Winning the battle, losing the war; the US and Pakistan

November 29, 2011

When former foreign minister Shah Mehmood Qureshi said this weekend that Pakistan’s nuclear weapons are not safe under President Asif Ali Zardari, he almost certainly did not mean that the nuclear arsenal is not secure. The nuclear weapons have little to do with the civilian government; they are guarded ferociously by the Pakistan Army both against terrorist attacks and any foreign or U.S. attempt to seize them, and, as a matter of pride for Pakistanis chafing at any American suggestions otherwise,  safeguarded to international standards.

Rather it was a rhetorical device to attack the government at a rally where Qureshi announced he was joining the Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) , the party of former cricket star Imran Khan, a rising force in Pakistani politics.  Qureshi’s assertion tapped into growing anti-Americanism, and a populist view that the  civilian government led by the Pakistan People’s Party, to which he once belonged, had somehow sold the country’s honour – in this case symbolised by nuclear weapons – in return for American aid.  (Pakistan first agreed its uneasy alliance with the United States under former military ruler Pervez Musharraf.)

Yet it is a measure of how distorted and narrow political discourse has become within Pakistan that Qureshi might use the safety of nuclear weapons to attack the government. That political discourse, difficult even at the best of times, is likely to become even narrower in the fury which has followed the NATO airstrikes which killed 24 Pakistani soldiers on the border with Afghanistan on Saturday. 

The attack, which Pakistan says was unprovoked and NATO described as a “tragic, unintended incident”, has outraged Pakistanis who have already endured thousands of casualties in a war they believe was forced on them by the United States.

Underneath the confusion about the aims and course of the Afghan war, lies a deep sense of hurt that Pakistani lives are somehow less valued than American lives, and a painful loss of pride over the country’s inability to defend its territory from attacks by a foreign, and apparently hostile, power – whether from airstrikes, drones, or even the May raid by U.S. forces who killed Osama bin Laden.

The result is a society which is being shaped by the Afghan war in ways which neither Pakistan’s neighbours, nor western powers, would choose.  The airstrikes, coming soon after the forced resignation of Pakistan’s ambassador to Washington Husain Haqqani for allegedly seeking American help to curb the power of the military, have added fresh oxygen to a combustible mix of anti-Americanism and religious nationalism enveloping Pakistan.  Haqqani denies the allegation, but the so-called “Memogate” scandal has badly weakened the civilian government, while the airstrikes have rallied the country behind the army.

In such an environment, there is little room for a discourse that might suggest Pakistanis should also be outraged at the deaths of civilians blown up by suicide bombers sent by the Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP), and therefore discuss ways to turn decisively against Islamist militants. Nor is there space for a realistic political debate on how Pakistan should manage its foreign relations that goes beyond a hatred of America and an illusory faith in China’s readiness to ride to the rescue

Before the latest crisis, the government  had been pushing through legislative reforms to help democracy take root in Pakistan. It is difficult to see these making much more progress now as the government fights for survival. The tedious mechanics of documenting the economy, as a first step towards increasing the tax base and raising revenues, dropped off the political agenda long ago.

Expectations that the civilian government could become the first in Pakistan’s history to complete its term and be replaced by another democratically elected government are being lowered by the day as the politicians descend into the kind of internecine feuds typical of the 1990s. That decade ended in Musharraf’s military coup in 1999. 

The next casualty of the rising tide of nationalism could well be Pakistan’s warming ties with India – one of the few relationships in the region that until now had been going well.   The civilian government had eased itself into the driving seat in pushing for improved trade relations with India, though no one would suggest that it made the progress it did without the approval of the Pakistan Army. It has a particular interest in better ties with India - the army has drawn its power from a perceived need to defend the country against an Indian threat, contributing to Pakistan’s civilian-military imbalance. 

So when Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and his Pakistani counterpart Yusuf Raza Gilani joined each other in early April to watch the Pakistan-India cricket semi-final in the town of Mohali,  they discussed a Pakistani appeal that India drop its opposition to an EU duty waiver on Pakistani textiles exports.  By the end of April, it was becoming clear that improved trade ties could be a game-changer.  (Pakistan had earlier resisted improving trade without first settling the Kashmir dispute.)  By early November, New Delhi agreed to the EU duty waiver and, more significantly, Pakistan granted Most Favoured Nation (MFN) status to India.

That mood has changed.  Reports have begun to surface in the Pakistani media that the army has reservations about granting MFN status to India. The Jamaat-ud-Dawa (JuD), the humanitarian wing of the banned Lashkar-e-Taiba militant group,  and an organisation close to the military,  has launched protests against granting India MFN status, saying that the Kashmir dispute must be settled first. 

After the NATO airstrikes, a JuD protest to mourn the Pakistani soldiers killed turned quickly into a protest against improved trade ties with India. While the government may yet be able to push ahead with its India agenda – albeit on a very tight military leash – the signs are not looking good.

Progress in relations with India had become – quite unexpectedly – one of the few release valves left to ease off the pressures building up within Pakistan.  On its western border, the United States and its allies are pushing ahead with an agenda in Afghanistan which has already integrated the possibility there will be no early peace settlement with Afghan insurgents - an idea long sought by Pakistan.   And while Pakistan won some initial sympathy from foreign governments over the NATO airstrikes, its decision to boycott next week’s international conference on Afghanistan in Bonn, will - at least symbolically – highlight its isolation. It is beginning to look like a country turning in on itself in dangerous ways.

We have always known there was a risk that Pakistan could become to Afghanistan what Cambodia was to Vietnam - a country horribly destabilised by an American war spilling across its borders.  We are not there yet. Perhaps those who say all will be well when the United States leaves the region will prove right – American influence for decades has tended to be toxic to Pakistan.

 But pay attention to the domestic political discourse.  There  is no point in winning the battle in Afghanistan and losing the war in Pakistan.

Comments

@KPS
I’ll have to check with ISI if they include digging mass graves in training.
@007
You can tell your truth as to how you brought down building#7.

Posted by Matrixx | Report as abusive
 

Matrixx: ” I’ll have to check with ISI if they include digging mass graves in training”

Sure. Contact Major Iqbal there. He might tell you how to kill off anyone who does not align with Pakistan’s doctrine and make the Indians take the blame for it. Also ask him how Pak military managed to get away with its genocide in East Pakistan. He might teach you a thing or two. It might come in handy when the Taliban takes over Pakistan. You might have learn how to switch sides without anyone noticing. Your military is very good at that. And it might come naturally to you as well.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Rex:”Humanity is concerned with victims, and show no solidarity with the aggressors”.
Depends who your aggressor is, For the israelis its the palestinian terrorists and for the palestinians it the Israeli predatory state.Humanity is not a monolith entity which is only on your side and sympathising on your idea of victimhood. So if you are guy from the middle east who is culturally closer to Palestinian,due to primordial loyalties, you are bound to be sympathetic to their cause.
Similarly if you are a jew, you are likely support the Israel since Jews were wronged historically and only trying to reclaim their lost land. But that is not my point.
In an unending cycle of voilence, it is imprudent to identify and find who started it first because the other is unlikely to relent. The truth may well be on one of the two sides or the real source of problem lies elsewhere. In this case, Europe (your favourite continent) may be the source of the problem which relocated the jewish problem to middle east, but unless both sides of the conflict do not identify their own mistakes, it is unlikely that the conflict may ever end.

India has acknowledged its past mistakes in Kashmir be it human rights abuses or state atrocities, the Hurriyat acknowledged that it turned a blind eye and sometimes encouraged the militant elements in kashmir which caused unending cycle of voilence, which Paksitan has only taken it as an advantage and stoked it even further. Indian government and Hurriyat now are on a path of reconciliation resulting in uncomfortable peace, uncomfortable may be, but nevertheless still peaceful. This is the reason Pakistan finds so hard to stoke the fires of insurgency at the same level as in 90′s. The terrorists who enter Kashmir are shot in few days by the Army as the state support has waned for these terrorists.
Unless Pakistan reconciles its past mistakes and regrets some of its doings, it is unlikely to realize the futility of sending trained terrorists across the border.
Till that time Indians see Pakistan as unrelenting and irredentist in attitude. Since Indians were unable to provide justice to our victimes (eg:Mumbai citizens) by punishing Pakistan, the next best thing for them is to feel a sense of justice and be relieved when Pakistan is being kicked by somebody else.
I am sure many countries in Europe wanted to kill Hitler during world war but when they realized that Hitler is dead most of them felt a sense of justice to the victims and relieved too. If Hitler had reconciled his actions and felt regret about it (hypothetically an impossibility) he would have atleast saved Germany from bombings by allied forces if not himself.
REx:”Only zombies derive pleasure from the sufferings of others and even foolishly express it”.
Again, depends on who “others” are? How do you feel when your favourite Hero of hollywood bangs the bad guy when this badguy wrongs your favourite Heroine. By showing little pleasure in that, do we all become zombies too.
Or On a lighter note, showing pleasure for the suffering of Harbajan singh (Indian bowler) who is picked up for a six by Pakistani batsmen makes you zombie too.

Posted by sensiblepatriot | Report as abusive
 

Matrix: “I have no problem you celebrating the death of Pakistanis, you can hold celebratory parades for all I care. It reflects your mindset.”

For all I know, Even pakistanis were celebrating the death of Pakistanis, the terrorist yahoos along the Af-Pak border were afterall Pakistani citizens too. When they were hunted down by your Army, the public in pakistan lauded its bravery and the Army took all the credit that comes with it and the money that comes from Americans.
It was not a surprise to us when Mike mullen claimed that Haqqanis were the veritable Arm of the ISI (which itself is a veritable Arm of the Army), and so when American forces killed those 24 men of your Army we were not drawing pleasure for thier deaths but were sure laughing at the embarrassment of your Kayani and foolishness of his policies who we think is the main architect of the Mumbai massacre. This guy planned it in order to claim legitimacy for his disproportionate power he enjoys (see wikileaks). We may sympathise with families of those individual soldiers, but we are hoping to see your army gets even more discredited so that either it will reconcile and regret its actions one day fastening the policy reversal of proxy terror or better,the civil society takes hold of this “super state” (the army) and keeps it firmly under its control.

Posted by sensiblepatriot | Report as abusive
 

So, Allahs’s Sunni Taliban Pashtoon Army MURDERS Allah’s Shia men (http://in.reuters.com/article/2011/12/0 6/afghanistan-blast-idINDEE7B504Y2011120 6). I wonder whom and how, Allah will punish but it must surely be ashamed of its men. But then who is now dancing and enjoying this murder?? Allah’s Army Taliban??? Did someone say Muslim Brotherhood or did I hear Ummah?? Yes Matrixx??

This attack clearly shows the bonding of brotherhood in muslim world. Somehow I think Shiites have been more at receiving end of Sunni extremism who in turn claim to be sole owners and brokers of Islam. So much for Islam!!

Posted by 007XXX | Report as abusive
 

sensiblepatriot: “Since Indians were unable to provide justice to our victimes (eg:Mumbai citizens) by punishing Pakistan, the next best thing for them is to feel a sense of justice and be relieved when Pakistan is being kicked by somebody else.”

Mumbai attacks were staged by Pak Military/ISI using proxy elements in order to push India into sending its troops piling up at its border. That would have invited Pakistan to amass its troops on its Eastern border causing pressure on the Americans. And the Americans would have had to resort to offering concessions to Pakistan in order to convince them from withdrawing troops on the Western border. They could have avoided Swat and South Waziristan operations. Musharraf tried this and succeeded when his proxy elements attacked the Indian Parliament. To his advantage India had BJP in power then. Man Mohan Singh is much more docile and just did not let anything fall into Pakistan’s game plan. And the attempt backfired on Pakistan, exposing its complicity to the whole thing. It pushed the Americans towards the Indian side more. Basically, through Mumbai attacks, Pakistan shot itself in the foot. It was the starting point of them losing their credibility and becoming known for double dealing and duplicity.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Not sure what the big fuss is all about.

24 terrorists were legitimately killed by Nato forces. These terrorists were the uniformed variety belonging to the PA. Non-uniformed terrorists belonging to the other wings of PA like LeT, etc have killed thousands of innocent civilians in India, Afghanistan.

Pakis have a good sense of humor. Their chest beating over the deaths of 24 terrorists is proof.

About MM Singh being “docile”, not sure if this is accurate. Previous amassing of Indian troops in response to the paki terrorist attack on Indian parliament didn’t work so well. MMS and Indian military knew this.

Best strategy may not be direct retaliation. It often isn’t.

Posted by netizen | Report as abusive
 

Matrix: “I have no problem you celebrating the death of Pakistanis, you can hold celebratory parades for all I care. It reflects your mindset.”

pakis paid, sponsored, launched terrorists all around and were DEEPLY MOURNING when civilian Indians were bombed right and left in buses, trains in India.

And we haven’t discussed paki sponsored terrorists causing deaths of NATO soldiers. Cut off the US Aid, continue drones. Thanks NATO.

Posted by netizen | Report as abusive
 

@s patriot

You missed the point I was not refering to different parties who are fighting each other. I was talking about victims and victims only. Those who suffer and die, regardles of who is at blame.
I was sad about the people who lost their lives on sept 11 and was equaly sad about the sikhs who lost their lives in their holy shrine. I feel sorry for the uk lads as well as the french and Germans who were killed in Afghanistan and equaly i mourn the death of Pashtun Afghans who are loosing their lives in Afghanistan. I am aware that the confrontation +between the Indian orange brigade and the Pashtun jehaadi outfit has not yet occured and I very much hope that it does not, since India like the USA is going to hold Pakistan responsible for it

Rex Minor

Posted by pakistan | Report as abusive
 

007xxx: “This attack clearly shows the bonding of brotherhood in muslim world. Somehow I think Shiites have been more at receiving end of Sunni extremism who in turn claim to be sole owners and brokers of Islam. So much for Islam!”

These people are war mongering in nature. They like to be in some conflict or the other. They find unity only if there is an enemy. In the absence of any enemy, they tend to turn on each other. This need for an external enemy – Zionists, Hindus, infidels, communists, Capitalists and so on. They want to earn a livelihood by milking the countries that want to use their territory as a war zone. There is no interest in building a nation and strive for a prosperous life. When the external enemy is not present, they start fighting each other – Shias, Ahmedias, and ethnic groups. That is all they have from an age old tribal mentality. They pride themselves about plundering other cultures. When that is the mindset, it is not surprising that they are blowing each other up. I am glad Pakistan was created and sent off on its own path. I just do not want their embers falling into our yards. I’d let them burn their house down and fight the fire. This is all they have been doing for centuries – fight, plunder, loot, fight for share of the booty, rest, and go back to fighting again. It is better to leave them engaged in their own internecine wars and feuds so that they can leave the rest of the region alone.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

007xxx: “This attack clearly shows the bonding of brotherhood in muslim world. Somehow I think Shiites have been more at receiving end of Sunni extremism who in turn claim to be sole owners and brokers of Islam. So much for Islam!”

These people are war mongering in nature. They like to be in some conflict or the other. They find unity only if there is an enemy. In the absence of any enemy, they tend to turn on each other. This need for an external enemy – Zionists, Hindus, infidels, communists, Capitalists and so on. They want to earn a livelihood by milking the countries that want to use their territory as a war zone. There is no interest in building a nation and strive for a prosperous life. When the external enemy is not present, they start fighting each other – Shias, Ahmedias, and ethnic groups. That is all they have from an age old tribal mentality. They pride themselves about plundering other cultures. When that is the mindset, it is not surprising that they are blowing each other up. I am glad Pakistan was created and sent off on its own path. I just do not want their embers falling into our yards. I’d let them burn their house down and fight the fire. This is all they have been doing for centuries – fight, plunder, loot, fight for share of the booty, rest, and go back to fighting again. It is better to leave them engaged in their own internecine wars and feuds so that they can leave the rest of the region alone.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

While we are evaluating our merits and demerits, Lashkar e Jangvi, a Pakistan based militant group has taken responsibility for blowing up Shia pilgrims in Kabul.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/dec  /06/55-dead-kabul-suicide-shia

This menace is no longer confined to Pakistan. It has spread into the entire Af-Pak. To me it looks like a calculated move. They will be waiting for retaliation.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Netizen:
“24 terrorists were legitimately killed by Nato forces. These terrorists were the uniformed variety belonging to the PA.”

-You idiot, these 24 young and brave officers and men came under attack by NATO/US forces unprovoked and retaliated with whatever weapons they had. They were martyred and are remembered what they were, brave men. In return Pakistan has kicked the US out of one airbase, pulled out its officers from border coordination centres, suspended NATO supplies and boycotted the Bonn conference. You Indians remain the most coward petty minded crooks I have ever come across.

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

KPSingh:
“While we are evaluating our merits and demerits, Lashkar e Jangvi, a Pakistan based militant group has taken responsibility for blowing up Shia pilgrims in Kabul.”

-Under the present circumstances, any millitant group could pick up the phone and call a news agency claiming responsibility of attack. Who is the authentic source that has claimed that certain millitant group based out of Pakistan has carried out the attack on Shias in Kabul? And FYI it is not even Lashkar e Jhangvi, infact it is claimed by one named ‘Lashkar-e-Jhangvi Al Alami’ or ‘Asian Tigers’ a further splinter group offshoot of LeJ. There will be claims and counter claims, Afghan Taliban have avoided sectarian attacks. So they can be ruled out. Pakistan itself has successfully managed to safeguard all Moharram shia processions and there has been no attacks this year inside Pakistan due to hard work by law enforcement authorities. I think it is Afghanistan governments responsibility to beef up security and ensure such attacks are prevented. Blaming it on Pakistan or any group based out of Pakistan is incorrect. Dont think everything that NYtimes, Fox news, guardian or BBC tells you is true. Reality is much different than what is being reported in mainstream media for public consumption and ignorant folks. Don’t fall for it so easily.

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

Netizen:
“And we haven’t discussed paki sponsored terrorists causing deaths of NATO soldiers. Cut off the US Aid, continue drones. Thanks NATO.”

-Idiot, good news for you is US has been kicked out of one airbase in Pakistan, NATO supplies remain suspended to Afghanistan and it will start to bite after one month. For now the blockade will continue, also Pakistan Army high command in a communiqué to all forces stationed at the border has suspended the chain of command. This gives local commanders full permission to retaliate without any required authorization and if under attack to respond according to the developing tactical scenarios. Lets see if NATO helicopters can agian come near Pakistan Army checkpost equiped with shoulder fire missiles for example. Cut off NATO supplies, continue blockade, Thanks Pakistan Army!

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

Umaripk:”Lets see if NATO helicopters can agian come near Pakistan Army checkpost equiped with shoulder fire missiles for example. Cut off NATO supplies, continue blockade”
Nice to hear that, lets see then how Pakistani establishment deals with NATO or pukes the initial bravado.
Its like “Agar dosti tha..toh usme daraar aagayi, agar dosti hi nahi thee toh is napak mohabbat ka nakhab to utar gaya”.
If there was alliance then fissures have become extensive, if there was only pretension of sorts then atleast the mask is off now.

Posted by sensiblepatriot | Report as abusive
 
 

Umair,
Lots of empty talk and no action make Umair a dull boring
boy :-)

For the nth time:
1. Reject all US aid. i.e stop eating from white man’s hand.
2. Declare war on the US, or at a minimum implement the fantasies you have been blabbering for 3 yrs.

Can’t wait to see.

Posted by netizen | Report as abusive
 

“Pakistan itself has successfully managed to safeguard all Moharram shia processions and there has been no attacks this year inside Pakistan due to hard work by law enforcement authorities. ”
–Umair

lmao, I saw interior minister Rehman Malik on TV, thanking Taliban for not attacking on Moharram, What kind of law enforcement it is ??

Govt. first begs Taliban “Not to attack” and then Thank them on National TV. Haha it happens only in Pakistan.

Posted by punjabiyaar | Report as abusive
 

it is only USA who is pampering terrorism across the world to destablise the regional powers for its hideou objectives. the actions USA is taking are in fact triggering the anti USA sentiments, means america is increasing its enemies in the world. to root out the terrorism from the world we have to focus the root causes of terrorism. we must finance the education, health and social sectors in third world countries.

Posted by ATTIQ-UR-REHMAN | Report as abusive
 

PAK ARMY is the best in the world..BRAVEST,TOUGEST if they can defeat a power like USSR then can NATO AND U.S within few months…US is crying like baby and came to pakistan 4 help….still is crying and always will…

Posted by OUTLANDISH | Report as abusive
 

The natives are out with drum beats, displaying the standard features of ANGST and SCHADENFREUDE! How low a human specie can stoop to?

I would not wish to have them as my neighbours!

Pakistan should send their engineeers to Iran as the Russians and the chinese have done and copy the drone which came down in Iran; a good product for export. I would not be surprised if the kite was brought down by a Pashtun computer hacker?

Rex Minor

Posted by pakistan | Report as abusive
 

PS
I wonder if Pakistan ISI has a special unit made up of electronic experts?

Posted by pakistan | Report as abusive
 

Now this gets to be very interesting:

http://worldnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/201 1/12/10/9352886-pakistan-says-us-drones- in-its-air-space-will-be-shot-down

Let us see who blinks first. I wonder why Pakistan did not tell America to take a hike when Armitage asked Musharraf if Pakistan was with them or against them. At least Pakistan could have kept all the brotherhood on its side instead of getting its rear end getting blown up by home grown militants. Let us see what happens now.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

http://www.ispr.gov.pk/front/main.asp?o= t-press_release&id=1928#pr_link1928

As the US has completely vacated the Shamsi airbase and Pakistan Army has taken control of the base, naturally the next step is to shoot the drones out of the sky. Next is the deployment of air defence weapons along the Afghan border.
http://dailymailnews.com/1211/10/FrontPa ge/index.php?id=1

This is what an airdefence weapon could look like:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anza_%28mis sile%29

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dM9Gbqkh XI

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

Umairpk: “naturally the next step is to shoot the drones out of the sky. Next is the deployment of air defence weapons along the Afghan border.”

The question is this: Why did Pakistan not do this when the US decided to go to war with Taliban in 2001? Pakistan could have refused any cooperation with the US then and switched sides. With all the militant roots inside Pakistan, it was only a matter of time before the war efforts zeroed in on Pakistan itself. The killing of Osama Bin Laden inside Pakistan was the culmination of that build up. In retrospect, one can say that Pakistan is entirely responsible for the deaths of its own citizens and soldiers by allying itself with the US in 2001. It does not take a school kid to foresee what the outcome would be when all the villains sought by the cops are based in Pakistan.

Is Pakistan preparing for a war with the US? Any shooting down of American missiles or planes or soldiers will trigger the next war between Pakistan and the US. The US has realized that it has been fighting shadows in Afghanistan all these years. It will come for the big kill. It probably is zeroing in on the final plan. Is Pakistan really prepared to face it? Saudis will not help Pakistan. They need the US more than they need Pakistan. Chest thumping and bravado will not cut it. Obama’s term is nearing its end and he may not win the next time – unless he is able to rally the American public by triggering a war with Pakistan. Wars always unite people against the national enemies. It will do the same in Pakistan. But in terms of strength and endurance, Pakistan won’t be able to stand up to the US. By now the US knows where all it can strike deep inside Pakistan. It can rattle your country tremendously. Divisive forces inside Pakistan might try to strike a deal with the US and tear it apart from inside. Have your leaders thought of all the consequences? A couple more weeks of NATO oil supply choke can lead to full scale war. Your nukes won’t make a dent on the US.

It is a very interesting time in history. I am glad I get to be a spectator instead of being in the middle of it.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

KP Singh said:

> It is a very interesting time in history. I am glad I get to be a spectator instead of being in the middle of it.

Do you remember during the First Gulf War, Saddam Hussain tried to get the other Arab countries involved on his side by launching Skud missile attacks on Israel?

If the US attacks Pakistan, I somehow don’t think Rawalpindi will be content to let India remain a spectator.

Regards,
Ganesh Prasad

Posted by prasadgc | Report as abusive
 

Ganesh: “If the US attacks Pakistan, I somehow don’t think Rawalpindi will be content to let India remain a spectator.”

Do not worry – we have Man Mohan Singh as our PM. He might retaliate with bouquets across the border.

The US might use any attack on India as further excuse to go after Pakistan’s nukes. An attack on India might work to the advantage of the US. They might even try to provoke something of that sort to get their support. The US might use Indian bases to attack Pakistan. Pakistan will not be able to take on a double US/Indian onslaught. They are better off taking on the US alone without drawing India into the conflict. It would be suicidal for them. India would want to repeat a Bangladesh or two if Pakistan provokes it. And the Americans might go along with it. Pakistani leadership has to think with its head for a change. Bravado will lead to complete self destruction.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Pakistan does not need the missiles to shoot down a drone! Indications are that one of the young Pashtuns IT(hackers) did manage to bring down the drone which landed in Iran?
Iran is most probably going to start their production for sale to other markets in the near future.

A real set back for the USA administration whos new strategy was to control the skies with drones without any boots on the ground! The clintonians have already started the cold war with Russia! The stakes are getting higher and in the mean time India and Pakistan can have the pause.

Rex Minor

Posted by pakistan | Report as abusive
 

All you guys have no concept of international politics and how it works, Way back in march I told you that international alignments are changing but such changes occur slowly and in uneven flow that most people miss it. Let me give you couple of hints:
Drones don’t have much military significance. These are tools to terrorize population. Any military worth their salt could easily shoot them down. It is only high tech in communication system. Chinese could build and deploy in thousands, Don’t worry, be happy that you are not part of target population.
The real problem for NATO is logistics and by shutting down the supply routes it has handed Russia hang man’s noose. There is about six week window for them to put NATO in its place. Wait and see.

Posted by Matrixx | Report as abusive
 

Matrixx: “The real problem for NATO is logistics and by shutting down the supply routes it has handed Russia hang man’s noose. There is about six week window for them to put NATO in its place. Wait and see.”

Americans have been too nice to Pakistan and had turned a blind eye to all its nefarious activities until 9/11 happened. Until then the US did not care if Pakistan was setting fire to its neighborhood. After 9/11, it has been a slow and steady degradation in the relationship – Kerry Lugar bill, shutting down all terrorist missions inside Indian held Kashmir, Swat and South Waziritisan and so on. Pakistan had been forced to do things it did not want to. Frustration has been growing and it turned rapid after the US deeply embarrassed Pakistan by exposing its duplicity and double dealing through the smooth operation that killed Bin Laden inside a Pakistani guest house. Pakistan has been itching to show its frustration openly for a while and the killing of 24 soldiers by NATO. I am sure the US has more alternatives for its supplies (which will cost more), but then they do not have to rely on Pakistan. If the US demonstrates that, they can afford to punish Pakistan. The US knows clearly now that its mission in Afghanistan was entirely derailed by Pakistan. They assumed that Pakistan will fall in place on its own as a long term ally. But they now the truth now. Just to demonstrate to Pakistan that they can do as they please, they might knock out yet another Jihad head inside Pakistan soon. This is probably Mullah Omar or Jawahiri or Haqqani. These guys must be shivering inside the ISI’s secret guest house. If I have to choose one amongst these three, my choice would be Haqqani. That is all we are waiting for next. One target at a time. Pak military is going to stand with its trousers down to the ankles as the Americans take out the elements.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

@KPS
Your fixation on Pakistan and Pushtuns is unhealthy. War on terror is fake and you can stay in that mode.

You will soon find out that there was no Osama in Abbotabad unless Obama dishes out a few billion bucks to buy the Commission’s report.

Atleast, you should appreciate that there is never a dull moment in Pakistan to keep your hate genes dancing. I wonder what you do in your homeland for fun?

Posted by Matrixx | Report as abusive
 

War on Terror is in fact war between intel agencies of various countries including India. Mukti Bhini and Tamil Tigers did not grow on trees. Study what happened in Libya, where Islamic terrorists were fully supported by NATO do gooders. What do you have to say about that?

Posted by Matrixx | Report as abusive
 

American are spending billions on war efforts and too little for the welfare of Afghans and President Hamid Karzai should be ashamed that there are millions of refugees still living in Pakistan & Iran yet he never stops blamming Pakistan.

Fact is that President Hamid Karzai and American contractors attached to military or commercial undertakings in Afghanistan are making millions so why should they try to make peace?

India-Russia defence pacts and hardware sales and deep deep relations need to be carefully examined by Americans, I think India is trapping Americans in to a position similar to USSR defeat. Sweet revenge by old comrades !!!

Posted by Facetruth | Report as abusive
 

@Matrix
You are addressing a zombie, whose soul left him when his ancestors shrine came under attack from the Indian lady! A sad story of a person who according to his own post would prefer to live in his ancestoral home but was forced to move over to cold Canada.
He knows bugger all about either Pashtuns or Pakistan but continualy believes along with his compatriots that they could be cowed down by the powerful America.

No super power can retain its status on weak economy and I phones and I pads or dron technologies. The USA state dept. has by design or incompetence have got themselves involved in cold war with the Russians as well as the chinese. Pakistan military strategist are apparently aware of this development and are likely to harden their position with USA.
The pack of cards must be remixed in 2012?

Rex Minor

Posted by pakistan | Report as abusive
 

Matrixx said:

> The real problem for NATO is logistics and by shutting down the supply routes it has handed Russia hang man’s noose. There is about six week window for them to put NATO in its place. Wait and see.

Can Pakistanis think beyond six weeks? Is strategic myopia pervasive in your general population and not just a sign of “military intelligence”?

Let’s say your fondest dreams come true and the US is forced into a humiliating withdrawal from Afghanistan. What happens to Pakistan thereafter, eh?

Pakistan and China will join hands and rule over everybody from Central Asia down to the South China Sea, right?

Wake-ey, wake-ey.

1. What is the incentive for the US to continue to aid Pakistan in any way once they are out of the region? Yes, Pakistani bravado says “please stop your aid”, but what will happen when it really does stop?

2. Remember that all other sources of funding (e.g., IMF) are influenced by the US and can be shut off with a nod. The US is a vindictive power and will not forgive what it sees as treachery by a putative ally resulting in its humiliation. Saudi Arabia will not defy the US to support Pakistan. The screws will begin to tighten from all directions.

3. Everyone knows what happened to the Iranian armed forces once the US umbilical cord was cut. How long will Pakistan’s F-16s and P-3C Orions keep flying? Does Pakistan manufacture spare parts indigenously? Do you seriously think the JF-17s will simply take their place?

4. How long will the Pakistani state remain solvent once US and related aid dries up? The state is already bankrupt, and the situation will just get formalised when lenders back out.

Perhaps that’s the reason for the recent support in Pakistan for trade normalisation with India. Suddenly, the Pakistanis have discovered a long-lost brother living right next door! Imagine that!

In sum, I agree with you that things don’t look good at all for the US in Afghanistan. But once the inevitable US withdrawal from the region is complete, things start to look really bad for Pakistan. 2011 will seem like a wonderful year in retrospect, by the end of 2012.

Think about that a little before gloating.

Regards,
Ganesh Prasad

Posted by prasadgc | Report as abusive
 

KP Singh said:

> we have Man Mohan Singh as our PM. He might retaliate with bouquets across the border.

No offence, KP, but after IK Gujral’s winding down of RAW’s presence and MMS’s willingness to sell off the store, I have begun to believe that Punjabis should never be allowed to become PM of India. Their brotherly sentiment (which goes unreciprocated) does India a huge disfavour.

I wonder if Pakistan’s leaders (civilian and military) realise that they only have until 2014 to square things with India. Once the old man goes at the end of his term, India will almost certainly become more hawkish and assertive, and Pakistanis will realise what it means to have all the nasty things they say about India’s intentions and actions actually come true.

Regards,
Ganesh Prasad

Posted by prasadgc | Report as abusive
 

Matrixx: “Your fixation on Pakistan and Pushtuns is unhealthy. War on terror is fake and you can stay in that mode”

If war on terror is fake how did your country become an ally in it, that too on the fore front? That was the proud claims your leaders were making when the going was good.

“You will soon find out that there was no Osama in Abbotabad unless Obama dishes out a few billion bucks to buy the Commission’s report.”

Yeah right! 9/11 never happened. Holocaust is a fabrication. No one landed on the moon. What else is making circles in Pakistan?

“Atleast, you should appreciate that there is never a dull moment in Pakistan to keep your hate genes dancing. I wonder what you do in your homeland for fun?”

We honestly do not care what happens in Pakistan. The only thing that keeps us engaged is due to the volatile nature of the Af-Pak region. Unfortunately we are sitting right next to it. Therefore we have to watch each and every event that unfolds in this place. I no longer see Pakistan as a separate issue. To me both Afghanistan and Pakistan have the same destiny. They are inseparable twins in terms of their final fate.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Ganesh: “No offence, KP, but after IK Gujral’s winding down of RAW’s presence and MMS’s willingness to sell off the store, I have begun to believe that Punjabis should never be allowed to become PM of India. Their brotherly sentiment (which goes unreciprocated) does India a huge disfavour.”

It is not just Punjabis. Any leader other than the Indira Gandhi clan has been a milder Prime Minister in comparison. I do agree that IK Gujral went a little over board. MMS is an academic in nature. He does not have leadership skills. He cannot make decisions. He takes orders. Looking forward, I think we should move away from staging clandestine proxy wars with others. India’s engagement in Sri Lanka was a disaster. Let the bad guys resort to it. All we have to do is to make counter measures more effective by relying on technology. In this regard, India should work with the US, Russia and European powers to develop a really smart system to contain and decimate those who make criminal plans to gain through destabilizing others.

“I wonder if Pakistan’s leaders (civilian and military) realise that they only have until 2014 to square things with India. Once the old man goes at the end of his term, India will almost certainly become more hawkish and assertive, and Pakistanis will realise what it means to have all the nasty things they say about India’s intentions and actions actually come true.”

That is a scary thought. Someone like Advani does not think much and acts on impulse.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

“A sad story of a person who according to his own post would prefer to live in his ancestoral home but was forced to move over to cold Canada.”

I really did not want to respond to this. But let me clarify. I visit Canada often because I have relatives there and have business interests. I came back home when India won the cricket world cup. I am getting ready to go to Kenya soon. I do not intend sharing personal info beyond this.

Why this Kolaveri, Kolaveri Ji? :-)

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

GAnesh:”I wonder if Pakistan’s leaders (civilian and military) realise that they only have until 2014 to square things with India”.
They have until 2014 unless there was ever an intention!
http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/most-f avoured-nation-status-for-india-by-octob er-2012-pakistan-156539

By postponing the granting of MFN status to India(even if it was a symbolic move), the Pakistani leadership has missed an oppurtunity to move ahead after the initial thaw in the relations.

Sadly after a slew of incidents related to national security occured, the civilian establishment which took most of the fault for failure to manage the relations with America got undermined, rather than the security forces that should have taken the heat.

After the initial brave attempts by the Prime Minister Manmohan singh, the movement in the direction for better relations stopped dead in its tracks after the domestic governement in India was besieged by corruption scandals, mismanagement of economy, policy paralysis and political pigheadedness. The Government is now largely seen to be cutting its own feet and moving into a oblivion with a feeling of acrimony from the larger civilian population. The PM is largely seen to be on his way to exit the political scene and make way for others.

It will only be a miracle if the civilian government in pakistan finds its nerve to assert its leadership and Government in India finds a reciprocity on the other side. Manmohan singh would surely have gone an extra mile in order to bring both nations closer as he may be weak Prime Minister but his intentions were good. It is also beginning of the end of political structure with two power centres coming to naught. while few may appreciate his benevolence but few more will sigh a relief since this man was only seen as lacking both political authority and realpolitik.

Ganesh:”How long will the Pakistani state remain solvent once US and related aid dries up? The state is already bankrupt, and the situation will just get formalised when lenders back out.”
It seems to me that Pakistan is slowly abandoning the concept of modern democratic state with exclusive powers to the civilian leadership, Something tells me that Pakistan is falling into the periods of early 90′s when Benazir Bhutto and Nawaz sharif were leading the country in tandom (after zia’s dealth)but the Army was holding the real power.

After the sudden exit of Musharraf from the political scene due to popular protests few years ago, the liberals of Pakistan in their over enthusiasm had written down Pakistan’s Army only to reconcile to the fact that security forces still weild enoromous clout in the country. What we saw in the event after Musharraf ‘s exit was the timid but very primitive attempts by the civilian leadership to hold Army accountable for its actions. Remember When it tried to bring ISI under the interior ministry (Home ministry) and its attempts to send the ISI chief to India shortly after Mumbai attacks.
Or even its attempts to break the logjam after few years of frozen relationship.
The civilians who thought they could tame the Army are slowly receding to the background and relinquishing whatever control they had back to the Armed forces.
déjà vu 1989.

A week is long in International diplomacy too.

Posted by sensiblepatriot | Report as abusive
 

Ganesh:
“1. What is the incentive for the US to continue to aid Pakistan in any way once they are out of the region? Yes, Pakistani bravado says “please stop your aid”, but what will happen when it really does stop?

2. Remember that all other sources of funding (e.g., IMF) are influenced by the US and can be shut off with a nod. The US is a vindictive power and will not forgive what it sees as treachery by a putative ally resulting in its humiliation. Saudi Arabia will not defy the US to support Pakistan. The screws will begin to tighten from all directions.

3. Everyone knows what happened to the Iranian armed forces once the US umbilical cord was cut. How long will Pakistan’s F-16s and P-3C Orions keep flying? Does Pakistan manufacture spare parts indigenously? Do you seriously think the JF-17s will simply take their place?

4. How long will the Pakistani state remain solvent once US and related aid dries up? The state is already bankrupt, and the situation will just get formalised when lenders back out.”

-This is all a farce, euro is collapsing, standard and poor has downgraded US AAA credit rating. Pakistan is a huge country with a huge gas and copper reserves, agricultural lands, tourism development, transit trade, ports, transportation hubs, oil and gas pipelines and good human resource. Pakistan can and will survive without US aid, infact I feel policymakers want to break with US aid where it acts as a spur and pushes the country towards creating sustainable economy. What will happen when aid dries up? NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL. Trust me , really let the aid dry up. Best thing ever to happen.
Talking about IMF? well the way ECB is scrambling to save greece from default, and now entire eurozone is at a breaking point, i think Pakistan can take care of itself. Thanks for showing concern though!
ok, so now F-16s. A couple of squadrons yes, but Swedish AWACS, IL-76 oil tankers from Ukraine, JF-17s from China, already the Air Force is less reliant on American technology which is no doubt superior, but not without expensive service contracts and threat of lack of spares. So PAF could do without spares for F-16s still maintain its strength.
Lastly, How long will Pakistan remain solvent???? TRUST ME, atleast Pakistan will outlast Greek default. And lets see when for example the euro collapses, and Italy, spain and Portugal go bankrupt or the ECB fail to take decisive measures, lets see how it jolts the world financial markets. Ganesh, really you have much more to worry about. Pakistan is not your problem, leave it to Pakistanis to fix.
I leave you with this, just remember this guy might well be the Prime minister of Pakistan in future and millions out here may vote for him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9IP3ELpR pI

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

KPSingh:
“A couple more weeks of NATO oil supply choke can lead to full scale war.”
-So in other words NATO will invade a 180 million strong, nuclear armed nation??? Will it be a cake walk like Libya??? With Russia already angry over US missile defense in Europe, it will not give a free supply route over its territory. Let the supply lines choke and see what happens.

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

Umairpk: “So in other words NATO will invade a 180 million strong, nuclear armed nation???”

You need to learn to differentiate between a population number and a real strength. Your military is not made up of 180 million soldiers. If there is a war, it is going to be between your military and another one. You have non-state actors as well. But they do not make up the rest of the population. Mostly people are sheep and would go and hide when missiles fly overhead and blow buildings up. So chest thumping using a number that sounds formidable is a useless tactic.

Nukes – are they of any use against the US? Pakistan’s nukes cannot touch the US or its military forces. You kill one American and they can unleash their entire fury at you. Look at the pounding Taliban got in 2001. Some of them ran into Pakistan and have been sitting in toilets even now. So your nukes have no effect on the US either.

If a war erupts between the US and Pakistan, it won’t comprise of weapons and soldiers alone. US will fight war on many fronts – propaganda, economic crippling, triggering internal violence and chaos. These kinds of tactics was taught by the CIA to the ISI and Pakistan used it effectively against India for sometime. But the US can take it to the very end.

The only thing in Pakistan’s favor might be that the US might not want Pakistan to turn into another Sunni based Iran.

You do not want to stand up to the US. Musharraf knew it in 2001 and threw in the towel without a thought. At that time Pakistan was a hundred times stronger than it is today on all aspects. All you have to stand up for Pakistan is Zaid Hamid who can taunt and thump his chest until the first missile flies over. Then he’d run and hide under the drainage until the war gets over. Your region is also historically famous for switching sides and surrendering to anyone gaining ground. That is how your region has survived and that is the main reason for the deep rooted cultural malaise of double dealing and deceit. It is an art that has reached its perfection over many centuries of having to deal with invading armies who plundered your region first. If a war really breaks out, one might see long lines of soldiers standing in lines with their hands over their heads. I saw quite a bit of it in Iraq and Saddam Huessein’s army was driven out of Kuwait. Your nukes might not matter if it is the US that you will be dealing with. Being brave alone won’t cut it. You need money and resources to go with it. At this time, you do not have it.

“Will it be a cake walk like Libya???”

Libya had a civil war where its own citizens took out a dictator from within. The US did nothing. NATO bombed and weakened Gadaffi so that the rebels could defeat him. This situation can be created in Pakistan – trigger civil war and bomb the unfavorable sides if they show any gain. That might be the kind of war the US might be working on right now. Direct confrontation results in too much loss and lack of results. They learned this in Afghanistan. So when coming to Pakistan, they might take your suggestion about Libya and might unleash civil strife from within. That weakens any system very quickly. Your nukes will still be safe and no one will find a need for them.

“With Russia already angry over US missile defense in Europe, it will not give a free supply route over its territory. Let the supply lines choke and see what happens.”

Russia also wants Pakistan ripped apart. This is because Pakistan was responsible for their defeat in Afghanistan. And they do remember the menace in Chechnya and Dagestan. If the Americans leave, the ghosts will come back to haunt them again. So they might try to let the American go at it and take the benefits.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Umair: “Pakistan is a huge country with a huge gas and copper reserves, agricultural lands, tourism development, transit trade, ports, transportation hubs, oil and gas pipelines and good human resource. Pakistan can and will survive without US aid, infact I feel policymakers want to break with US aid where it acts as a spur and pushes the country towards creating sustainable economy. What will happen when aid dries up? NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL. Trust me , really let the aid dry up. Best thing ever to happen.”

Pakistan had all this for the past 64 years. Tell me why its economic indicators are pointing towards the drain. Pakistan needs to do business with other countries to export its resources and products and get businesses to set up shop so that employment can increase. In today’s scenario no one would want to venture into Pakistan or do business with it. If Americans leave, that will be the first throttle they will close tight. Pakistan will be declared into a terrorist state (trust me, Americans still have the clout to do it) and they will subject your country to severe economic sanctions. The outside world may not want to mess with Pakistan, but Pakistan needs the outside world a lot more. Islamic countries will pay a lip service and go along with the Americans. If you cozy up with Iran, they will trigger Shia-Sunni violence to keep you apart. Bravado does not offer practical solutions. It is time to throw in the towel and submit. At least you will get to rebuild your country.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Umair: “Pakistan is not your problem, leave it to Pakistanis to fix.”

Outside of Pakistan, everyone knows that Pakistan has become everyone’s problem. And they are thinking of ways to fix it since Pakistanis have done nothing to fix themselves.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

Umair: “just remember this guy might well be the Prime minister of Pakistan in future and millions out here may vote for him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9IP3ELpR

I hope Imran succeeds. But will the elements inside your country let him survive? He definitely is a great leader. Shah Mohammad Qureshi jumped ship and switched to his camp seeing the trend. Soon the others in PPP and Nawaz Sharif’s party will see which side the wind is blowing and jump ship as well. Then Imran will be surrounded by the same set of clowns he set about throwing out in the first place. He may not be able to walk due to the sheer weight of those opportunistic politicians you guys loathe. That is politics. And I am too familiar with it in India. Just being a clean leader is not enough. One has to start on a clean slate. If I were Imran, I would have told Shah Mohammad Qureshi to start sticking posters for the party and work his way up the ranks for the next ten or twenty years. That will send a message to all other opportunists. Otherwise, Imran will be snowballed out by the same crowd of politicians and he will disappear into that completely. I am speaking from experience on my side of the border. I still hope he succeeds.

Posted by KPSingh01 | Report as abusive
 

KPSingh:
First, please do not scare me from the US, our lions have been unleashed. Gen. Kayani in a communique has ordered the troops to retaliate with full force if they come under fire from the US forces. Trust me, I have military blood in my viens, if they really mess with us, they will regret. It will be a fight they had not fought in their history, not Vietnam, not Iraq not Afghanistan. For now lets see if the US can even fix its economy. I wish them well, no enmity, be happy, go home from Afghanistan, we all need peace.
About Russia, it surely is a different issue, your geopolitical analysis is absolutely crap I must say. Tha land of Tzars is mired in its own internal struggle, it recently joined the WTO, its ‘reset’ of relations with US not working, angry over US missile defense plans, wary of NATO, with Putin trying to stage a comeback, but oligarchs challenging, Russia has much more on its plate. And really, Russian businessmen will flock to Pakistan for oil and gas projects. So this notion of old Soviet-Afghan war is gone, the Soviet sun has set long time ago, the new Russia is open for business.
And we certainly will stand up to the US, why are you scared, we will handle them, you sit tight and just watch. We are a nuclear power and know how to take care of ourselves.
On Imran Khan, well he is a Pakistani politician. But remember he was a cricket captain and one of the best all-time all rounders. Do not be judgemental on ‘kaptaan’ as he is known affectionately. He knows better how to play the game, like he famously dubbed Pakistan as ‘cornered tigers’ in 1992 world cup and eventually won it. Who knows? cornered tigers can be the most dangerous. Maybe NATO must be a little more cautious.
Lastly bro, really you take a chill pill. Everything will be ok, I see u worry about Pakistan too much.

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

KPSingh:
“Outside of Pakistan, everyone knows that Pakistan has become everyone’s problem. And they are thinking of ways to fix it since Pakistanis have done nothing to fix themselves.”

-Oh really? In which world do you live? Last I checked it is Sarkozy and Merkel scrambling for the last 6 months to save greeks from default and eventual collapse of the euro. Or the S&P downgrading credit ratings of AAA economies. Yes, Pakistan too is sometimes making news here and there because it is a nation of 180 million Muslims and a nuclear power. Its long-term strategic importance and stability matters to the world and it is important in its own ways. Let others fix their own mess first before they would fix anyone else, let alone Pakistan. Rest all, let it be, who cares who becomes a problem for whom. If everyone should mind their own business, do not poke their nose in anyone else’s affairs a lot of problems in the worlds get sorted out themselves automatically. Take for example Afghanistan, western projecting of shoving diplomacy down the throats of ethnic tribal people living by the law of gun. It never worked, it never will, better yet cut and run, face save. Infact herin lies the solution, in Bonn conference Pakistan was absent, and everyone acknowledged without Pakistan’s help, there is no solution to Afhhanistan. Pakistan, my friend, is part of solution NOT problem as you mentioned. Catch on some sleep, I will help you to get your ‘geopolitical analysis’ back on track.

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

KPSingh:
“Bravado does not offer practical solutions. It is time to throw in the towel and submit. At least you will get to rebuild your country.”

-Problem is, for the generation born after 1971, unwilling to be scared into submission, we Pakistanis only know we never loose, we do what we decide to do with a lot of passion. Your business acumen, just like ur geopolitical analysis is crap as it is. I think if there is money to be made, everyone will come to the party. And sanctions??? Years of sanctions did not do anything to Iran, declaring terrorist state? by those who are biggest perpetrators of war crimes, extraordinary rendition programs operating black sites across the world and gaining confession through most inhumane torture. Terrorists declaring others as terrorists???? what a joke. Even today many chinese firms operate in Pakistan, the US has lost much of its clout. It is challenged at many fronts, it can no more push around Pakistan. Ten years back it might have been different, decades of pointless wars has weakened it internally. Now is the time, if better sense prevail still there is time to fix things for them. u till me the figures? what is the external debt of the US? the balance of payments? exports? GDP? BRIC factor? Rising China? unemployment rate? avg. mortgage payments??? Talking of a sinking ship threatning others. huh

Only thing i agree with u is Imran Khan elements inside the country let him survive? Well, he has clearly stated he will serve the country in a true leadership role. He has the leadership potential and knows how to navigate Pakistani politics. So here too, you remain assured, all is well. I think now u can have a good night’s sleep.

Posted by Umairpk | Report as abusive
 

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