Pakistan: from refugee exodus to high-tech drones

May 8, 2009

With Pakistan launching what the country’s Daily Times calls an “all-out war” against the Taliban, more than 500,000 people have fled the fighting in the northwest, bringing to more than a million those displaced since August, according to the U.N. refugee agency UNHCR.After apparently giving the Taliban enough rope to hang themselves, by offering a peace deal in the Swat valley which the government said they then reneged upon, the government for now seems to have won enough popular backing to launch its offensive.But to succeed in defeating the Taliban, the government must also be ready with a strategy to rebuild shattered lives if the mood in the northwest is not to turn sour, Dawn newspaper says. It quotes defence analyst Ikram Sehgal as estimating the military could take up to two months to conclude its campaign, and that dealing with the impact on civilians will require more than 10 times the one billion rupees (12 million dollars) the government has so far announced.In a separate article, it says that refugees are already upset about the behaviour of both the Taliban and the military. ’We are frightened of the Taliban and the army. If they want to fight, they should kill each other, they should not take refuge in our homes,” it quotes an 18-year-old girl as saying.Both Pakistan’s The News International newspaper and the blog Changing up Pakistan warn against the onset of compassion fatigue, both for  the sake of the people affected and to make sure refugee camps do not turn into recruiting grounds for the Taliban.”If the militants can provide services and offer more viable options for IDPs than the state, that is a dangerous phenomenon. The government and international agencies must therefore do more to relieve the plight of the ever-increasing number of displaced persons in Pakistan, not just for humanitarian purposes, but because we cannot afford to let the Taliban win any more,” Changing up Pakistan says.In the meantime, more questions are being raised about the U.S. administration’s policy of using unmanned drone aircraft to fire missiles on Pakistan’s tribal areas. The missile attacks, meant to target militant leaders and disrupt al Qaeda’s capabilities, cause civilian casualties, alienate Pakistanis who see them as an invasion of sovereignty and add to a perception that Pakistan is fighting “America’s war” in one place, while being bombed by American planes in another.Foreign Policy Journal quotes U.S. Congressman Ron Paul as criticising the Obama administration for continuing the drone missile attacks first started under President George W. Bush. “We are bombing a sovereign country,” it quotes him as saying. “Where do we get the authority to do that? Did the Pakistani government give us written permission? Did the Congress give us written permission to expand the war and start bombing in Pakistan?” he asked.

It adds that he said there are “many, many thousands of Pashtuns that are right smack in the middle, getting killed by our bombs, and then we wonder why they object to our policies over there. How do you win the hearts and minds of these people if we’re seen as invaders and occupies?”

Dawn newspaper also urges an end to the drone attacks in a passionately worded editorial.

“The justification offered earlier was that Pakistan appeared helpless against the rising tide of militancy and terrorism. But now the army has launched renewed offensives in the militant-infested areas and reports suggest that gains are being achieved. Meanwhile, public opinion is turning against the militants, with many in the citizenry now demanding that no stone be left unturned in bringing them to book. In this situation, the continuing U.S. drone incursions are robbing our security forces of some of their moral legitimacy and are, in fact, undermining the war effort,” it says.”Meanwhile, the Pakistan Army and other security forces continue to suffer heavy casualties in the battles under way on our western borders. These losses cannot help but be juxtaposed with the fact that the U.S. uses unmanned drones to fight without putting any of its soldiers at risk. It may soon be asked whether Afghan or Pakistani lives are less precious than those of the Americans.”Since the United States never officially acknowledges the CIA-operated drone attacks, it is hard to get a clear picture of where the policy stands. But Britain’s Daily Telegraph earlier this week quoted sources close to the Obama administration as saying the missile strikes were being re-evaluated because of their adverse affect on public opinion and value to the Taliban as a propaganda tool.Finally, B. Raman, formerly at Indian’s Research and Analysis Wing (R&AW) intelligence agency, has an interesting perspective on the troubles in Pakistan’s tribal areas in this article.The Americans, he says, have got to stop being so heavy-handed and consider the grievances of the Pashtun people caught up in the middle of the battle against al Qaeda and the Taliban. “The Pashtun anger is the root cause of the mushrooming Taliban organisations right across the Pashtun belt,” he writes. ”Instead of trying to understand the Pashtun anger and to mitigate it, President Barack Obama, his advisers and aides have been fuelling it further through their insensitive and thoughtless statements and comments, which tend to project the Pashtuns as a whole as accomplices of Al Qaeda, paint an apocalyptic characterisation of the developments in the Pashtun belt and unnecessarily over-stress the role of the security forces in dealing with the violence resulting from the Pashtun anger.”(Reuters photos of refugees/Faisal Mahmood)

64 comments

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MyraThe public opinion in Pakistan is definitely getting tough against the militants. People have had enough of it, I want to quote the following statement by the Army:”No 124/2009-ISPR Dated: May 8, 2009Rawalpindi – May 8, 2009: After the complete break down of Law and order and non adherence of peace deal by the militants, Army was called in aid of civil power to eliminate militants and from Swat valley. Even after the peace deal, the militants had challenged the writ of the Govt continued with militant activities.On the directive of Govt of Pakistan, Army is now engaged in a full scale operation to eliminate all anti state elements from Swat. They are on the run and trying to block the exodus of innocent civilians by preventing their departure through coercion, IEDs, road blocks with trees and even hostages.”Whole statement can be viewed on ISPR website:http://www.ispr.gov.pk/front/mai n.asp?o=t-press_release&id=630The Army is saying that militants are using fleeing refugees as human shields. Reports even say fleeing residents cheer the troops moving into those areas. People are starting to show confidence in the Army and Government and hope is the Army will use its full might and Air Force provide close air support.the Army has long argued that drone attacks jepordize the work of Army. It is upto the US to understand the situation on ground and in pursuit of tactical gains dont jeopardize the long term strategic objectives. It is about time Pakistan take the drone attacks seriously and do something to stop them.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Umair“Reports even say fleeing residents cheer the troops moving into those areas.”—A Sordid report! how coldhearted can you pakistani’s get, atleast have some compassion for the people that you claim to be your ‘own’ & like parasites not feed on their sufferings.“It is upto the US to understand the situation on ground…”—The Boss is always right.“It is about time Pakistan take the drone attacks seriously and do something to stop them.”— Your Army’s found the solution – they’re bombing their own people with double vigor, so that there wouldn’t be anything left for the US for drone practice, lol.

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

“It may soon be asked whether Afghan or Pakistani lives are less precious than those of the Americans.”—Huh??? soon be asked? is this dawny yawny editor so damn dumb that the obvious is yet not known to him, does he lives in a fool’s paradise or in a glass house?

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

First let’s see if the Pakistani army is up to the task of taking ground form these militants. They are already talking about months to complete the offensive. Seems a bit extended considering the few thousands fighters with the Taliban. These drone attacks are clever, but it is illegal. This is setting presidence.

Posted by Aron | Report as abusive

I believe the recent ‘assault’ should be cautiously guarded. We dont know how long or sustained it will be.Moreover I also think the drone attacks should be continued because this is what compels these dangerous people to stay indoors. It seems after much bashing by the US of the Pak Army and ISI, they are doing something for which they would be commended and inturn get those Green George Washington’s.People say Pakistan is attacking its own people. I disagree.These guys never pay taxes, the local laws dont govern them,they live in their own state etc.They are not our people.Then they say why arent they being protected from the drones? I ask why do you indulge in crimes which compel others to react this way.They deserve everything of this sort and more probably whats missing is shock and awe.Now I believe is the best time for the Pak Army to deweaponize the Tribal Areas and establish the Constitution in this part and do away with the Tribal Areas ,either they should be part of pakistan or they should be ceded.We dont want to hear the crap that these illiterate,war mongers have a proud history etc and they should be allowed to keep weapons etc.Stop this hogwash and deploy Army in these areas and all those people who have committed terrorism either in India or Pakistan or other places should be brought to justice.Lets exterminate Terror and live in peace.

Posted by Suleman Maniya,Goteborg,Sweden | Report as abusive

Myra:It is enecouraging to see that finally COAS Kayani vowed that “The Pakistan Army will employ requisite resources to ensure a decisive ascendancy over the Taliban”. From the action going on, this seems serious not fooling around this time. Pak should make it the final war ever needed against Taliban in all the territories of Pakistan. Because if it is left half done, Taliban will come back with vengeance. But the million displaced as refugee is a huge problem. There is a need to give humanitarian aid right away with high efficiency. Refugees should not be allowed to fall for aid from militants any way. Drones should be paused and americans need to take realtime decisions rather than showing tube-light effect in decision making. They are being thick headed. Time for PAK and USA to get public support right now.

Posted by rajeev | Report as abusive

Interestingly a silence has settled over Al Qaeda, LeT, LeJ, JuD, HuJ etc. The Pakistani radical groups must be really in utter confusion. They do not know where their supporters in the Pakistani military/intelligence systems are. The ISI might have to told them to lay low for now so that they don’t get wiped out in the internal war with the Taliban. Or some of the Taliban might move into these organizations for future operations.The military and Pakistani government have no choice but to go all the way to the end in cleaning out the Taliban. If they show any signs of hesitation or make any half hearted decision, the Taliban will emerge back, even stronger than before. There could be elements inside the military and the ISI that might take out Kayani and others who are operating on behalf of the Americans. If that happens in the middle of all this, chaos will prevail.Let us hope nothing stands on the way between the military’s objectives and their completion. Once they have terminated the Taliban, they should never look back and work for a future that does not rely on radicalism. They will need to clean out the other militant groups as well. Otherwise, in the long run, all the efforts taken now will be a waste.

Myra,As long as it is the Pashtuns that are suffering, irrespective of how; killed or displaced, it would be perfectly fine with the Pakistani military.This “offensive” started just days before the summit in Washington, where Afghan and Paki leaders were to meet.Every time the Paki military needs cash, it puts up a show against the Taleban, who used to be back when the money is delivered into the pockets of ISI generals and corrupt Pakistani “poltiticians”.It would be extremely naive and completely stupid to believe that the Paki military would fight the so called Taleban. How can you fight your own creation? How can you destroy your “strategic depth”, which would be the same thing as suicide?Would you like me to count how many times Musharaf put the same show for the world in the past seven years, hunting Taleban?The Paki Terror Army knows how to milk Uncle Sam, who finds himself at crossroads of South Asia.I will never ever trust what the Paki Army says or does. I believe, in some respect, I know them more than they know their selves.Don’t be blinded by the Pakistani Army propaganda like the Indians who welcomed “Pakistan’s offensive” against that. India will soon regret that statement.

Posted by kabura | Report as abusive

Mauryan—Your post has sent my mind ticking – Will the ISI be now blamed by all terror org. for double-crossing them? how hard it must be on the Pak Army to eliminate it’s own ‘child’? are they doing it for short-term monetary gains from the US & would this back-fire in the long-term?

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

Anup writes: “Will the ISI be now blamed by all terror org. for double-crossing them? how hard it must be on the Pak Army to eliminate it’s own ‘child’? are they doing it for short-term monetary gains from the US & would this back-fire in the long-term?”I don’t think the ISI has double crossed anyone. Its core unit is probably in tact. I read in India Today that the insurgency in Kashmir has gone to a higher level. The Indian military sources say that now the insurgents are coming in units of 30 to 40 instead of 3 to 4 as in the past and their level of training and skills are extremely high. In addition they include women insurgents as well. They have come into Kashmir to disrupt the elections and are frustrated about the happenings in Swat. There might be a plan to get into Kashmir, distract the attention there, while half of them sneak into the rest of India and launch a massive operation at various places at the same time or within a short period of time. This will shock the Indian system so thoroughly that a retaliation into Azad Kashmir would be forced. This will “help” the ISI and Pakistani military to blame the “Indian aggression” and allow the Taliban to have a time out and regroup. They might even try to stage a nuclear strike if possible. This might be the last ditch effort by the ISI to deflect the war that is spreading inside Pakistan. If they fail to wake up the Indians again, then their internal conflict will turn into a massive civil war with the US pressurizing the military to eliminate the anti-Indian elements inside the ISI. This is a very crucial time and India has to be very careful. I get a hunch that something terrible is going to happen inside India. So far the elections have gone on without much violence. So the politicians might feel relaxed and be busy with horse trading. And the strike at that time can be blinding. The Indian military reports close to 600 insurgents have moved into Kashmir by this time. Right now, no one is talking about India or the terrorist organizations inside Pakistan meant for Kashmir. Since this might be a last ditch effort to diffuse the internal tension inside India and turn the Taliban against India, the strike can be a death blow. India has to be very careful.

It should read “Since this might be a last ditch effort to diffuse the internal tension inside PAKISTAN and turn the Taliban against India, the strike can be a death blow. India has to be very careful.” in the above response.

Listen carefully to what Maj. Gen Athar Abbas DG ISPR says in Urdu from 1:27 till the end of this 2 and a half minute video;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBo ZhOy0hfM&feature=relatedwho is aiding the militants and who is providing them weapons? One thing is clear India is not the only enemy, there are many elements, Uzbeks, some central asian states, even some Iranian elements, also at some level Russians involved. Also the word officially out of Pakistan is, that foreign intelligence agencies stationed in Afghanistan (CIA, MOSSAD or RAW whoever) might be involved in supplying weapons to militants.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Also while Pakistan Army is using heavy handed tactics and pounding the militants with heavy artrillery, helicopter gunships and fighter planes. Its all the more important to stop the weapons supplies wherever they are coming into Pakistan from the Afghan border. Otherwise if the militants get their hands upon anti- aircraft weapons, SAM(Short rangle shoulder fire surface to Air missiles) etc than they will gain significant advantage. The Army might have to stay in those areas for longer period of time.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Umair writes: “One thing is clear India is not the only enemy, there are many elements, Uzbeks, some central asian states, even some Iranian elements, also at some level Russians involved.”I’d like to remind you that Pakistanis are no angels. Sometimes you will have to taste a dose of your own medicine. Your country is good at making enemies and trust me, you have no friends. You have masters (US/NATO) and alms givers (Saudi Arabia). China is using your country only for its purpose, just like the Americans are. Even Afghanistan has turned hostile towards you. Tariq Ali in his book, “The Duel” says that Russian invasion of Afghanistan in 1978 happened due to Pakistan’s plans. He calls it a “bear trap.” Zia Ul Haq had major plans for your country. Pakistan had become an international pariah when Zia seized power and he was condemned for hanging Bhutto. All funds were cut. Tariq Ali is a Pakistani. If you proudly quote an irrelevant article on Arundhati Roy, learn to swallow what Tariq Ali says. So coming back to Zia, the ISI was causing a major irritation to the communist government of Taraki, just to trigger the Soviets to invade. And they did not want to invade either. Their politburo rejected the invasion proposal two times.A lot of bad decisions, poor foresight and planning by Pakistani leaders have led to today’s situation. When the chips are down this bad, everyone will look like an enemy. Why would India be friendly after what your establishment has done to it all these years? Anyway, this is the same thing we have been fighting over in every blog. I will leave it at this.The bottom line is that Pakistan needs a taste of its own medicine and I hope they learn from it and commit themselves not to repeat the mistakes of the past.

Umair writes: “One thing is clear India is not the only enemy, there are many elements, Uzbeks, some central asian states, even some Iranian elements, also at some level Russians involved.”Yeah, that’s what Pakistanis need: More baseless & unsubstantiated conspiracy theories from delusional Generals. The Americans, Russians, Israelis, Indians, Iranians, Uzbeks etc etc. Pretty much the whole world is just out to get Pakistan. Don’t you guys ever learn & do some introspection?

Posted by Mortal | Report as abusive

Mohsin Hamid, the author of “The reluctant fundamentalist,” reflects my above views.http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connec t/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/world/1 2-pak-army-must-give-up-its-ambivalence– bi-13Pakistani military should give up its ambition to run the country at its own terms and stop justifying its pursuits by creating unnecessary enemies. Enemies will not help protect your nation. This addiction to enemies has to stop.

I don’t think the Taliban has any strategic planning capability. Its planning until now was done by the ISI. With the Pakistani military turned against the Taliban, the ISI must be working a way out of this crisis. If Taliban is destroyed, that will not be the end of the story. Pashtuns will remain alienated forever and will never trust the Pakistanis. In addition, their culture demands a revenge at any costs. Pakistan might have to face their revenge for a long time. There are some courses the ISI might take.1. Infiltrate India with enough insurgents over a short period of time, fool the Indians into thinking that everything is quiet because Pakistan is busy chasing its own tail, and then hit hard in several place simultaneously. This time an Indian response will be guaranteed and suddenly every party will be united against the ever lasting enemy – India. And they can assemble the nukes just to make things worse for the Americans.2. Take out civilian leaders inside Pakistan so that there is no one left to lead but the military. The US will be lost for sometime on who to make a deal with.3. Launch an offensive inside Afghanistan, try to assassinate Karzai and create chaos there.This is all assuming that the Americans are dozing. The CIA is watching the ISI closely. So it will be a difficult task to wriggle out of the uncomfortable situation. Pashtun enmity is the worst thing Pakistan would want to inherit.I read in Tariq Ali’s book that the Durand line was established in 1893 and was supposed to expire in 1993. Looks like Pakistan is illegally occupying the Pashtun land. So they can work out a deal with the US. Vacate the Pashtun land on the East of the Durand line, call the line null and void and declare it as a part of Pashtun land or Afghanistan. Then the US can bomb the day lights out of that region. Pakistan can simply plug all exit routes for the Taliban and wash them off for good. This way, the Pashtun anger will be directed at the US and they can’t do anything to the US.

I’m wondering, why are the Punjabi/Kashmiri groups like Let etc so quiet? Have they been reigned in by their ISI bosses or are they planning something big in Punjab?

Posted by Mortal | Report as abusive

Mortal asks: “I’m wondering, why are the Punjabi/Kashmiri groups like Let etc so quiet? Have they been reigned in by their ISI bosses or are they planning something big in Punjab?”I think the ISI is working on a very large scale operation inside India right now to wriggle out of the internal conflict inside Pakistan. For this the LeT operatives have to be engaged. The apparent silence of these Jihadi organizations clearly tells me what the plans are. I hope the idiots in India see what we see and gear up to meet the challenge. If they sleep like they did prior to Kargil or Mumbai, they are in for a very rude shock. This will be ISI’s last ditch effort to deflect the internal war, escalate India-Pakistan tension and find an escape route.

I think the ISI is working on a very large scale operation inside India right now to wriggle out of the internal conflict inside Pakistan…..- Posted by MauryanThat certainly is a possibility but I think that there are too many eyes watching the ISI right now, for them to plan a venture in India via ‘non-state actors’. The Mumbai fallout has hurt them badly & for the first time, pretty much the whole world has sided with India & implicated Pakistan. Another attack in India would be suicidal for the ISI at this time. I think they might be planning something big inside Pakistan. In any event, the Indian security forces, certainly need to be extremely vigilant.

Posted by Mortal | Report as abusive

ISI’s back is against the wall now. If it fails to deflect the Taliban-Pakistan conflict, it is going to drain the morale of the army soon. There will be defections of Pashtun military personnel. The anti-Indian jihadist parties might be wondering which side to take. If they side with the military and keep out of the whole thing, then they get to gain later on. Taliban itself is dependent on Pakistani military and the ISI for weapons and ammunition. Unless they can seize them once in a while, it will become like the sepoy mutiny of 1857, where the sepoys lost due to lack of ammunition and the British got the replenishment arriving on time. Even if the military kills off the Taliban leaders, there will be feelings of vengeance spread around. And that has the potential to multiply. The ISI/LeT staged the Mumbai attacks right in front of the CIA and others. Already cross fire has started from the Pakistani side along the LoC. This means insurgents are crossing over in large numbers. I guess they will do a Kargil this time, deep inside India, with the Indian military being unable to fight over civilians. They must have learned what not to do after the Kargil defeat. Anyway, what I am suspecting, hopefully remains untrue.

It is really good to read Pak “Professional” army fighting taliban.However, are they doing it well? How can you fight a terrorist, who is taking human shields, with Tanks and helicopters? How will you ensure no/minimum civilian causalities?No wonder this “professional” army has got 5 lakh people displaced(IDP)

Posted by chirkut | Report as abusive

The conversation is going off topic.I wrote this post because I thought it was important to highlight the plight of the refugees and to flag up the debate about the drone attacks.So why is it that some of you have again chosen to turn it into an excuse to criticise Pakistan? There have been plenty of other posts on the Pakistan Army, on the ISI, and on relations between India and Pakistan, where you have had this opportunity. You don’t need to repeat all the same stuff on a post about refugees.So here’s a challenge. Have any of you got parents or grandparents who have been refugees? If so, please talk to them about it, and specifically about what it’s like to worry about food, water and security (as opposed to debating the role of the ISI from the safety of a laptop.) Then come back and make comments on the subject of this post.Myra

Posted by Myra MacDonald | Report as abusive

Myra”If so, please talk to them about it, and specifically about what it’s like to worry about food, water and security”—Isn’t it obvious that no one genuinely cares a damn! cause if someone does then the plight of the srilankan tamil refugees is a hundredfold more grave & what to say of the ethnic african tribes in darfur, so anyone who says he does care is a hypocrite.

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

MyraIm veering off the topic here for a reason.How come the genocide of SriLankan Tamils is ignored by western media.Arent they innocent civilians.Arent they bombed by their own army. Why the apathy.Im not blaming you individually. I just appreciate your views, thats all.

That was a good question Azad.Myra, please give an honest answer. Why is it that the Afghan and Swat refugees are suddenly more important than the Tamils or the North African refugees? Is it because the US is involved with one of them and not the others? Refugees from a war zone is a global phenomenon. We can surely feel sorry for them and help them wherever we can. What led to all this? If we can fix the root cause, there will be no such problems right?

Myra”So here’s a challenge. Have any of you got parents or grandparents who have been refugees? If so, please talk to them about it, and specifically about what it’s like to worry about food, water and security (as opposed to debating the role of the ISI from the safety of a laptop.) Then come back and make comments on the subject of this post. “-Myra I am from Punjab and was lucky that none of my parents or grandparents had to migrate during partition. Though my grandfather and father and uncles are veterans of WWII and Indo-Pak wars, but I dont know of anyone who had been a refugee. Having said that, it is truly sad to witness people having to leave their homes and everyhting behind and to flee their homes and end up in make shift tents in far flung areas. This is the irony of war, it is even not clear when things will get normal and they will be able to return to their homes and villages. However one thing is clear, the Army means business this time.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Mauryan”Myra, please give an honest answer. Why is it that the Afghan and Swat refugees are suddenly more important than the Tamils or the North African refugees?”Look, i dont want to be rude, but please think before you start asking questions. It is quite clear this blog is titled: Pakistan: Now or never. So that is why this refugee story has been quoted. I am sure when reuters starts a blog on Sri Lanka you will find more to read on the conflict there. It is not aquestion of Pakistani refugees being more important than Sri Lankan refugees. So I hope you got your answer.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Umair”This is the irony of war,..”—Well Said. The tribals of SWAT chose Pakistan over India after partition, now they’re ‘ironically at war’ with Pakistan & their tribes facing death or destruction with not a single sign of any consideration from the ‘remaining’ Pakistani’s…they’re the first amongst the many… Sri Lankan tamils will be taken under positive care by their Indian brothers , can the same be said of the Pakistani tribals? ofcourse No! the Pakistani’s have declared war on them & “the Army means business this time.” – isn’t this what you said umair…

Posted by anup | Report as abusive

you people are unbelievable. and by you people i mean the pakistanis and indians. no matter what the topic of the article is, you people can’t seem to let go go of your slum menatalities. its the same constant and pathetic comments over and over again. for all you people who wanted the pakistan government to “take action”, well here it is. and this is the result. thousands of already poor place are now being forced out of their already poor conditions and will be forced to live in even worst conditions. now all the pro-indian people will say things like “well they brought it on themselves” and “that’s what they deserve”. well at least the pakistanis are doing something no matter how usless it is. where was the indian government when hindu extremist went around and killed, raped, and burned 2000 indians?? no where to be found. worhtless. and for all you pakistanis who ever had any slight sympathy for the taliban, well here is the final product. you really think they fight for islam, care for muslims??? think again. the taliban is the worst thing to happen to islam since yazid.its about time pakistan learn how to unite, shias, sunnis, ahmedis and take control of their own future. if you continue to bicker and fight over these ridiculos secterain issues, then you are no better then the indians for which you accuse of commiting crimes against.

Posted by hassan | Report as abusive

Hassan – where was the indian government when hindu extremist went around and killed, raped, and burned 2000 indians??Time & again, your Pakistani bias rears its head. You always talk as if you are an unbiased neutral third party & yet your comments are always anti-India. You might consider yourself as a ‘proud american’ in public, my friend but deep down inside you are as Pakistani as the other Pakistanis on this blog & it clearly shows, so just cut the act. If you were indeed unbiased, when mentioning the 2000 Indians who died in riots, you should’ve also mentioned the genocide of 3 million Pakistanis by it’s army as well as the massacre of thousands of Ahmadias & Shias in Pakistan. India, certainly has had it’s problems with ethnic violence & all Indians accept that but I’ve yet to see a Pakistani, come out & accept the above mentioned genocides & massacres in Pakistan. Now that’s the definition of ‘hypocracy’.

Posted by Mortal | Report as abusive

Umair tells the truth sometimes like this: “However one thing is clear, the Army means business this time.”Only this time? Your army was in business all the time. All generals rewarded themselves handsomely with land, business deals. All the American money got siphoned off by the Pakistani military for its “benefits.” It is the only “industry” in your country. And that is the reason why civil administration never took root.

mortal, i don’t need you to tell me what the pakistanis have done to shias, because i am a shia. so i don’t think i need a computer nerd to tell me about history.i could care less for the overall well being of pakistan. it is a country that is only 60 years old, so its not like it has deep histroy or thousand year old culture. i do however have a soft side for poor people and innocent people so i do care what happens to them. i could care less if inida and pakistan nuked eached other, frankly i think it would a good idea so we can be rid of some the filth in that region. pakistanis allowed the wahabbis to come in and basically became a saudi warehouse for extremist so this is what they get. however in your so called “defense” of india, you couldn’t even point out what the outcome of those horrific acts of 2002 even were could you? no. because it just got brushed off, didn’t even care, hoping that if you ignored it long enough people may not remember it.it seems like the only action you see from the indian side is in the bollywood movies.

Posted by mortal | Report as abusive

Myra,Do you want us to discuss plight of refugees without going into the cause?And No! the cause is not just Taliban. People are moving out of those areas because they are getting caught in cross fire. Counter insurgency is a war of different kind. You cannot fight it in populated areas with Tanks and Mortars.A lot of blame for IDP also lies with the PAK Army.@”So here’s a challenge. Have any of you got parents or grandparents who have been refugees? If so, please talk to them about it, and specifically about what it’s like to worry about food, water and security (as opposed to debating the role of the ISI from the safety of a laptop.) Then come back and make comments on the subject of this post.”- Exceptionally bad in taste! So if i am not 26/11 victim i should not write or show outrage about it?? And we all are posting,reading and writing blogs from Safety of a laptop.

Posted by chirkut | Report as abusive

HassanYou pointed out correctly, same people here who were criticising Pakistan when the Army was not taking action against militants. Now when the Army has finally begun to apply force, this is the result; a humanitarian crisis. Again these same people are shedding crocodile tears for their Swat ‘brothers’.And for Anup:Yes the people of Swat chose to stay with pakistan after independence, so did Punjab, Northern Areas, Sindh, Frontier, Baluchistan and Kashmir and more than 6 decades later Pakistan is still alive. I know you guys cant take it, but you will have to swallow it. Pakistan is not going up or down, not collapsing or even ‘teetering on the brink of collapse’ or anything like that. Despite all internal problems Pakistan is still capable of overcoming all its challenges. So what you need to do along with other Indians on this blog is to adhere to the topic and stop criticising Pakistan. All you guys are looking for is an opportunity to criticise Pakistan no matter what the topic is. Its just like chasing your own tale in round circles. Now matter how much one reason with you guys result is the same, ISI and Pakistan Army. Such is your level of obsession.

Posted by Umair | Report as abusive

Mauryn:”Your army was in business all the time. All generals rewarded themselves handsomely with land, business deals. All the American money got siphoned off by the Pakistani military for its “benefits.” It is the only “industry” in your country. And that is the reason why civil administration never took root.”-So what can you do about it? if you cant do anything just suck it up. And find out what Gen. David Petraus is stating, and most of high level Pakistan military command gets trained in the US. And Pakistan is changed where today the military is working under the civil government. Gen. Kayani has pulled out military officers from all civilian institutions and had pledged to keep the Army out of politics, Pakistan’s membership to Commonwealth has been restored and the domeocratic government just completed its one year this February. The Army chief in a recent statement has stated that a nation of 170 million people under a democratic dispensationa backed by the military is capable of dealing with any challenge.So you too like Anup and other Indians on this blog need to do the same, stick to the topic and stop your criticism of Pakistan. Freedom of expression doesnt mean you must start stating things blindly without reasoning and just make statements that demonstate your lack of understanding of the world around you. You guys know so little about Pakistan, and Mauryan specially the books you read will never ever give you the correct picture of Pakistan. You have to use your rational though process for that purpose.

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Latest Update on Pakistan Army offensives in Swat, Shangla, Dir, Buner and Waziristan:http://www.ispr.gov.pk/front/ main.asp?o=t-press_release&id=633

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Pakistan Army called in to eliminate terrorists: PMUpdated at: 2220 PST, Thursday, May 07, 2009ISLAMABAD: Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani Thursday said the armed forces have been called in to eliminate the terrorists in Swat and Malakand Division.In a televised address to the nation, the Prime Minister also said that one billion rupees have been provided for the rehabilitation of the internally displaced persons.He announced employment will be provided to one member of a family which has lost any of its member at the hands of terrorists.The Prime Minister said the above decisions were taken after holding consultations with the political parties and other stakeholders.He said although the government adopted the path of talks and negotiations to resolve Swat issue the terrorist elements continued to challenge the writ of the government.“We went ahead and implemented Nizam-e-Adl Regulation in the Malakand Division in line with the long standing demand of the locals,” he said and added that later President Asif Ali Zardari also signed the NAR.However, he said, all these steps failed to bring about peace in the region as terrorists kept targeting the set ups of paramilitary forces and other security personnel.“This situation required taking of some decisive steps,” the Premier said.He appealed to the nation to stand united and extend its complete cooperation to the government in the fight scourge of terrorism.

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PM tells Pakistan Army to ‘eliminate’ militantsISLAMABAD (May 07, 2009, 22:52 PST): Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani announced on Thursday that the military had been ordered to eliminate militants and ‘terrorists,’ appealing to the nation to stand against extremists.”In order to restore honour and dignity of our homeland, and to protect people, the armed forces have been called to eliminate the militants and terrorists,” the prime minister said in his address to the nation.Gilani said militant efforts to disrupt peace and security had reached such a stage that the government believed “decisive steps” had to be taken.Thousands of civilians streamed out of the Taliban stronghold and former tourist resort on foot or crammed into cars in the face of the onslaught, as the Red Cross warned that the humanitarian crisis was escalating.”I appeal to the international community that they should help Pakistan look after the internally displaced persons at this point of time and also cooperate with us to enhance the capability of our law-enforcing institutions,” Gilani said.”I urge the people to unite to ensure the sovereignty and integrity of the country,” added Gilani, wearing traditional Pakistani dress in a departure from the Western suits he frequently favours.”The government has decided that they will not bow before the extremists and terrorists, but would rather force them to lay down arms,” he said.”The time has come when the entire nation should side with the government and the armed forces against those who want to make the entire country hostage and darken our future at gunpoint,” the prime minister added.

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Umair writes: “You guys know so little about Pakistan, and Mauryan specially the books you read will never ever give you the correct picture of Pakistan. You have to use your rational though process for that purpose.”I prefer to read and know through the words of reputed Pakistanis like Ahmed Rashid, Tariq Ali etc instead of from brain washed ISI worshipper like yourself. It is interesting to see you advising me to use rational thoughts. We are still looking for it in your words.

Umair“So you too like Anup and other Indians … You guys know so little about Pakistan, and … the correct picture of Pakistan. You have to use your rational though process for that purpose”—Ironically, it’s just dawned on me, that if Pakistani’s could see themselves with the same clairvoyance as the Indians see Pakistan – then surely it would transform & be a better place to live in – all it needs is a slight shift in perception. Start living the original Indian way.

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Obama’s Domino Theoryby Juan Colehttp://www.commondreams.org/view/200 9/03/30-1As for a threat to Pakistan, the FATA areas are smaller than Connecticut, with a total population of a little over 3 million, while Pakistan itself is bigger than Texas, with a population more than half that of the entire United States. A few thousand Pashtun tribesmen cannot take over Pakistan, nor can they “kill” it. The Pakistani public just forced a military dictator out of office and forced the reinstatement of the Supreme Court, which oversees secular law. Over three-quarters of Pakistanis said in a poll last summer that they had an unfavorable view of the Taliban, and a recent poll found that 90 percent of them worried about terrorism. To be sure, Pakistanis are on the whole highly opposed to the U.S. military presence in the region, and most outside the tribal areas object to U.S. Predator drone strikes on Pakistani territory. The danger is that the U.S. strikes may make the radicals seem victims of Western imperialism and so sympathetic to the Pakistani public.

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Hasan, Umair,Gujarat Riots.See the Time coverage of India after 60yrs of partition.see the root cause of 2002 riots in gujarat yourselves.Myra, Off topic, i know.http://www.time.com/time/specials/2 007/article/0,28804,1649060_1649046_1649 034,00.html

Umair quotes: “Obama’s Domino Theory”It is good that the Pakistani military is doing something right for the first time – attacking and destroying the Taliban (cutting its own throat). None of the events described in the article would have happened if Al Qaeda had not attacked the WTC on 9/11. Af-Pak region was not in George Bush’s radar in 2001. So blame Bin Laden for everything. He screwed up Pakistan’s empire building plans in 2001. If he had been contained, trust me, Pakistan could have derailed India easily with Taliban by now, could have established a Sharia system in Kashmir with its “strategic depth” and what not, made deep inroads into Central Asia and could have become a power. And Pakistanis could have had a cricket series or war with India to their satisfaction. ISI could have annexed Afghanistan as another province of Pakistan, with all brothers merged as one united front against the kaffirs. Musharraf could be the new Caliph of the greate Islamic caliphate. All the refugees running out of FATA should be burning Bin Laden’s effigy now. He destroyed your country’s grand ambitions. Our deep condolences for that.

Umair you are correct. The U.S. will attempt to maintain it’s hegemony under Obama. The U.S. is highly dependent upon foreign oil so no one should be surprised by an increase of forces in the region. Bombing Pakistan by the U.S. can only widen the war and generate empathy and recruitment for the Taliban. This action is duplicitous as the U.S. has little or no legitimacy as a peace keeper. There are other objectives than securing peace(sic).The United States does not send millions to concentration camps to be exterminated or work people to death before sending them to the crematorium. However the CIA has enabled and facilitated despots we have supported around the world to carry out genocidal acts. And not unlike 1930s Germany we are in desperate need of certain natural resources.Germany began it’s war of aggression sending troops to country after country declaring political or security objectives as the underlying motivation. In truth, Hitler needed petroleum, farmland, mineral mining and hard cash to meet the needs of an impoverished people and to further his goals for the Third Riech.Conservatives of all stripes have seen the U.S. as the new Roman Empire for some time. Arrogance still prevails. The pressure on crude oil prices caused by increased world demand and dwindling supplies will tighten the noose around America’s neck if she cannot move away from petroleum. America has no mass transit system to get people to work without cars. She also has the mistaken belief that the military is indomitable. A notion Germany carried concerning her military forces in the 1930s as well.I probably sound alarmist or some think I am exaggerating but these are dangerous times. The American people must stand up to their government and end the policies of the war and oil economy.

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@Also while Pakistan Army is using heavy handed tactics and pounding the militants with heavy artrillery, helicopter gunships and fighter planes. Its all the more important to stop the weapons supplies wherever they are coming into Pakistan from the Afghan border. Otherwise if the militants get their hands upon anti- aircraft weapons, SAM(Short rangle shoulder fire surface to Air missiles) etc than they will gain significant advantage. The Army might have to stay in those areas for longer period of time.”-posted by UmairUmair: This must be a hard decision to eliminate Taliban. What is your thinking: Considering that Taliban is the strategic asset to Pakistan against India, which you list in your growing list of Pakistan enemiesis, do you think it is militarily wise decision on the part of pakistan Army to go all out and crush Taliban. My guess is Pakistan Army is going to keep the germlings hidden to sprout at right time. Any idea about top Taliban commanders inluding Behtula Mehsud.

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@The Pakistani public just forced a military dictator out of office and forced the reinstatement of the Supreme Court, which oversees secular law.-posted by UmairUmair: Can you explain the ignorant Indians when di Pakistan become ‘SECULAR’. If it has what is Pakistan’s definition of secularity.So that Myra does not pull the shutters down on the blog, how’s the water arrangements considering it is hot now. Myra, this is still from the safety of my computer, but I have my grandparants/father who have been through the worse in 1947. They lost multiple businesses, 2 houses, a suitacse of Gold, but importantly avoided bloodshed–all reached India safely. They stayed in a refugee camp for 2 days. I have not talked to them recently but being they were used to full-day fasts and that would have come handy.This is the right blog to talk about SL refugees if we want to see a bigger picture and compare the trends.

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Correction to Umair:So that Myra does not pull the shutters down on the blog, how’s the water arrangements in the refugee camps, considering it is hot now.

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azad, nice try with the link and trust me I can find hundreds of links to show exactly what was done. it showed the “true nature” of the indian people. kinda like how it shows in Kashmir.unfortunatelly umair makes disillusioned statements about pakistan,and i will say it is not all that is cracked up to be. i believe it was mortal who stated that I show my “pakistani bias”, but i am a shia, and the last few decades, pakistan has been nothing but oppresive to shias. regardless of who was in office, we have been targeted and killed by taliban and other sunni extremist groups, with no protection from the government. so overall, i have more animosity towards pakistan then any of you do with good reason. my issue is the fact that some of you purposelly ignore crimes commited by india. the issue of kashmir is always ignored and burshed aside.you can try and make all the intellectual remarks you want and shift the blame of all the problems onto pakistan, china and american anyone else, but don’t think india is not using this to try and justify the build up of its own military industrial complex.now just like america you have your soviet union and korea and iraq in pakistan. therefore you will continue to marginalize the muslims in india no matter how anti-taliban and pakistan they are. you will continue to occupy kashmir on the same basis. you aall know this and I know this.

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RajeevI forgot for a moment your grandparents hailed from Narowal. They must have gone through the time and would have been refugees for a while. I think you must atleast show some compassion towards the plight of those refugees who had to flee the fighting.

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Hassan,The chance to settle Kashmir issue was missed early on. The leaders of both India and Pakistan had that chance until 1960. If it had not become an issue of the ego, I am sure Kashmir issue would have been resolved. A lot of things have happened over the years that have built layers and layers of sediment over it. India is a relatively milder country. Look at the way Pakistan handled East Pakistan or Sri Lanka is handling its Tamils or China handled those who sought freedom in 1991.Today, Pakistan is fighting its own people in Swat. They claim 500 odd militants have died. No one knows how many really lost their lives. India does the same in Kashmir. Militants have infiltrated and are using humans as shields. And the military goes after them and a lot of innocents die in the bargain. There is one difference though. Pakistan has 500000 refugees pouring out of the region. In Kashmir, one only sees Hindu pundits leaving as refugees. It makes no sense does it? Here is a Hindu dominated military taking on Pakistani trained insurgents. And Hindus are coming out as refugees. Can you give some thought on that?Anyway, I’d love to see a peaceful resolution to Kashmir. But the conditions around it have changed dramatically. To settle the Kashmir issue, we will have to rewind to the past which is not possible. Now both Pakistan and India have nuclear weapons. Both hate each other passionately. Pakistan is an expert on insurgency and proxy war. India is an expert on counter insurgency, having dealt with them all these years. People are dying in the cross fire. If Pakistani military’s actions in Swat are understood as protecting the nation, then so are Indian military’s actions in Kashmir.A new generation of Indians and Pakistanis have replaced the old one. We have to see what their sentiments are. Ideally speaking, from a personal stand point, I’d love to allow Kashmir to be an independent state. But I am just one individual with my personal opinion. If a referendum is taken across the nation, my vote will be one of the handful in favor of such a desire. But in a democracy, majority votes decide what matters and everyone has to stick by it after the decision is made. I am used to it all these years. If a referendum is held in India regarding Kashmir, I can bet with you that no one will recognize it as separate from the Indian union. Having spent an enormous amount of money and soldiers’ lives for protecting Kashmir, 99.99% Indians would favor Kashmir as an integral part of India. I can say whatever I want, but what counts is what the people desire. The best compromise that people might prefer is to accept the LoC as an international border and be done with it.Kashmir would not have burnt the way it did, if Pakistan had desisted from sending in Pashtuns, foreign nationals and unemployed and frustrated youth from their side with full military commando style training and launched unrest. Kashmiris are sitting on the wall due to the fear of these insurgents. They respect a democratic India and its protection to the Sunni Wahabist rule that is itching to spread into Kashmir.Too much water has flowed under the bridge. Peace will return if Pakistan agrees to settle Kashmir issue with India once in for all, with the LoC as an international border. India will not allow anything beyond that and Indian public will never allow anything to be agreed on Pakistan’s terms.Though this discussion is irrelevant to the main topic here, I had to clarify with Mr. Hassan for wasting his tears. There are the Kurdish, the Armenians, the Tamils, the people in Darfur etc to cry for. Please focus your kindness there. Kashmir will be peaceful if Pakistan stops meddling there.

mauryan,unfortunatelly your failed attempt to try and justiy the kashmir was a disaster. you mentioned that if there was a referedum in india to vote on the kashmir situation the out come would be 99.9% in favor against it being a seperate state. well the word “duh” comes to mind.who is india to decide on the future of a state that it has no bearing over. you are going to sit there and actually say that you spent enourmous amount of money and blood “protecting” kashmir?? if anything india along with pakistan have made the situation there worse. both coutries fight over it and want to add it as another slum to their already filthy nations. why don’t you have kashmiris decide their own future, WITHOUT the indian army interfereing in their elections, they you will see the real outcome.and you are wrong kashmir would not have burned the way it did if india did not try to confuse it wtih gujrat and try and kill everyone.insurgency only rises when there is an occupying force (see iraq, afghanista, palestine) so what did u expect the kashmiris to do? let’s also note the fact that it was the kashmirs themselves who pushed the extremist out, it wasn’t india and it wasn’t pakistan. it clear to see that its the kashmiris who have been rational in all of this. its funny that pakistani and indians go at it with each other so much yet, both act exactly the same way. i guess the difference is that one wears a dot on their head and the other a turban. both sit there and think they are a tough power but its clear to see that both are just slum dogs.

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@RajeevI forgot for a moment your grandparents hailed from Narowal. They must have gone through the time and would have been refugees for a while. I think you must atleast show some compassion towards the plight of those refugees who had to flee the fighting.- Posted by UmairUmair: I think no one sane person will lack compassion against refugees. Read my very first post again. Here it is copy/pasted:”"”"”It is enecouraging to see that finally COAS Kayani vowed that “The Pakistan Army will employ requisite resources to ensure a decisive ascendancy over the Taliban”. From the action going on, this seems serious not fooling around this time. Pak should make it the final war ever needed against Taliban in all the territories of Pakistan. Because if it is left half done, Taliban will come back with vengeance. But the million displaced as refugee is a huge problem. There is a need to give humanitarian aid right away with high efficiency. Refugees should not be allowed to fall for aid from militants any way. Drones should be paused and americans need to take realtime decisions rather than showing tube-light effect in decision making. They are being thick headed. Time for PAK and USA to get public support right now.”"”"”

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While trying to work out how to answer some of the comments above, I came across the following quote from the French philosopher Simone Weil:”The capacity to give one’s attention to a sufferer is a very rare and difficult thing.”If you look at how many of the comments veered away from the subject you can see what she means.I’m not expecting anyone to change the situation of the refugees, only saying that they deserve attention (at the very minimum enough respect to acknowledge their existence.)The comparison with refugees in Sri Lanka makes no sense to me. A mother worrying about feeding her children in Pakistan doesn’t worry any more or less because a mother in another country is worrying about the same thing. And as someone already mentioned, this is a Pakistan blog.I agree there are many other issues to discuss and will try to start a new thread tomorrow. But in the meantime, remember this is a post about the refugees.Myra

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Hassan writes: “unfortunatelly your failed attempt to try and justiy the kashmir was a disaster. you mentioned that if there was a referedum in india to vote on the kashmir situation the out come would be 99.9% in favor against it being a seperate state. well the word “duh” comes to mind.who is india to decide on the future of a state that it has no bearing over.”I am with you 100% for Kashmiri’s right to decide their future. I am for it for every community in the world. I support the Kurdish people. I support the Tamils. I support the Armenians. I support the Afghans, the Balochis, the Sindhis and so on. But I do not control geo-politics. I have no power, only opinions. My opinions are different from others and I am glad I have the right to express it.We are looking at the reality today and trying to see how damage can be minimized with all parties can come to a compromise. In the case of Kashmir, it is impossible to make either India or Pakistan vacate their policies on Kashmir. They have gone to wars over this piece of land. They are fighting a wasted war on top of a glacier that is of no use to anyone. Political solutions have been derailed by Pakistan. They do not want any peaceful resolution to the Kashmir issue. If resolution was found, the enemy disappears and the justification to generate religious robots to wage proxy wars disappears as well. I feel that the Kashmir issue has been left burning just to keep the war engines running. You resolve Kashmir and the engine implodes.So we can only look at the minimum compromise where the parties involved can go home without losing their faces. That is to recognize the LoC as a border, sign treaties for trust, verification etc and go home. Kashmiris will have to live divided between the two countries for a while. If Pakistan’s efforts in Swat fail and their country falls apart, may be we can look at Kashmir again. But right now, things are where they are.

Myra“The comparison with refugees in Sri Lanka makes no sense to me….this is a Pakistan blog.”— Yeah, so these are Pakistani refugees. What more can someone say?

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Myraa country bombing its own civilians in the name of eliminationg terrorism.Time to give them freedom and if more suited to merge with Afghanistan.No more refugees from bombing campaigne.

Hassan,Since you talk about Kashmir, I hope you can look at Kashmir with objectivity & not through a Pakistani lens. Kashmir was absolutely peaceful & prosperous till the late 80′s with all Kashmiris (Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs etc) living happily together. I went there in 1988 as a kid & there were no problems, whatsoever. So what happened in the late 80′s to change this situation almost overnight? It is a well documented fact that after the Afghan war was over & the Russians & the Americans went back home, the Pakistani establishment decided to use the idle Mujahadeen in fighting proxy wars against India in Kashmir & implement Zia ul Haq’s defined policy of ‘bleeding India with a thousand cuts’. They created groups like the LeT & JeM & infiltrated thousands of militants along the LoC, into Indian Kashmir. That’s when all hell broke lose & the Indian army was compelled to deploy forces to fight them. Now, I do accept that mistakes might have been committed by Indian forces in dealing with the civilians in Kashmir but a lions share of the of the blame for the plight of the Kasmiris goes to Pakistan for creating havoc in the valley through its proxy armies. And while you are talking about injustices against Kasmiris, please don’t lose sight of the atrocities committed against countless Kashmiri hindus & sikhs who were killed by Pakistan trained terrorists & many more, who have been displaced for decades.

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mortal, i don’t need you to tell me what the pakistanis have done to shias, because i am a shia. so i don’t think i need a computer nerd to tell me about history.Hassan, you don’t know me, so please refrain from passing judgment against me. You don’t know whether I’m a computer nerd or someone who is very much capable of kicking the a$$es of the likes of you. This is a blog & we are here to debate on issues in a civil manner & not to pass personal judgments about each other.

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Its funny to hear Indians giving lectures about Pakistan to Pakistanis, because Indians read some books and newspapers. The twisted views of Pakistan that Indians have on this blog is due to the hateful media and low-class books they have been reading about Pakistan.I appeal to my Pakistani brethren to support the Swati refugees by donating at Hidaya Foundation or Mercy Corps, which are helping out in the IDP camps.I also support Pakistan army in its fight against these India supported Taliban gangsters.

@Its funny to hear Indians giving lectures about Pakistan to Pakistanis, because Indians read some books and newspapers. The twisted views of Pakistan that Indians have on this blog is due to the hateful media and low-class books they have been reading about Pakistan.- Posted by Aamir AliAamir Ali: This is what is Pakistanis are taught. A very good ubiased report to cool you down. At the end of reading this report, you will feel that you should have addressed this post to yourself. I am here for your inputs.http://www.sdpi.org/whats_new/rep orton/S tate%20of%20Curr&TextBooks.pdf@I also support Pakistan army in its fight against these India supported Taliban gangsters.-Sure you do support. Regarding India’s role: how do you know? Again the same misinformation problem and sitting in US and the product of one Indian and one Pakistani parent saying this. You are a genius. Why would India feed these terrorists. India hypothetically should help Baluchs or the Balawaristan (Pakistan Occupied Gilgit Baltistan) for the human atrocities and suppression. As a Shia you should be careful in supporting Pakistani Army.

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Aaamir:http://www.sdpi.org/whats_new/rep orton/S tate%20of%20Curr&TextBooks.pdf

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