Comments on: Pakistan, India and the election manifestos http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/ Perspectives on Pakistan Thu, 01 Oct 2015 19:31:05 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.2.5 By: Mauryan http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16710 Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:05:32 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16710 Rajeev writes: “HE WAS CAPTURED WHILE DRESSED IN A BURKA ”

That also happens to be the traditional uniform for Pakistani army. Umair will feel really insulted that a non-state actor used the prestigious Pakistani military uniform typically used to escape from real wars. Umair recently posted his army’s slogan which translates thus:

BEARD, BURQA and BEND OVER.

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By: rajeev http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16665 Tue, 21 Apr 2009 20:50:49 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16665 @Rajeev,
I take my comment back. This Washington Post articles says otherwise. Looks like Taliban is aiming high.”
–by Mauryan

Mauryan: I am just waiting for counter attack by “Pakistani Army” OR another deal by Pakistani establishment. One of the two.

Yes u are right, it is something big. This is fundamentalism movement sweeping across the nation and has Mullahs, terrorists, Taliban sharing their common goal of fanatic Islamic Pakistan where Qazi not CJ decides—the worst possible scenario that a sane Pakistani would wish for. This has shadowed LongMarch, so soon so easily. LongMarch was for judiciary and democracy this is also over those issues to make sure everything won in LongMarch is lost. These extremists/terrorists of all shades including fanatic Mullahs are part of these tide and want to turn Islamic republic of Pakistan into Fanatic Republic of Taliban. Others have no say in this.

Quote “Speaking to thousands of followers in an address aired live from Swat on national news channels, cleric Sufi Mohammed bluntly defied the constitution and federal judiciary, saying he would not allow any appeals to state courts under the system of sharia, or Islamic law, that will prevail there as a result of the peace accord signed by the president Tuesday.”

And in Islamabad in the famous Lal Masjid:
“Mohammed’s dramatic speech echoed a rousing sermon in Islamabad on Friday by another radical cleric, Maulana Abdul Aziz, who appeared at the Red Mosque in the capital after nearly two years in detention and urged several thousand chanting followers to launch a crusade for sharia nationwide.”

Aziz was detained by Pakistani security forces during the siege after famous operation by Pakistani Army in July 2007. HE WAS CAPTURED WHILE DRESSED IN A BURKA :-) He used the disguise in an attempt to elude security forces. So this thing has been cooking for a while and now everything is falling in place.

There is no way other than giving these fanatics/terrorists/Taliban the same medicine what they give to others. That works the best. Good luck Pakistanis.

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By: Mauryan http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16553 Mon, 20 Apr 2009 16:29:06 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16553 Rajeev,

I take my comment back. This Washington Post articles says otherwise. Looks like Taliban is aiming high.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con tent/article/2009/04/19/AR2009041901731. html?hpid=topnews

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By: Mauryan http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16552 Mon, 20 Apr 2009 16:05:44 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16552 Rajeev writes: “Moving on, did you say the recent development–

http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_deta il.asp?Id=21615″

This demand seems to confine the rules to the Malakand region only. It depends upon how the Pakistani leaders play them after the rule is implemented. If it is left internal to Pakistan, I think the dust will settle. But the Al Qaeda and Afghan Taliban issues will not be allowed to settle by the US. They would push Pakistan’s government to go in there and take them out. That is when the Taliban will decide to take over the power in entire Punjab first and control the situation from there. Balochistan is already in their pocket.

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By: rajeev http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16549 Mon, 20 Apr 2009 14:44:17 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16549 @Rajeev,
I wouldn’t generalize that all Indians hate Pakistanis. But I am sure there is a substantial number of close minded people on our side too – The Thackerays, Narendra Modis, the Advanis and their followers. The only advantage is that they are not as militant as the groups inside Pakistan, who are almost trained to fight like commandos. Our diversity and democratic system have kept these war lords at bay from exploiting the public sentiments. And I am glad that we have atheists, Dalits, Communists and Congressmen who balance out their thrust.”

–I do not want to rake up the old discussion. My point of asking the question was that I rememebered once we had one intense discussion over the Kashmir issue and you said something along the lines which made it sound as if more Indians hate Pakistanis than do Pakisanis towards India. Population-wise, it is not the absolute #s. But I got ur point.

Moving on, did you say the recent development–

http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_deta il.asp?Id=21615

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By: Mauryan http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16529 Mon, 20 Apr 2009 00:27:49 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16529 Rajeev,

Sorry, I don’t think I gave you a clear answer. I believe we have an equal number of people inside India who hate Pakistanis to the core. Mind you India is 8 times more populated. So that makes is about 12%.

What I worry about is that this population might grow more militant and trigger Islamic upsurge inside India. This is something the ISI would love to exploit. And these groups might pressure the government to do stupid things. We must campaign somewhere hard to contain these elements in India who are waiting for an opportunity to use hatred as a quick means to power grabbing. Hate will burn anyone. I’d love to sign up extradition treaty with Pakistan and send Bal Thackarey, Uddhav Thackaeray, and other hate mongers to Pakistan. They can do whatever they want with these guys. I’d like to see them in the same jail cell with Dawood Ibrahim.

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By: Mauryan http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16528 Mon, 20 Apr 2009 00:19:10 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16528 Rajeev writes: “do you still think Indians hate Pakistanis more than the other way around?”

I wouldn’t generalize that all Indians hate Pakistanis. But I am sure there is a substantial number of close minded people on our side too – The Thackerays, Narendra Modis, the Advanis and their followers. The only advantage is that they are not as militant as the groups inside Pakistan, who are almost trained to fight like commandos. Our diversity and democratic system have kept these war lords at bay from exploiting the public sentiments. And I am glad that we have atheists, Dalits, Communists and Congressmen who balance out their thrust.

Our frustration has been that the Americans have completely ignored the reality in the region and have gone to bed with the wrong people in bringing peace to this region. This has also whipped up anti-American sentiments in our population.

I worry for our moderate Muslims after Mumbai. I read in NY times that many well to do middle class Muslims are denied renting apartments in Mumbai. I’d like to protest this somewhere. We need to do better in treating our citizens for their rights. But that is a different topic.

In short, I do believe that there are hate mongers inside our country too. Right now, we have control over them.

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By: rajeev http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16511 Sun, 19 Apr 2009 19:08:12 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16511 @Hatred is a worse than even the nukes and they have begun to boil with hatred.”
– Posted by Mauryan

–Mauryan, you have been on these blogs shared ur thoughts with pakistani and other bloggers. You have tried to reason with pakistanis & have hit ur head against their wall of ideology based on anti-Hindu religious intolerance/anti-India-pro-Taliban ideology/conspiracy theories/take all the credit for throwing Soviets out & blame US for all the problems in Pak/shamelessly telling that Pakistan-ISI is doing anti-India activities in Mumbai. These bloggers are hopefully the over-exagerated version of Pakistani people, but do do you still think Indians hate Pakistanis more than the other way around?

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By: rajeev http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16501 Sun, 19 Apr 2009 18:44:07 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16501 Umair:
April 19th, 2009 9:51 am GMT, you write
“Whether India is an enemy or not is not clear, however India certainly is not a friend as yet.”

25 minutes later (April 19th, 2009 10:16 am GMT) you write:
“Also just remember , India still is officially enemy. no 1 so far.”

You are not clear about India. You feel it is patriotic to shout against India!!!–everyuthing is bad. Try to find soemthing “Good” out if Taliban.

–Also you think that Taliban is not pakistan problem–and why is that–strategic depth/!!!!—-this is Pakistan’s binggest problem. THe fact is Taliban is Pak’s problem more than it is US’s, which is 2 continents away. Perhaps you have the luxry to stay clear of Taliban and are lucky not to live under Talibanized Pakistan, so far.

Good luck

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By: Mortal http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2009/04/15/pakistan-india-and-the-election-manifestos/comment-page-3/#comment-16499 Sun, 19 Apr 2009 18:35:02 +0000 http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/?p=2466#comment-16499 Mauryan writes: “Our leaders should work with the US and others to dismantle the nuclear infrastructure in this rogue nation. As they burn, these nukes are going to catch fire and explode from within.”

Trust me, the US has been preparing a contingency plan for that day, for a long time. I had read an article back in 2002 about joint exercises being conducted frequently, by a special task force, consisting of Americans, Indians & Israelis, in the eventuality of Pakistani Nukes falling in the hands of extremists. The world is watching Pakistan’s nuclear facilities, without blinking an eyelid.

Mauryan writes: “I was not convinced of mass hysteria and psychology until I see Pakistanis now. All they need is a leader like Hitler. And they will become animals completely”

The mass hysteria, the vindictiveness & the hateful ideology has been ingrained in the Pakistani mind for decades. Right from the 1st grade text-books in schools, up to the venomous speeches & sermons in madrasaas & mosques. What can you say about the psyche of a country, which considers barbaric & ruthless invaders like Ghauri & Ghaznavi as heroes, so much as to even name their missiles after them. Ironically, today the descendants of those heroes (the Taliban) are invading Pakistan itself but the delusional ignoramuses that Pakistanis have become, most of them are still in denial.

There are some very good, moderate & tolerant Pakistanis like Ahmed Rashid, Asma Jahangir & Pervez Hoodhbhoy etc. who get it right but I’m afraid, they form a very minor segment of the Pakistani society and won’t be able to stop this tsunami of extremism that will consume all of Pakistan, eventually.

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