hindukush mountains and adjoining villages on pakistani side as that is where US believes bin laden is hidding.

Posted by Anitha | Report as abusive

Increased US action in west pakistan will surely make Taliban and queeda to move in to interior pakistan which will force the paki armed forces resist or fight them…as people in punjab cannot co-exist with large group of terrorists as people in tribal areas do.

Posted by Anitha | Report as abusive

So much for “NOW democratic” Pakistan after LONG MARCH, after which it was widely claimed that Pakistani peoples voice is being heard and they can enforce things like in a democracy as far as one dear blogger saying something like “now US get ready to face justice in Pakistan’s court of Law”. If the report above is true, I do not think anyone is hearing the voice of people since 2001-2yrs short of a decade. Everything has US’s veto in Pakistan and the rest is all mask.Also those Pakistani bloggers who believe Pakistani is being smart enough to keep on getting US$$$, they are coming at unaffordably high price. Not smart. But no choice.US is crawling its way into Pakistan’s areas. so is Good and Bad Taliban et al. The War on terror is already messy and is getting messier. Let us see US catches Khalnayank (M Omar) or not–He escaped from right under their nose in 2001.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

Global Watch:”After FATA, Baloch and NWFP are droned, they can start Droning Sindh, Punjab and Kashmir.”This very extreme approach u are advocating (which incidently the US seems to be heading towards as well), do u not think it would lead to such a fire which would engulf the whole region (India, Iran, Central Asia, even China?) while the US is geographically far removed from all this mess it is creating.”… terror in any form is unacceptable, right?”plz clarify ure defination of terror?

Posted by Mr. Ketchup | Report as abusive

@The War on terror is already messy and is getting messier. Let us see US catches Khalnayank (M Omar) or not–He escaped from right under their nose in 2001.- Posted by rajeev- Connecting with other discussion on India-Pakistani in an earlier blog, happy that partition happened. Mauryan, this is called “buffer zone”. Sane Kashmiris must already have trashed the idea of be with Pakistan in recent months.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

@Although it’s obvious that the americans are slowly ‘buying’ pakistan, but amazingly the ultra-capitalist american society is not questioning the gov. whether of what socio-economic contribution or value-addition could a terrorist zone like pakistan be of to them-posted by AnupAnup: “american society” is least concerned in reality. Happy hours, LGBT rallies, animal activists, gathering to raise money for a variety of organizations are the kind of activtites–all within America. Common people constitute society and the common American is thinking US is out there to get OBL in Afghanistan war and for Iraq war, it was Sadaam who supported Al-Qaida–that’s so much they want to know. With all due respect americans are ignorant set of people and who insist to be ignorant because US has “all, why look outside” attitude, and those who know a bit are arrogant set and the remaining intellectuals are nobody and do not move their butt in real terms–Dharna, hartal, protests, hunger strikes are non-violent tools for democracy and hardly practiced. With all due credit to some good media (ngiligible), the widely seen media Media is blue/red, just pathetic–not questioning hard enough the policies, and the analyses of military experts are superficial-”good versus evil” kind of talk–attack FATA, get OBL and other evil guys. What you asked is asking for moon from Americans.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

Chemotherapy for Cancer .. costly, painful but works sometimesDronetherapy for terrorists .. costly, painful but works sometimes.I am worried when dronetherapy fails and US-NATO toll mounts. What will happen then? Ground attack orders of Bush are still valid. Obama had promised ground attacks several times prior to elections. Obama has over-promised to Americans and has to deliver.Only way out for Pakistanis is to find and hunt down these non-state actors and expel them out of Pakistan-state before drones do that.

Posted by Amy | Report as abusive

More in billions to the “military-jihadi” complex in Pakistan? Great! Pakistan will be spending chunk of that money on the terrorist groups in Kashmir. India will be indirectly affected by this decision.

Posted by Nikhil | Report as abusive

@Chemotherapy for Cancer .. costly, painful but works sometimesAmy: Chemotherapy can lead to chemoresistance. Such a counter-terrorism approach through public support can lead to new terrorists.Dronetherapy for terrorists .. costly, painful but works sometimes.Amy: This targeted anti-terrorism approach alone will not yield the desired results since the metastasis has occurred. Will matters, so get Pakistan mentally prepared and the chances of success are much higher.@Only way out for Pakistanis is to find and hunt down these non-state actors and expel them out of Pakistan-state before drones do that.”expel them out of Pakistan-state before drones do that”-Amy: expel outv of Pakistan to where? this already happened from afghanistan to Pakistan, now to where? You cannot keep on chasing them or expelling them out of Pakisitan as a success is an equivalent of Bush’s “mission accomplished” in Iraq. I am an Indian, I want none of these new terrorists from Af/Pak. Frankly, the day it set its feet, US is fighting the war it cannot win–so the basic rule of war has not been followed. I do not care about this deafeat, but I do care about the consequence of this–remember the consequences of US/USSR cold-war on terrorism. From US POV, US will become more unsecure and there will be grave danger to America’s security and this war will be the reason. Now that US has accepted to play the doctor, it should be careful in chosing any therapy regimen/palliative care, keeping in mind the recurrence. defeat is not an option. This is no Vietnam. This is much worse.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

Bombs are not free …Pakistanis must remember all this pain and suffering is self-inflicted. Sad things is US has to spend lives and billions (in aid and bombs) to do house cleaning in Pakistan, which Pakistanis have clearly failed to do.

Posted by Amy | Report as abusive

NPR says it is legal under UN and international law to attack Pakistan.President Zardari says there are non-state areas and non-state actors in Pakistan.So where is the problem?

Posted by Amy | Report as abusive

Give up nukes .. save yourself from DronesUS and world is worried about Taliban and nukes. If Pakistan gives up nukes, US doesn’t care if Taliban gobbles up Pakistan.Just don’t send any Taliban to Afghanistan. US bases are there.

Posted by Global Citizen | Report as abusive

If US has to bring stability to Afghanistan, it has to defeat Taliban wherever it lives. That brings whole of Pakistan into picture.If Pakistan army, police fail to do the job, US army and CIA will complete the job.Make no mistake!

Posted by David | Report as abusive

Rajeev writes: “Connecting with other discussion on India-Pakistani in an earlier blog, happy that partition happened. Mauryan, this is called “buffer zone”. Sane Kashmiris must already have trashed the idea of be with Pakistan in recent months.”As a hypothetical case let us look at your point again. If partition had never happened, India would have been one massively large country. Direct action would have been curtailed (assuming Jinnah saw some sense). Mass scale slaughter wouldn’t have happened. Mass migrations and the resulting loss of life, property wouldn’t have happened. The only focus would have been to get all the princely states into the Indian domain. Kashmir, in its entirety would have been part of the whole union. There would be no tribal invasions, no stalemates, no plebiscites here and there. Everyone would have lived where they were born and raised. No emotions would have arisen that now has manifested in the form of nuclear loaded missiles pointing at each other. No Siachien, No East Pakistan genocide, no Hurriyat Pasand, No plight of Hindu Pundits, no Madrasas that preach Wahabi Islam, no LeT and none of any of these.But something else might have emerged. The nation would have been way too large to manage. But if the British could do it, it should have been possible to run this large nation. May be, there would have been demands for states based on religious lines, linguistic lines, ethnic lines etc. May be a federal structure might have evolved with states having more autonomy and having a joint system of military, currency, foreign policy etc. May be the Russsians would have thought twice about entering into Afghanistan.A lot of hypothetical goodies emerge by envisioning a larger union. Within the current Indian union itself, things have more or less settled down. People have moved on to other big things instead of worrying about language and poverty based themes. Karachi would have rivaled Mumbai. Lahore would have rivaled New Delhi.Unfortunately, history has taken its own course. There is no use day dreaming about the past. What we have now is the reality and we will go along. Now there is Pakistan that is at the edge of a cliff. The Americans are holding it from one end so that they don’t fall catastrophically. Considering what is on hand, it would be good for India to have a few buffer states on its Western border than a single one. Cutting off East Pakistan was the most strategic move. May be India should start looking at its self interests and look into the possibility of creating these “buffer states” quickly. There is going to be no more united Pakistan. They are going to be pulling each others’ beard forever. As an Indian, I’d like our country to move on and mind its own business. But these mullahs are not letting us. So we might have to turn around and kick them hard so that they stop dragging us down.

Jittery Pak instigated Bangla mutiny?I don’t trust the Indian newspapers but if this comes out true, Pakistanis will pay a price .. heavy price!http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com  /World/Jittery-Pak-instigated-Bangla-mu tiny/articleshow/4269149.cms

Posted by Global Citizen | Report as abusive

@Sanjeev, bloggershttp://www.guardian.co.uk/world/ 2009/mar/19/pakistan-us-national-securit yEither Pakistani’s are completely naive about the terrorism and proxy army training camps in their country, or they are defending them as an asset. This is the moral problem with Pakistan. They don’t realize that those particular assets will bring the drones to their doorsteps whether they like it or not.A nuclear country will not be tolerated, having those taliban and proxy army assets. The world is growing tired.It is unfortunate that the U.S. has to always go it alone to fight terrorism on the level where bold action is required.It would be more favorable to see the English, German, French and other NATO countries join and greatly escalate the Drone assault on Pakistan and take it to the cities if necessary.The citizens unfortunately care more about cricket.It is sad that Pakistani’s are so mentally unaware.

Posted by Global Watcher | Report as abusive

@As a hypothetical case let us look at your point again. If partition had never happened, India would have been one massively large country. ……….. Kashmir, in its entirety would have been part of the whole union. There would be no tribal invasions, no stalemates, no plebiscites here and there. Everyone would have lived where they were born and raised. No emotions would have arisen that now has manifested in the form of nuclear loaded missiles pointing at each other. No Siachien, No East Pakistan genocide, no Hurriyat Pasand, No plight of Hindu Pundits, no Madrasas that preach Wahabi Islam, no LeT and none of any of these.-Posted by Mauryan–The “BUFFER” I mentioned was from terrorism emerging from Af/Pak border and that happening inside Pak. It is in the same tone what MJ Akbar also felt as a sense of gratitude–although he meant thankful that he is in India, not in Pakistan. I am assuming the terrorism might have happened anyways for some other reasons using handy demographics in undivided India. You are assuming it might not have happened. But undivide India would have faced not much different ethnic problems than what Pakistan is facing now. The tribes on west Pak have never been easy to control by anyone in the history–no body. Also people of current Pakistan would find some excuse to fight and separate. Political scene also would have been different. There is no reason why Russia will not be in Afghanistan, whether we were allies or not. At that time in history, the chances for them to arm-twist us were real high.But thinking even now that undivided India would have been peaceful in that area is not learning from the history. what you are saying is one way—Do you think a Pakistani feels that way; Umair already told you–they eat beef and we don’t. I personally agree with that and I sometime eat Pork and they don’t. I don;t care about this eating stuff, but I care about people who care about this. Religious ideology is vastly different. How about the progress of the country would have slowed down? MKG wanted to give power to Muslims to begin with and time is the essence and with wrong policies, we would have been far behind. A large poor country is hard to survive and pieces would have occurred anyways by now–perhaps even more–even Khalistan-due to precedence set by some other. My big question is this: Do you see any disadvantage that Pakistan has happened. We have all kinds of cultures/religion in India. If someone has missed it is Pakistan, they cannot get that culture. So do not get carried away by your transient (?) emotion. This is perhaps the only time I appreciate this: “what ever happens, happens for best”. Let us be thankful what we have in reality–the buffer zone from the mess on the west of Pakistan. We need to step up internal security.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

British Defense Minister: “Top goals for the military effort in Afghanistan and Pakistan over the next three to five years should include attacking the command-and-control structure of al-Qaeda and other extremist groups in Pakistan”"The Taliban and al-Qaeda have got to know there is no safe haven”http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-d yn/content/article/2009/03/18/AR20090318 03527.html?hpid=topnews

Posted by Global Citizen | Report as abusive

Democracy lives on Aid, Charity and life-support ..Ambassador to US, Haqqani urges fast-track US aid for Pakistan ..”Democracy needs for people to get some goods, public services, to feel good about the government. The US has been very slow in delivering assistance”"The money hasn’t started flowing”http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/def ault.asp?page=20093\19\story_19-3-2009_p g7_14

Posted by Global Citizen | Report as abusive

Global Citizen—Wonder what the British FM. Milband has to say to his countries defense minister – will he give him the same sermons that he gave to India in a self-aggrandizing way.

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

There is something troubling about the way the Yanks are operating here.. Its as if they don’t give a damn about where the Taliban, terrorists or militants are based. As long as they came send in drones to do the bombing.The Taliban moved away from FATA to Quetta to avoid the bombing while still maintaining links with the regions. Now, the Yanks want to drop bombs on the Taliban in Balochistan. What if this drives the Taliban and terrorists closer the Indian border? Is the Obama administration going to ‘demand’ India give it permission to launch drones from Indian soil or face sanctions? This could drive India and Pakistan to war.

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

The Pakistani’s are using Democracy and Terrorism as an excuse for free money.If you want money, it isn’t coming for free and neither is free food. You will have to give back something to the world if you want economic aid, we do not mean give back in the form of Islamicization, either.Radical Islam = no food, no money, more drones and military campaigns in PakistanSmash Madrasas, Taliban and Proxy War assets and destroy terrorist camps = aid and food for Paki’s.Please pick what you want, you can’t have it both ways.You can make these issues complex, protracted and onorous, or you can break it down simply, for simple minds.

Posted by Global Watcher | Report as abusive

this seems very clear that everybody is loosing patience in fight againt terrorism… it clearly seems like pakistan will eventually have to fight agaisnt terror..at this point they are loosing the battle..and they are not been able to control terrorists..wheather they are completely commited on war agaisnt terror or not that’s a diff. issue but yes..right now because of musharraf’s ineffciency they are in a complete mess…the recent events in pakistan has definately not given world community a lot of confidance in the govt of pakistan .As far as india is concerned the politicians have not been able to save lives of so many indians so many times..for me india is worst affected by terrorism as india is bearing the brunt of pakistani terrorists..i think india should attack terrorist camps if there is another attack even if its a minor one compared to 26/11.though the gen public has nothing against the people of pakistan they they dont trust govt’s actions.drones or no drones there has to be results..they have to achieve certain targets to have monetary incentives from usa..hope pak could unite against this war on terror .

Posted by Raging bull | Report as abusive

Rajeev,Sorry I misunderstood your “buffer zone.” The reason why Pakistan went this way is because it was formed on the belief of “us being different, superior, we can only rule you, we are mighty, we need to cleanse ourselves from your influence” mind set. This kept on cascading to such an extent that the country formed on religious lines never looked at itself and seriously pursued the goal of national development. As a result, after 60 odd years, there is no national foundation, other than the empty rhetoric of Islam and it being under threat. Backwardness begins to build upon itself. Now it has come as far as the Taliban. If ordinary citizens like Umair sound so strange, you can imagine how the others who control the country must be. I do not deny that such warped minds are everywhere in this world. Only they have not succeeded as well as Jinnah and the others have.In a larger union of India (without partition), this kind of development would have been negated. Some people on this forum, do not believe in the existence of divisive forces even within our own Indian union. It is just that over the years, these forces have been slowly pushed below the ground level. Other priorities and opportunities are enticing. The same could have happened inside a bigger Indian union. The mad-mullahs would still have been there, just like the Thackerays, Varun Gandhis, Karunanidhis, Patnaiks and so on. But they would have been contained.Anyway, it is past and there is no way we can go back to the starting point. What we have now is the path ahead. In that, Pakistan with its current evolution and mind set has become a threat to itself, us and the rest of the world. The Americans do not have a good reputation of leaving behind things in order. Whatever they have stepped on in this region has become rubble. India has to look at its self interests. Just based on today’s situation, Pakistan’s threat will drive away business from India slowly, if allowed to continue like this. IPL is already losing support. Now the elections are being threatened. The country cannot go on like this. And something must be done. An overt war will invite the wrath of the Americans and we will walk into the trap that the Pakistani establishment has set up for us and have been provoking us to get into. India has to look at overt ways again. It is unfortunate. But these people understand only their own language. It is time to encourage the Mukti Bahinis inside Pakistan and have them fight each other. There is of course a risk of some of that effort back firing. But it is time to engage Pakistan with internal conflicts so that they splinter up. They are trying to do that to India from a selfish stand point of vengeance. We are not seeking vengeance. We seek progress and this dog has been biting our feet repeatedly. It is time to put something into its belly so that it keeps chasing its own tail. It is unfortunate. But I see no options.We cannot progress with Pakistan being a buffer state for AfPak issues. It will spread and to deflect that, the Pakistani establishment will try to bite India. Already the US is pressuring India to pull back its military for its purposes. See the latest news.

It’s official now: ISI attacked Kabul Govt offices“I would like to say specifically that the intelligence agency of our neighboring country is involved and behind these attacks and organizing these activities””American intelligence agencies also concluded from intercepts that Pakistani intelligence officials helped plan that attack, American officials said later”http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/20/ world/asia/20afghan.html?_r=1&ref=world

Posted by David | Report as abusive

Pakistan’s President: Zardari“Our name ‘Zardari,’” he explained to me, “means ‘people with wealth’”"Once, he allegedly attached a bomb to a businessman’s leg and ordered him to withdraw his money from the bank”“He didn’t know what to do,” recalls Stephen Cohen, a Pakistan expert at the Brookings Institution who attended a dinner with Bhutto and Zardari during this visit. “She told [Zardari] to ‘Go stand over there,’ and he did. … He looked totally out of his element.””Beyond co-opting the media, Zardari has surrounded himself with jailhouse pals, business partners, and former exiles”"Zardari has demoted some of Bhutto’s former top aides to make space for his prison buddies”http://www.sananews.com.pk/engli sh/2009/03/18/our-not-so-strongman-in-pa kistan/

Posted by David | Report as abusive

INDIA’S EMBATTLED SECURITY ENVIRONMENT: POLICY OPTIONShttp://www.dailymirror.lk/DM_BLOG  /Sections/frmNewsDetailView.aspx?ARTID= 43236 interesting to read…

Posted by Raging bull | Report as abusive

Reinventing PakistanAijaz Zaka Syed (View from Dubai)KHALEEJ TIMES19 March 2009What do we do with Pakistan? ” “Let’s turn it over to builders.”This is what I hear almost on a daily basis on a Dubai-based Pakistani television network that my wife religiously watches for its engrossing soaps. The mock talk show titled, Loose Talk, on ARY features two of the most gifted artistes Pakistan has produced. Every time I watch Anwar Maqsood and Moin Akhtar deliberate on Pakistan’s future and come up with the above solution, I can’t help but grin. All new nations go through turmoil and all sorts of political and social upheavals. However, the Islamic republic of Pakistan has perhaps had more than its share of woes since its creation.Forever living dangerously and hobbling from crisis to crisis, the South Asian nation has been a source of ?concern to its own people as well as ?its neighbours.But now I believe there’s hope for Pakistan. This week’s exhilarating developments that took the nuclear weapons state to the brink and back give you hope and confidence about its future.It’s not just the lawyers who fought relentlessly for justice for the sacked judges. The entire nation — political parties, human rights groups, the media, and ordinary people — struggled and strived as one for the cause.Most external observers have failed to see the big picture on the judges issue. For this was not just about the restoration of chief justice Iftikhar Mohammad Chaudhry or his ?fellow judges.This was about restoring the rule of law, justice, democracy, fundamental rights and accountability. This is why the cause of justice for judges had turned into a life and death issue for all sections of Pakistani society.Having long suffered the never-ending abuse of power, corruption, exploitation and a mockery of all that Pakistan was supposed to represent, ordinary people found an emotional rallying point and common cause in the lawyers’ movement. For them, this was an opportunity to put Pakistan back on the track — in line with the vision of its founding fathers. So this was not just about some wronged judges but about reinventing hope and confidence in Mohammed Ali Jinnah’s Pakistan.I know some of my Pakistani friends find the frequent comparisons with India odious. But I can’t help recall that a similar people’s movement helped save the world’s largest democracy.We had our own tryst with people’s power when the late prime minister Indira Gandhi imposed the so-called state of Emergency in 1975 (our ?answer to martial law) to perpetuate herself in power. If our elders are to be believed, it was easily the darkest period in the independent India’s history with some of the worst human rights violations and abuse of power taking place in those two years.If India came back from the brink, it was all because of the strength of its democratic institutions and its people’s resilience. They never gave up their trust in democracy and the rule of law and it paid off. Little wonder no politician has since dared to take Indira Gandhi’s route to pharoaic power.This is why I think that by ‘persuading’ their leaders to reinstate the judges, the people of Pakistan may have rediscovered their nation’s original source of strength, hopefully closing the ?road for all abuse of power and ?tyranny forever. Former prime minister Nawaz Sharif was not off the mark when he told Geo TV that the long march that he led from Lahore to Islamabad defying government curbs and threats to his life ?was a prelude to “a new revolution ?in Pakistan.”Sharif is no saint. He has had his share of warts. Many Pakistanis cannot seem to forget his reckless actions and his own attempts to rein in judiciary in his earlier avatar. But Sharif’s long ?exile and his travails at the hands of Musharraf appear to have made him wiser and more mature.Interviewing him at his daughter’s place in Dubai a couple of years ago, I was struck by the rather unguarded and humble man who sounded and behaved so much differently from the haughty autocrat that he was made out to be.Whatever Sharif’s flaws, he had been consistent in his support for the ?cause of justice and all that it had come to symbolise.Whether it was a clever political move or genuine change of heart, Sharif embraced the lawyers’ cause early on as his own, apparently realising its emotional and symbolic significance for his people. (Many in Zardari’s party though suggest Sharif hijacked the ?lawyers’ movement.)The former premier may have played a huge gamble by deciding to lead the long march. If the government hadn’t relented, it might have been construed as a huge setback to the former prime minister as he had invested personal prestige in the movement.But now that the people power coupled with considerable persuasion from the two members of Pakistan’s triumvirate — Army and America — have taken the game out of Zardari’s hands, Sharif walks tall. He has emerged as a leader who is now perhaps too big for the pygmies around him. I only hope all this new-found power and popularity do not go to his head.In fact, Sharif, Zardari and all Pakistani politicians must learn the ?necessary lessons from the justice movement which has united a deeply divided and disillusioned nation like never before. Perhaps never since the inception of Pakistan has any cause so electrified this nation of competing contradictions, rejuvenating it visibly and completely.Pakistanis ought to jealously guard and protect this gift of democracy and justice that they’ve found after tireless efforts and enormous sacrifices. They must not let another tyrant — in khaki or civvies — drive them off this path that will take them to a better and more peaceful tomorrow.If Pakistan’s separated-at-birth twin India (here I go again!) has grown by leaps and bounds over the past six decades emerging as one of the two new big powers winning hearts and minds around the world, there’s only one explanation: Democracy and rule of law.Save for a brief interlude of two years, the nation of a billion people has steadfastly stayed the democratic course chartered by its early leaders. Not a small feat considering India’s size, population, poverty and a myriad other issues and concerns. But despite its woes and weaknesses and continuing struggle with the forces of darkness, it has never given up its faith in democracy’s magical power to heal.I am not exactly on George W Bush’s side. But I kind of believe the same mantra could work for Pakistan — and rest of the Muslim world — as well, solving all their problems. Well, almost all!Aijaz Zaka Syed can be reached?at aijaz@khaleejtimes.com

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

@Umair,Umair, as I said earlier, I respect your love and positivity towards better days in Pakistan. But the main trouble here is, is that ordinary Pakistani’s like you, are doing and saying absolutely nothing to take a moral stand on the Taliban, Extremist Islam and the ISI and Pak Military’s extremists-jihadi proxy army assets.It was again reasserted and confirmed by U.S. Agencies, that the ISI had a direct hand in the India Embassy suicide bombing.What truly troubles me about Pakistani’s, let me be very blunt and forward here, your country’s people lack the morality to admit fault and stopping hate and terrorism, when there is fault to be admitted, Pakistan also has been caught red handed by India and the U.S., fomenting ISI fueled dirty tactics and simply goes silent and says nothing.Again, I have not seen enough Pakistani’s protesting the Taliban, protesting Radical Islam, protesting hatreds fueled by outside Wahabi Radicals. Pakistani’s are quick to condemn drone attacks but have little will or moral fabric to detest and condemn wahabi and deoband Islamist Radicals who pervert and destroy and use the lives of poor boys and girls and use them for radical acts like suicide bombings. Please tell me, why is this? Why do you people let your children be used by Extremist Islam in this manner and do not protest and smash those Hate-preaching madrasas?This is the double standard and selective morality that disturbs the World and India. This is exactly what we are getting very tired and angry about.When will average Pakistani’s put and end to foreign Radical Islamists with a political agenda to Radicalize and take over Pakistan? When will you force the hand of your government against this radicalism and quit wasting so much of Pakistan’s resources fueling hatred towards India?I just have to tell you, that ordinary westerners, like myself who discuss these politics, after watching the news are baffled at how easily Pakistani’s scorn the drones, but do little to scorn Radical Islam, which is stealing and perverting their children in Pakistan?When will the will rise in Pakistan to collectively rise and take Pakistan for Pakistani’s? When will Wahabi and Deobandism be smashed and put to an end?

Posted by Global Watcher | Report as abusive

Global watcher wrote:”What truly troubles me about Pakistani’s, let me be very blunt and forward here, your country’s people lack the morality to admit fault and stopping hate and terrorism, when there is fault to be admitted, Pakistan also has been caught red handed by India and the U.S., fomenting ISI fueled dirty tactics and simply goes silent and says nothing.”My dear, respectful and lovely friend Global watcher, I drive right infront of the ISI headquarter in Islamabad every single day on my way to work in Islamabad. ISI is Pakistan’s first line of defence, a fearless and notorious spy agency, even American fear ISI as it is capable of doing the unthinkable.Ok, I am not gonna offend you by praising ISI too much. Here is the thing, Last year after Indian embassy was bombed in Kabul, CIA director secretly came to Pakistan in July 2008, no one knew about his top secret visit. After about 10 days the story leaked out. Details are, that he visited Pakistan, confronted Government and military officials and gave them evidence of ISI involvement in Kabul bomb attack. Right at that moment, CIA director was given response and evidence of RAW and Indian involvement of terrorist activities in Baluchistan.Global watcher, ordinary Pakistanis are proud of ISI and Pakistan Army. There is no such thing as radical Islam, today Pakistanis have elected democratic government and there is rule of law in the country. No radical parties hold office here.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

And Global watcher, I must state that i have nothing against you. If I am not forgetting, your mother hails from lahore? right.Lets just stop the usualPkaistan-is-epicenter-of-terrorism rant. Lets use our time and effort positively. There need to be more sensible in both India and Pakistan so both countries can progress. There is much Pakistan can learn from India. If Pakistan is successful to build a strong economy, let the democratic system grow strong, have rule of law and improve international image by controlling any terrorist elements within Pakistan and bring them to justice, I can assure Pakistan will be a very strong country. Pakistan has its problems, but these are being tackled.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Ok, I am not gonna offend you by praising ISI too much. @Here is the thing, Last year after Indian embassy was bombed in Kabul, CIA director secretly came to Pakistan in July 2008, no one knew about his top secret visit. After about 10 days the story leaked out. Details are, that he visited Pakistan, confronted Government and military officials and gave them evidence of ISI involvement in Kabul bomb attack. Right at that moment, CIA director was given response and evidence of RAW and Indian involvement of terrorist activities in Baluchistan.-posted by UmairGuys, sorry to intrude into this talk about open secrets of ISI espinoage.Umair: With due respect, how do you know that CIA director was given response and evidence of RAW and Indian involvement of terrorist activities in Baluchistan—I mean any reference or is it inside info?. Even if that really happened, isn’t ISI notorious enough, smart enough and basic for any agency that they prepare fake evidence, especially when it knows they are being confronted and must give some damn reason against India. NO brainer-ISI also did that. Smart or not, ISI is not stupid plus the CIA-ISI teacher-student axis knows how to do it all. Fact is ISI has definitive role against India, but “RIGHT NOW” RAW is just a suspect and is made into Pakistan’s boogeyman. You know that RAW was created after 1962 Indo-China and 1965 Indo-Pak Wars, while ISI is there since Pakistan was created–such a big rush. RAW in Pakistan was due to ISI supporting Sikh militancy and former Indian PM IK Gujral ordered RAW to shut off its counterinsurgecy operations sometime in 1990s on moral basis, coinciding with eradication of Sikh terrorism. RAW agents, like any other spy agency agents, are not paid to sit at home. Agents are present in other countries. I will not be surprised if they are still found in Pakistan or other countries. RAW has strong reasons to do that from Kashmir POV, but that does not means RAW is supporting terrorism in Pakistan. This is complete BULL… This is different from ISI-supported terrorism in India and killing of innocents. It is your choice and you have doing that since ever and hasn’t helped or did it? You know more about ISI than perhaps I do. Now it is important that citizens of a democratic country like you should discuss it honestly. Talking peace at one time and being proud of ISI notoriety, saying Pakistan is peaceful are just not consistent and ask your conscience if this is helping Pakistan as a nation. Peace is exercised on the ground not on the paper. Pakistan epicenter of terrorism or not is for you to decide. Eveyone in the world must be having some reason. Yes this is made more dramatic that it is or who knows less than than it is. Umair: It is time for you to act like a responsible citizen of a democratic country that Pakistan is trying to become. We Indians sing this rhetoric which you might find offensive, but many of us criticize ourselves too. It is time you doing that too– start differentiating between patriotism and supporting the wrong policies of Pakistan, if you want to see your country to move forward as a stable democracy devoid of all kinds of terrorists, which I atleast want to see. But if it is happening at the cost of India, of course NO.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

sanjeev,It is now established globally , Pakistan is a failed state and state sponsor of terrorism in the name of islam as if Pakistanis are the only custodians of islam . In the name of religion, they are killing innocent women and children . US should not only bomb the terror camps located near Pak-Afghan border , but should also bomb Pak army camps which are also breeding ground for terrorists . All the right minded people in the world are supporting US in its endeavor to root out terrorism from the world.The presence of nuclear arsenals in Pakistan pose grave danger to world , therefore US should also destroy them .

Posted by anju2008 | Report as abusive

Umair writes: “CIA director was given response and evidence of RAW and Indian involvement of terrorist activities in Baluchistan. “That’s right. After seeing the RAW blue prints for destabilizing Balochistan that was provided by the ISI, the CIA director flew back to Obama. And they came back with an idea. Put more troops in Afghanistan and shift the focus towards Southern Afghanistan – Balochistan border. They suspect that there is a RAW agent called Mullah Omar who has one eye closed at all times. His eye got poked while peeping. So the ISI can identify him with precision. Once the US knocks out the RAW training camps, freedom will prevail. Balochis and Pashtuns can run towards each other and give an embrace while their machine guns are pointed away from each other.The world has recognized the RAW is the instigator of all troubles in the world that the ISI and the Taliban are working hard to suppress. Al Qaeda is a charity organization that runs hospitals and schools along with sister organizations like the LeT, LeJ etc. They have to fight global terrorism by dangerous criminal organizations like the Red Cross. They must bring to justice people like Mother Teresa, who the RAW has hidden away somewhere and misled the world into believing she is dead.Build on Umair. Lie after lie. This is one thing unanimous across Pakistan. Keep saying them so that your grand children will believe as absolute truths.

Umair,The CIA director had SOLID PROOF that ISI was involved in the bombing of the Indian Embassy in Kabul. He produced to the ISI records of coversations tapped between ISI agents and the bombers talking about the attack.You state:CIA director was given response and evidence of RAW and Indian involvement of terrorist activities in Baluchistan.Exactly what did this evidence consist of? Are we just meant to take YOUR word for it that the CIA director was given response and evidence. What was this evidence?I am sorry, but it is very difficult for me to believe what you stated. Ever since your Pak govt kept denying and denying that the ONE Mumbai attacker caught alive is Pakistani, only to admit afterward that he is indeed Pakistani.If you know so much information why don’t you apply for the position of Pakistan Information Minister. I have heard that there is a vacancy.Please stop blowing hot air all over the place and fix YOUR own Pak economy ($1 = 80.1 Pak rupee). The Long March has already cost Pakistan businesses a lot of money and don’t expecy Aunty America to give you extra pocket money to recover it. Also, please try to find and catch the Lahore cricket attackers.

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

Umair- I am not sure about this, but I guess there is no other country where so much of aid money has been sent in a span of 10 yrs. Still your nation is struggling? Its time for Pakistani’s to introspect…. where has all the money gone.Currently Pakistan is living on Foreign donation/ loan. So you have to do exactly what you are told to do by US/ UK/ EU and China-Military Aid. You don’t seem to have a choice. After all if you take their money, you will do as you are told.You seem to be upbeat about the democracy in Pakistan. But it seems they do whatever military tells it to do. The recent confrontation between Zardari- Gilini- Sharif was brought under control by the Army. Why can’t you guys keep the army in its place as so many other countries do. A military man know how to go for a battle and knows very little diplomacy. As long as you let your nation ruled by these guys, you will suffer. They will create new battles.After all the Army must be plush with billions of dollars in aid. I have also heard that the military officers in Pakistan are really rich!!

Posted by Tushar | Report as abusive

Bulletfish and Tushar:You dont believe that India is involved in terrorist activities in destablizing Baluchistan. But the United States knows it, either India or Pkaistan both are not innocent. Both countries wage attacks against each other whenever their is an opportunity.What is famous about Kabulk Indian embassy bombing was, that India had about 12 consulates in Afghanistan. All of them working arming terrorists, finding millitants, orchestrating cross border terrorism in Pakistan. ISI being Pkaistan intelligence agency simply blew up the Indian embassy in Kabul. Right at that moment, all Indian consulates in smaller Afghan cities got the message loud and clear, if the main embassy in Kabul can be blown into pieces, the consulates can simply be wiped out.CIA, US knows this, its tit for tat between India and Pakistan. I really dont have time to search links, but you must do your search. Google, find out about CIA director’s vist to Pkaistan after Kabul embassy boming in Jul;y 2008. You will get to know startling discoveries.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

US told not to back terrorism against Pakistanthenews.jang.com.pk/top_story_de tail.asp?Id=16421US Chief of staff Admiral Mullen and CIA Director were in Pakistan on unannounced visit on July 12 2008.

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ObjectivesThe objectives of ISI are:1.Safeguard Pakistani interests and national security inside and outside the country.2.Monitor the political and military developments in adjoining countries, which have direct bearing on Pakistan’s national security and in the formulation of its foreign policy and to collect foreign and domestic intelligence in such cases.3.Co-ordination of intelligence functions of the three military services.4.Keep vigilant surveillance over its cadre, foreigners, the media, politically active segments of Pakistani society, diplomats of other countries accredited to Pakistan and Pakistani diplomats serving outside the country.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

@Bulletfish and Tushar:You dont believe that India is involved in terrorist activities in destablizing Baluchistan. But the United States knows it, either India or Pkaistan both are not innocent. Both countries wage attacks against each other whenever their is an opportunity.-posted by UmairUmair: Life is short. Quit this scoring game.Any way, once upon a time, there was a Pakistani blogger right on these blogs-abut a month ago. He took it upon him to prove that RAW monster supports separatists in Pakistan–Baluchis in particular Was his research projcet. It appeared that Way since he Will try to dig out some info from google and only thing he brought Was an editorial in a SriLanka daily and in that too RAW’s role in SriLanka Wad mentioned but this blogger Was making it a case that since RAW does it in SriLanka (not that I believe the report or I am arguing SL invlovement of RAW), it does in Baluchistan too. I later found that the article published in SriLanka daily Was first published in a Pakistan Nespaper and Was a copy/paste. So that is the extent of RAW involvemnent in Pakistan. As I mentioned before RAW (1968) Was created 20 yrs after the creation of ISI (1948). That too after 2 Wars Were imposed on India 1962 china, 1965 Pakistan War. RAW presence in Pakistan Was due to Sikh terrorism–bec Pak Was supporting Sikh terrorism (yes, our peaceful neighbor Pakistan). RAW Was asked, by the former PM IK Gujral, to shut off its operations in Pakistan on MORAL grounds.RAW is made out to be Pakistan’s boogeyman.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

@Bulletfish and Tushar:You dont believe that India is involved in terrorist activities in destablizing Baluchistan. But the United States knows it, either India or Pkaistan both are not innocent. Both countries wage attacks against each other whenever their is an opportunity.-posted by UmairUmair: Life is short. Quit this scoring game. Yes there is lot of stuff on many Pakisani sites if you visit those–some even accusing several former Indian PMs as paid agent of BLAH BLAH spy agnecy–such a complete bullshi$t.Any way, once upon a time, there was a Pakistani blogger right on these blogs-abut a month ago. He took it upon himself to prove that RAW monster supports separatists in Pakistan–Baluchis in particular Was his interest. He tries to dig out some info from google and only thing he brought Was an editorial in a SriLanka daily and in that too RAW’s role in SriLanka Wad mentioned but this blogger Was making it a case that since RAW does it in SriLanka (Here I am arguing for or against SL invlovement of RAW), it does in Baluchistan too. I later found that the article he cited was originally published in Pakistan newspaper. So that is the extent of RAW involvemnent in Pakistan. As I mentioned before RAW (1968) Was created 20 yrs after the creation of ISI (1948). Until 1968 there Was no intelligence agency that exlusively handled external intelligence. Until then the Intelligence Bureau (IB),responsible for India’s internal intelligence, also handled external intelligence.So RAW came into existence only after 2 Wars Were imposed on India 1962 by china, 1965 by Pakistan. RAW presence in Pakistan Was in mid 1980s due to Pak-supported Sikh terrorism– (ISI is still doing it) bec Pak Was supporting Sikh terrorism (yes, our peaceful neighbor Pakistan). After Sikh militancy Was wiped out, in 1997 the former PM IK Gujral asked RAW to shut off its covert counter intelligence team operations in Pakistan on MORAL grounds. The idea was that covert operations destabilize bilateral relations and are also dangerous for the peace and stability of the region.RAW is made out to be Pakistan’s boogeyman.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

Umair,India has these colsulates because there are plenty of Indians WORKING around Afghanistan building roads and other parts of the infastructure. Where is the proof that these colsulates are orchestrating terrorism?I asked you:Exactly what did this evidence consist of? Are we just meant to take YOUR word for it that the CIA director was given response and evidence. What was this evidence?So, WHY CAN YOU NOT GIVE A STRAIGHT ANSWER?Where is hell is YOUR precious, glorious proof that India is arming terrorists in Afghanistan?Oh, I’m sorry you have no time to do your research. What are you trying to say? That you cannot find any shread of proof that India is fermenting terrorism in Afghanistan or that you are too lazy?The responses you give do not hold anything. Your so-called country has enough terrorists orchestrating terrorism that are supported by people within your own country.Your Pakistan is living off the aid from other countries. Pakistan is a BEGGAR.Forget about Pakistan Zindabad. Its more like Pakistan Zinda Bhaag!!

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

@Umair,Provide me an answer, the next time it is proven that Pakistan has a hand in the next mumbai, what do you expect India to do?If we defend ourselves, you threaten nuclear retaliation, if we hold and restrain ourselves, you call us weak.Pakistan wants to have open option of sending proxy armies and terrorist attacks on India but holds nuclear response as an option to India responding to any proxy army terrorist attacks, well is it me, or is Pakistan actually a nuclear powered terrorist state?Umair, if you got nukes, you can’t be fueling proxy wars and you cannot have Terrorist training camps and you claim that you got India by bxlls. This is false, the actual scenario is that Pakistan by pointing the gun at India, while it creates terrorism, is actually standing on the edge of the building with a bed of spikes waiting on the ground for it, as it falls of the building and hits the ground. The fact is, is that India has 1.2 Billion bodies. You cannot destroy them all.If Pakistan does anymore Mumbai’s and any more Kargil’s, India reserves the right, morally and legally to Respond in a way and time of its choosing, and that it will, as it will have support from the UN security council the next time.India wants to dismantle the terror camps in Pakistan, because Pakistan won’t and you threaten to disproportionately vapourize India, killing millions, well this is where Pakistani’s lose all moral ground.You claim India will be nuked for wanting to protect itself from your proxy armies.It is Pakistan in fact, who the world has by the bxlls.

Posted by Global Watcher | Report as abusive

There is no reason for India to have so many consulates in Afghanistan, unless some of them are meant for intelligence and sabotage activities.Coming back to topic, these Americans do love action don’t they. The war is not over in Iraq, Afghanistan, or even Pakistani tribal areas and these folks have already moved on to the next adventure!I think a poor country like Pakistan will just have to ride out the storm and them clean up the mess later.

@Umair,Provide me an answer, the next time it is proven that Pakistan has a hand in the next mumbai, what do you expect India to do?If we defend ourselves, you threaten nuclear retaliation, if we hold and restrain ourselves, you call us weak.-posted by Global Watcher-Global Watcher it is not Pakistan but some non-state actors who do it. Perhaps Clever Zardari was saying the truth. He himself has been more of a “non-state” actor than even LeT. But I think Pakistan is serious now since they are a democracy like India post-Long March, and they will take care no more Mumbai happens by Pakistan. This was the last time.About your question, let us see a Pakistani POV. To me, India was at this crossroads state of mind right after Mumbai. But now, after a series of events in Pakistan have give India the options that do not involve war or surgical strikes and neither do they invite NUKES from Pakistan. We should learn something from our responsible neighbors.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

Global Watcher, rajeev,It seems Umair cannot provide an answer because he may have gone offline due to load shedding in Pakistan. We will have to wait 6-12 hours until he replies.I hope he does not use the same excuse he gave me that he does not have the time to search links.

Posted by bulletfish | Report as abusive

“Admiral Mullen and Kappes were both provided information about the activities of the Indian consulates in Kandahar and Jalalabad and were asked how the CIA does not know that both Indian consulates are manned by Indian Intelligence who plot against Pakistan round the clock.”http://thenews.jang.com.pk/top_st ory_detail.asp?Id=16421Now Rajeev if you think I am going to run around the internet searching for links to prove RAW terrorism in Pakistan?No, I am not going to do that simply because I am not interested in it. I studied in Army institution my whole life, I grew up watching my dad in Air Force unifirm, I can make of it I have the sense. I have friends in Pakistan Army, a close friend who is captain in Pakistan Army and whose unit was involved in counter-terrorism did give me insight in to this matter. I know what I know, you guys search if you want to know Indian terrorism in Baluchistan.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

India makes world’s cheapest car, Pakistan makes world’s cheapest terrorist

Posted by anju2008 | Report as abusive

Umair,When India blames Pakistan for terrorism we catch either Pakistanis or people having Pakistani connections. Kasab and 9 dead bodies are recent examples. Where is the proof of Indian involvement??Umair trust me… you Pakistanis are lead to believe that India is involved… these terrorists were actually created by ISI. Since they have been squeezed by Indian Army and US they have no where else to do what they do the best than in Pakistan…

Posted by Tushar | Report as abusive

Umair,Since you are boasting about your military connections, you must be aware of Kargil war. How did the Pakistani establishment wash their hands of the event at that time!! They even refused to take the dead bodies of Pak soldiers who died fighting.Much later your President and COAS in a book claimed that the soldiers were Pakistanis. Is this your tradition? Arn’t you ashamed of this. Please ask your dad and friends in the Army whether they were proud of it.

Posted by Tushar | Report as abusive

@TusharDead bodies of Kashmiri rebels were portrayed as Pakistani solders for propaganda purposes.Returning to topic, Baluchistan has quietened down considerably since the Indian-agent Akbar Bugti was eliminated in 2006, it would be best of Pakistanis to keep it a quiet place, despite American intentions.